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03/11/2009 05:35:10 PM · #126
As I mentioned before I am starting a large fine art photo project to capture The Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument. That is why I will be in the area for the Red Rock GTG.

This is a bit beyond the scope of the GTG but today I purchased all the maps I need and one book to help with the project. Anyone interested in photography in southern Utah will find some of this information useful so I am passing it on to the group. As a caveat I must mention that all this information pertains to Utah only and that many of the places mentioned here for the GTG are on the Arizona side of the border, so this won't help with that.

Utah BLM Quad Maps
They are 1:100,000 detailed quad maps that cost $4 each and you can order them directly from the BLM state office at this number:
801.539.4010 (ask to purchase a map and you will be transferred to the right person)

I bought 5 maps - Kanab, Panguitch, Smoky Mountain, Navajo Mountain and Escalante (I need those for my project)

You can see a map of the state that shows where all the BLM quads are located here:
Names and Locations of BLM Quad Maps
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Slot Canyons
Slot Canyons of the Southwest

This is a free, comprehensive online map of Utah and northern Arizon showing the locations of many slot canyons. The cool part about it is that you can click on any of the brown dots and it will take you to an information page about each slot canyon. Try it, you'll like it! There are a bunch of slot canyons around Kanab.

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A Book:
Photographing the Southwest, Vol 1, second edition

This book was independently suggested to me as a definitive guide for photography in southern Utah by several fine art landscape photographers. Some of you may want it to. Near the bottom of the web page you can link to a sample chapter to see for yourself if it might be something you want. It convinced me.

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Utah State Explorer: BLM Map Edition
It is a CD-ROM from a non-profit organization called the "Public Lands Information Center". It has all the BLM topo maps electronic and I was fascinated by this description:
"... the CD-ROM contains all of the BLM 1:100,000 surface management maps for the state and shows public lands, state lands, military withdrawals, national parks, wildlife refuges, national forests, private lands and Indian reservations. Other features include: GPS interface software supports uploading or downloading waypoints from standard GPS equipment Topographic features Roads Custom printing Distance and profile calculator Customize maps with notes, documents, or digital photographs Search function includes over 50,000 geographic features

* GPS interface software supports uploading or downloading waypoints from standard GPS equipment
* Custom printing
* Distance and profile calculator
* Customize maps with notes, documents, or digital photographs"

It is expensive so I would reserve purchase until I get it and see what it does. :)
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Message edited by author 2009-03-11 17:40:17.
03/11/2009 05:42:09 PM · #127
Originally posted by Artifacts:



A Book:
Photographing the Southwest, Vol 1, second edition

This book was independently suggested to me as a definitive guide for photography in southern Utah by several fine art landscape photographers. Some of you may want it to. Near the bottom of the web page you can link to a sample chapter to see for yourself if it might be something you want. It convinced me.

----------------------------------------------------------------------


Has been sitting on my desk next to me since the GTG came up, never go to South Utah without it.

But.... The J/A spilled the beans on the location of False Kiva, should have his ass beat. Won't be long before the tourons ( A stupid tourist) have that place tore up.

03/11/2009 05:49:15 PM · #128
Originally posted by Artifacts:

She seemed amused at all the attention "The Wave" gets over other places like it.


Agreed! Of everything in that area, the Wave really isn't all that exciting. I've found many formations similar and more impressive then the wave. I said it before, anywhere in that area, get out of your car and walk, and you will find something. I love this area.

I hadn't seen this thread but I got permits to hike Paria River/Buckskin Gulch June 1st-4th. I'll just miss you.
03/11/2009 05:53:26 PM · #129
Originally posted by jrtodd:

Originally posted by Artifacts:



A Book:
Photographing the Southwest, Vol 1, second edition

----------------------------------------------------------------------


Has been sitting on my desk next to me since the GTG came up, never go to South Utah without it.

But.... The J/A spilled the beans on the location of False Kiva, should have his ass beat. Won't be long before the tourons ( A stupid tourist) have that place tore up.

Interesting you should mention something like this. I agree that delicate locations like that should be protected.

Sadly, my sponsor at BLM headquarters told me that The Rimrocks have become so popular and well known that one of them was knocked over by vandals. :( For my project I will be privy to photography at paleontology digs at the the Grand Staircase. Those locations are a closely guarded secret and will remain so.
03/11/2009 05:58:16 PM · #130
Originally posted by Artifacts:

I will also have a GPS, but not to prevent becoming lost. All the pictures I take in the Grand Staircase-Escalante NM(GSENM) will have their GPS coordinates documented and merged with the photo files as XMP sidecar files. During my GSENM project I fully expect to photograph spectacular geology in remote, unknown or little known areas that have never been published before. I need to have those locations properly documented so others may relocate them later.


I'd rather not see the locations documented. They'll become tourist destinations filled with cigarette butts, beer cans and people carving their name in the sand stone in no time. One of the reasons this part of the country is so great is that it is undocumented and you can find spectacular things not in a guide book or on a map if you put in the effort. I've seen too many beautiful places destroyed.
03/11/2009 06:12:44 PM · #131
Originally posted by LoudDog:

Originally posted by Artifacts:

I will also have a GPS, but not to prevent becoming lost. All the pictures I take in the Grand Staircase-Escalante NM(GSENM) will have their GPS coordinates documented and merged with the photo files as XMP sidecar files. During my GSENM project I fully expect to photograph spectacular geology in remote, unknown or little known areas that have never been published before. I need to have those locations properly documented so others may relocate them later.


I'd rather not see the locations documented. They'll become tourist destinations filled with cigarette butts, beer cans and people carving their name in the sand stone in no time. One of the reasons this part of the country is so great is that it is undocumented and you can find spectacular things not in a guide book or on a map if you put in the effort. I've seen too many beautiful places destroyed.

I agree these places should remain pristine and I believe that they will because of their exceptional remoteness. These are not places people can casually drive a car close to and a lot of hiking is necessary. The Grand Staircase-Escalante doesn't have any paved roads and requires 4-wheel drive on the ones there are. And that is just to get to the places you hike from. What I'm worried about most is finding an exceptional location and then not being able to re-locate it again.
03/11/2009 06:32:43 PM · #132
One of the other sites listed, Aztec Butte, looked about the same as it does in his book the first time I visited, I was told how to get there from a guy I met at meas arch one morning. The last time I went the hole right side was gone! WTF people! Vandalism of these sites is nothing new and certainly not the authors fault, not completely anyway, but I though False Kiva is a class 2 site not appearing on any maps and the Park officials were only required to provide directions if you asked and here it is in his book.
03/11/2009 09:03:56 PM · #133
Originally posted by Artifacts:

A Book:
Photographing the Southwest, Vol 1, second edition

This book was independently suggested to me as a definitive guide for photography in southern Utah by several fine art landscape photographers. Some of you may want it to. Near the bottom of the web page you can link to a sample chapter to see for yourself if it might be something you want. It convinced me.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------------------------


BTW - For those interested in buying this book it is on Amazon for just under $17.

Message edited by author 2009-03-11 21:04:08.
03/13/2009 09:57:42 PM · #134
Hmmmm...

I saw a certain image in a certain large participation DPC challenge looking like one a certain participant in a certain Red Rock GTG certainly could have taken. Said certain person said certain things about that certain place which certainly suggests said person certainly could have took that certain picture.

Saying certain things about a certain picture in that certain large participation challenge during a certain voting week suggesting that a certain person might have taken said certain picture would violate certain DPC rules identifying certain people with certain images.

So I will certainly say nothing about it at all.
03/13/2009 10:19:12 PM · #135
Are you certain?

In a certain challenge that is in voting right now the dates that were allowed could mean that those certain photos could have been from any of the previous Red Rock GTGs or not from a GTG at all.

But, it isn't mine. That's for certain.
03/13/2009 10:29:16 PM · #136
What is certain is the funny ass name of the hotel. Treasure Trail Motel! That is too funny. Wish I could go to this. I would love to be there.
What if you don't get a permit on any of the given days?

I haven't read the whole thread so forgive me if it has been asked and answered before.
03/14/2009 06:43:40 AM · #137
The said certain challenge in current voting most certainly certifies certain previous Red Rock GTGers selective and certifiable access to said voting challenge. So certainly, certain of them could also have selected said picture in that certain challenge selectively from certain archives from their own certifiable files. However, since certainly none of them said certain things about said image such as was said above then certain of us could not sincerely think certain previous Red Rock GTGers or anyone else submitted said photo. QED.

Originally posted by yakatme:

Are you certain?

In a certain challenge that is in voting right now the dates that were allowed could mean that those certain photos could have been from any of the previous Red Rock GTGs or not from a GTG at all.

But, it isn't mine. That's for certain.
03/14/2009 06:26:32 PM · #138
Originally posted by jrtodd:

Absolutely we can do that hike.

East of Big Water....
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/30000-34999/33515/120/298193.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/30000-34999/33515/120/298193.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
Oops, white rocks is west of Big Water

It is hard to tell looking at Google Earth... Can't really tell where the road ends and the hike begins... How far is the hike to these hoodoos??
03/14/2009 08:46:00 PM · #139
But I'm certain it's not mine

About 5 miles or so if I remember
37.162129,-111.712289
03/14/2009 11:57:15 PM · #140
Originally posted by jrtodd:

But I'm certain it's not mine

About 5 miles or so if I remember
37.162129,-111.712289

;) ;)

Thanks... along a flat wash, I believe. I've never been there before. Best photographed in the AM or PM? I was thinking AM.

Btw Mr. Todd... who certainly says twas not he who took a certain photograph of a certain place entered into a certain challenge...

You still interested in hiking up to yellow rock? That looks like a fabulous hike through some incredible scenery and not far from Kanab. I'm going even if you decide not to.

Message edited by author 2009-03-15 14:12:38.
03/15/2009 02:37:53 PM · #141
Btw...if you are unfamiliar with Google Earth I HIGHLY recommend you download and start using it to investigate some of the places you will want to go photograph on the Red Rock GTG.

It provides an amazing amount of information and imagery of specific photo sites that you may want to visit, including the remote ones. It is an invaluable tool to help you locate places to go and set personal expectations for what you will find once you get there.

Other fine art photographers have shared their "push pin" links with me. These are tiny Google Earth files with place markers and notes sharing their personal experiences. It is pretty cool stuff!
03/15/2009 04:33:33 PM · #142
Originally posted by Artifacts:



You still interested in hiking up to yellow rock?


Oh yes!

White Rock Hoodoos
The start of the hike is at the end of Fish Hatchery Road outside Big Water, the road splits as you approach the wash and that is where we parked (37° 6'21.95"N, 111°41'2.12"W). I've been there to see some guys from Page try to cross the river in a Mustang...park at the cross roads. Hike up Wahweep Creek, staying to the right, and eventually the Hoodoos will start to appear on the left side of the wash. (Google Earth show them at 37° 9'43.01"N, 111°42'45.38"W). I 2X checked mine, I was wrong before it's N37 09.657 W111 42.863. It's not a hard hike, just wet and muddy. The earlier you get there the better, the last time I was there a rock had fallen off the top of one of the hoodoos.
03/17/2009 11:35:43 AM · #143
' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_N.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_N.gif', '/') + 1) . ' Artifactsand ' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', '/') + 1) . ' jrtodd, I hope you'll include this hiker in your trip to Yellow Rock. I'm game and more. Water and mud are my friends.
03/17/2009 12:49:59 PM · #144
Originally posted by rjkstesch:

' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_N.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_N.gif', '/') + 1) . ' Artifactsand ' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', '/') + 1) . ' jrtodd, I hope you'll include this hiker in your trip to Yellow Rock. I'm game and more. Water and mud are my friends.
Wouldn't have it any other way!
03/18/2009 09:30:06 PM · #145
Originally posted by jrtodd:

Originally posted by rjkstesch:

' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_N.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_N.gif', '/') + 1) . ' Artifactsand ' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', '/') + 1) . ' jrtodd, I hope you'll include this hiker in your trip to Yellow Rock. I'm game and more. Water and mud are my friends.
Wouldn't have it any other way!

Depending how we do it, it could be a pretty short hike... and I HIGHLY recommend driving up Cottonwood Road a couple miles further to photograph one of the most astounding geologic features in the GSENM... the Cockscombs.
03/19/2009 01:36:15 PM · #146
Hoodoos...

As I have said before, my Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument(GSENM) photography project sorta intersects the Red Rock GTG, but I definitely will remain focused on the GSENM.

I found another larger hoodoo site between The RimRocks and the Wahweap Hoodoos called White Rocks/White Valley that is as good as both. It is rarely visited. Mileage-wise all three are reasonably close together and close to Kanab. If there is interest among anyone in the group for a "hoodoo day" to explore them photographically let me know. Be advise the road could be bumpy. :)

There are so many great things to photograph in that area that I realize time may not permit it for most folks. With or without anyone I will be photographing them for the project.
03/19/2009 03:53:55 PM · #147
Originally posted by Artifacts:

Hoodoos...

As I have said before, my Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument(GSENM) photography project sorta intersects the Red Rock GTG, but I definitely will remain focused on the GSENM.

I found another larger hoodoo site between The RimRocks and the Wahweap Hoodoos called White Rocks/White Valley that is as good as both. It is rarely visited. Mileage-wise all three are reasonably close together and close to Kanab. If there is interest among anyone in the group for a "hoodoo day" to explore them photographically let me know. Be advise the road could be bumpy. :)

There are so many great things to photograph in that area that I realize time may not permit it for most folks. With or without anyone I will be photographing them for the project.


I'd like to be included. I prefer the off the road/out of the way spots for these types of GTGs, since I can get to the standards by myself fairly easily.

We may want to split the group into those who want to go to Bryce and those who want to do Hoodoos. (or some such.)

Becky
03/19/2009 03:55:18 PM · #148
Originally posted by LVicari:

What is certain is the funny ass name of the hotel. Treasure Trail Motel! That is too funny. Wish I could go to this. I would love to be there.
What if you don't get a permit on any of the given days?

I haven't read the whole thread so forgive me if it has been asked and answered before.


We've got a permit for the other end of Coyote Butte (for those willing to hike) and many other road excursions. They will keep us very busy.
03/19/2009 04:38:27 PM · #149
I'm still planning on coming down and will even have my backpacking gear and a small tent so I'd certainly be up for any out of the way spots. I've done Zion and Bryce before but not with much hiking so even if I end up going to them again I'll be getting out on the trail. I'll keep an eye on the thread but as of now things look good.
03/20/2009 07:09:17 PM · #150
Originally posted by rjkstesch:

Originally posted by Artifacts:

Hoodoos...

I found another larger hoodoo site between The RimRocks and the Wahweap Hoodoos called White Rocks/White Valley that is as good as both. It is rarely visited. Mileage-wise all three are reasonably close together and close to Kanab. If there is interest among anyone in the group for a "hoodoo day" to explore them photographically let me know. Be advise the road could be bumpy. :)


I'd like to be included. I prefer the off the road/out of the way spots for these types of GTGs, since I can get to the standards by myself fairly easily.

We may want to split the group into those who want to go to Bryce and those who want to do Hoodoos. (or some such.)

Becky

I have high hopes for White Rocks/White Valley hoodoo photography. If you have the Martres book, "Photographing the Southwest", it contains a section about it that describes two ways to get there. You can also find a few photographs of the northern section posted on Google Earth at this location:
37° 9' 20.48" N
111° 45' 6.87" W

ADDED NOTE:
This is even better... there is a 4th hoodoo site near White Rocks called Sidestep Canyon that looks really cool to... on Google Earth if you go east just a little ways from the coordinates I gave above you can see pictures from Sidestep Canyon as well.

Message edited by author 2009-03-20 19:24:10.
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