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05/18/2004 03:39:44 PM · #1
It looks like I'm saving up money to get a better camera. I have plenty of time by the way! But I know nothing about lenses. Can anyone give a short tutorial about what all the numbers mean in an lens? For example I've been looking at the Nikkor AF 12-24 f4, but I don't know what the 12-24 stands for. I do know what the f4 stands for, but I don't know how it relates to the lens--does the lens's aperture override the camera's? Etc. etc.

Any help?

Message edited by author 2004-05-18 15:40:14.
05/18/2004 03:43:36 PM · #2
I would recommend going to half price books or someplace similar and buying an intro to photography book. Most of the ones I have seen explain all about lenses in a very strait-forward manner. It will probably cost $10 or less and it will have more information that I am guessing people will want to type here.

Greg
05/18/2004 03:46:18 PM · #3
the 12-24 is the focal lengths of the lense ( 12-24mm ). its a wider angle zoom lense, and depending on which dslr you plan on purchasing the equivelent focal length may be more like 19-38mm ie: on my rebel.

the aperture figure is the widest the lense will open, and has nothing to do with the camera. the lower the f# rating, the faster the lense is considered. you can shoot with less light with a faster lense.

on that lense - depending on what it costs - the extremes of the aperture settings, may or may not signifacantly result in less than desireable sharpness.

hmm.. any other questions?
kirbic could write a book on the subject i think ;}


05/18/2004 03:50:07 PM · #4
if you're looking into resonably priced dslr's i would look at the nikon d70, and canon 10d. the more i use the rebel the more i wish i had saved for the 10d. i dont think the nikon has the same type of limited features as the rebel. although i am content with the rebel, now and then i wish i could do some of the things the 10d can.

and i have equal respect for both nikon and canon.


05/18/2004 03:57:47 PM · #5
David, I'm in the same boat as you and have recently read a book that gives the low-down about lenses in a very straight forward manner for photographers. I highly recommend it. While it doesn't go into specific lenses by the different manufacterers, it explains all of the principles and how they work and how to use them.

Photographic Lenses: Photographer's Guide to Characteristics, Quality, Use and Design by Ernst Wildi

05/18/2004 03:59:15 PM · #6
Originally posted by dsidwell:

It looks like I'm saving up money to get a better camera. I have plenty of time by the way! But I know nothing about lenses. Can anyone give a short tutorial about what all the numbers mean in an lens? For example I've been looking at the Nikkor AF 12-24 f4, but I don't know what the 12-24 stands for. I do know what the f4 stands for, but I don't know how it relates to the lens--does the lens's aperture override the camera's? Etc. etc.

Any help?


16 ribbon!!! new camera??? :O)
05/18/2004 05:11:03 PM · #7
Originally posted by dsidwell:

It looks like I'm saving up money to get a better camera. I have plenty of time by the way! But I know nothing about lenses. Can anyone give a short tutorial about what all the numbers mean in an lens? For example I've been looking at the Nikkor AF 12-24 f4, but I don't know what the 12-24 stands for. I do know what the f4 stands for, but I don't know how it relates to the lens--does the lens's aperture override the camera's? Etc. etc.

Any help?


Wow, as eiki said. 16 ribbons and four of them blue. You will be dangerous with a better camera after you had understood what all those numbers stand for. Or you will loose your touch!

At least it is clear to me now that you don't have to know about all those technical details (millimeters, aperture and stuff) to make great fotos!
05/18/2004 05:50:32 PM · #8
Very helpful, Soup and others!

I'm looking at several cameras, but several of my photo phriends suggested the Fuji S2 Pro, or its newest sister, the S3 pro. Who knows? It'll be a while yet, but I'm starting my research (dreaming) early.
05/18/2004 05:53:29 PM · #9
Canon (Beginner) Lens Info and More is here.
Good stuff here also, Lots of terminology.

I am "in transition" right now also. Research, research, research. Now if I could just get my hands on a D70 (none in the physical stores to test). 10D Mk II ?? I hope that is coming.

Message edited by author 2004-05-18 18:00:05.
05/18/2004 06:06:06 PM · #10
well i would find a suitable camera, based on what is available for lenses, and accesories for it. if the lenses available don't suit your needs there is no sense buying the camera.

by the looks of your photos, i would consider a bundle with a 35mm slr which would use the same lenses as the dslr.

if i didnt have an older 35mm slr - thats what i would have done.


05/18/2004 07:16:41 PM · #11
David,

Have been a fan of yours for awhile. We mailed briefly regarding an opportunity to shoot the sandstones and I intend to take you up on your offer. Just don't know when. The recent event in Texas at Fosil Rim was magnificent. I look forward to a similar excursion your way. Couldn't make the last one.

That said, the S3 is more camera than I could ever hope to own. If that is on your list AND you have the time to save funds for it, then my research would stop right there. I am very happy with the D70, but my dream body is the S3.

Lenses......focal length and aperature are the primary numbers evaluated by knowledgeable consumers. Auto focus, manual focus, glass elements, filter size, image stabilization and motor noise are other items considered. Before Fosil Rim, I acquired my first "pro grade" lense. Nikkor 17-35 f/2.8 and it rocks. But it retails for almost 2x the price of the D70. One lense.

Lenses are the tools that you use to capture the subjects that you want. Your ribbons are testament to your "eye". Your understanding of what an "engaging" photograph is. Your choice to expand your "tool chest" and the choices of "tools" will greatly depend on what subjects you want to prepare for. Some fotog's choose to "tool up" with primes (single focal length fast lenses) like sf50mm f/1.4, or a sf14mm f/2.8, or a sf600mm f/4. Others choose a combination of primes and zooms while others use only zooms. It all depends on what subjects you are wanting to capture.

I do not know of any book that has influenced or taught me more about photography than the National Geographic Feild Guide, ISBN 0-7922-5676-X by Peter Burian and Robert Caputo. The basics are covered, the strategy is covered, but most helpful was the array of NG fotog's who spoke about their systems and why they had the "tools" that they had.

Fast lenses are expensive but give the most lattitude to the photographer. An S3 deserves great glass.

Flash
05/18/2004 09:26:32 PM · #12
Dang, my post didn't go.

Canon EF 75-300mm f4-5.6
75-300mm is the limits of the telephoto, as you probly know.
f4 is the largest aperture at 75mm.
f5.6 is the largest at 300mm.

There are lens systems such as AE, FD, EF, and Nikkor - all of which are different and don't fit each other. Third parties such as Sigma, Tamron and Quantaray make lenses that fit one or the other (but you have to check the mount so as not to get the wrong ones).

M
05/18/2004 10:17:36 PM · #13
So are the mm the millimeters between the lens positions? A 75-300mm lens's actual glass would move from 75 mm (relative to?) to 300 mm? Hmmm. I would then wonder about how mm translated into feet or metres.

I can see that a large aperture may be highly desirable, since it would make the lens more flexible, perhaps.

This is being very helpful! Thanks for all of your posts so far!
05/18/2004 10:21:38 PM · #14
Right, kinda like optical zoom for p'n's cams. Mine is an 8x optical zoom. It's basically 35mm x 8 for the zoom. It goes from 35-280mm. I think yours is 6x optical? So if it starts at 35, it would be a 35-210mm as a lens. Probably even lists the apertures on it, too.

Translated into feet or meters? For what? Distances? A 300mm lens is basically 9x zoom.

M
05/18/2004 10:51:40 PM · #15
I'm researching too..
And boy am I confused!!!

I'm going to be doing shots (hopefully) that will go on covers of paperbacks.

Here's and example. white picket fence, large dog behind fence and vine covered cottage in background, that needs to have some focus. About 15 feet away. THe dog and fence need to be clear.

What lense would YOU use for that?

The photoshopper in me says take two shots one of the cottage, and one of the dog/fence. but that would be cheating. :}
05/18/2004 11:00:05 PM · #16
Originally posted by dsidwell:

So are the mm the millimeters between the lens positions? A 75-300mm lens's actual glass would move from 75 mm (relative to?) to 300 mm? Hmmm. I would then wonder about how mm translated into feet or metres.

I can see that a large aperture may be highly desirable, since it would make the lens more flexible, perhaps.

This is being very helpful! Thanks for all of your posts so far!

Roughly 600 mm is about 18 X zoom.
17 mm lens on Rebel is about 27 mm which is wider than human can see with both eyes.
Before buying any lens check the score card here and if is not 4.00 and more don't waste your money .. Lens test

Or here
05/18/2004 11:16:54 PM · #17
Originally posted by JC_Homola:

Here's and example. white picket fence, large dog behind fence and vine covered cottage in background, that needs to have some focus. About 15 feet away. THe dog and fence need to be clear.

What lense would YOU use for that?

The photoshopper in me says take two shots one of the cottage, and one of the dog/fence. but that would be cheating. :}


Canon EF 100mm f1.8.

With an f1.8, almost the whole picture would be in focus. You could always focus on infinity and recompose your shot in manual exposure mode. Also, the 100mm fixed is a fairly sharp, nice lens.

M
05/18/2004 11:18:43 PM · #18
Some desirable lenses for Canon and prices:

Canon EF 4.0 17-40mm USM L 3.78 (3) = very-good $650
Canon EF 2.8 70-200mm USM L 4.07 (3) = very-good $1200
Canon EF 4.0 70-200mm USM L 4.17 (3) = very-good $ 560
Canon EF 1.8 50mm II 3.91 (3) = very-good $70
Sigma AF 2.8 105mm macro EX 4.42 (5) = excellent $410
Canon EF 2.8 200mm USM L II 4.40 (4) = excellent $630
Canon EF 2.8 24-70mm USM L 4.16 (3) = very-good $ Arm + Leg
05/18/2004 11:19:32 PM · #19
Originally posted by mavrik:

Originally posted by JC_Homola:

Here's and example. white picket fence, large dog behind fence and vine covered cottage in background, that needs to have some focus. About 15 feet away. THe dog and fence need to be clear.

What lense would YOU use for that?

The photoshopper in me says take two shots one of the cottage, and one of the dog/fence. but that would be cheating. :}


Canon EF 100mm f1.8.

With an f1.8, almost the whole picture would be in focus. You could always focus on infinity and recompose your shot in manual exposure mode. Also, the 100mm fixed is a fairly sharp, nice lens.

M

Wrong ! f1.8 is very shallow DOF

Message edited by author 2004-05-18 23:20:06.
05/18/2004 11:25:08 PM · #20
Whoops, my bad. Well, the same lens then on f11. lol

M
05/19/2004 09:23:10 AM · #21
Originally posted by mavrik:

Whoops, my bad. Well, the same lens then on f11. lol

M


THanks mavrik... I knew what you meant... why do our fingers not just automatically type what we mean??? ;]
05/19/2004 09:45:32 AM · #22
Originally posted by eirasi:

Originally posted by dsidwell:

It looks like I'm saving up money to get a better camera. I have plenty of time by the way! But I know nothing about lenses. Can anyone give a short tutorial about what all the numbers mean in an lens? For example I've been looking at the Nikkor AF 12-24 f4, but I don't know what the 12-24 stands for. I do know what the f4 stands for, but I don't know how it relates to the lens--does the lens's aperture override the camera's? Etc. etc.

Any help?


Wow, as eiki said. 16 ribbons and four of them blue. You will be dangerous with a better camera after you had understood what all those numbers stand for. Or you will loose your touch!

At least it is clear to me now that you don't have to know about all those technical details (millimeters, aperture and stuff) to make great fotos!


You might want to try to sell your F707 to one of those people who thinks that it is the camera that makes the great pictures. Should have a high resale value with 16 ribbons. LOL
05/19/2004 09:53:46 AM · #23
Originally posted by dsidwell:

It looks like I'm saving up money to get a better camera. I have plenty of time by the way! But I know nothing about lenses. Can anyone give a short tutorial about what all the numbers mean in an lens? For example I've been looking at the Nikkor AF 12-24 f4, but I don't know what the 12-24 stands for. I do know what the f4 stands for, but I don't know how it relates to the lens--does the lens's aperture override the camera's? Etc. etc.

Any help?


Since I was considering a D70 and therefore lenses, I sympathise with you. It is so hard to find good info on lenses. Once you know the meaning of the numbers, the next thing is to find out about the quality of the glass, the quality of the autofocus, the build quality, decide with focal ranges would fit best together, etc . etc. Good to take some time for that.

Note that on dpreview.com there are special forums about SLR lenses and if you search there you will find some good references as well. But still it is difficult to get an overview.

05/19/2004 08:04:18 PM · #24

i would keep the 707 until you learn how to use the new one personally.
at least you wouln'dt wind up with nothing but frustration during that period.

you want to buy a usefull range of lenses, and IMO - pitasmans is a bit excessive for hobby type use. i own the
canon efs 18-55mm f:3.5-5.6 which came with the camera, mediocre
canon ef 75-300mm f:4-5.6 - $200 - and again mediocre.

both however are usefull, and give me a decent focal range to work with - from wide to a fair amount of zoom. my next purchase will be the canon ef 50mm f:1.8 - cheap - but high quality from what i know, and usefull indoors -w/o a flash.

some of the less expensive lenses, when used at their extreme apertures have some undesireable side effects because of the glass quality. but if you knwo them, and keep them in mind - you can still compete with the higher priced lenses.

if i could travel with only a couple cheap lenses i am happy.
and have less to worry about...


05/19/2004 10:12:21 PM · #25
This is the site that I use for my lense advice.

www.naturfotograf.com

On the left side of the home page is a film strip of items, choose lenses, and you will open this fotog's review and ratings of every Nikkor made. If you have a camera that accepts Nikkor mounts, then you may find this information helpful. I certainly have.

Flash
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