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01/16/2009 04:09:34 PM · #76 |
| My entry is "in". The weather and light cooperated. It was fun. AA's hand was on my shoulder. |
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01/16/2009 04:27:37 PM · #77 |
Originally posted by hahn23:
My entry is "in". The weather and light cooperated. It was fun. AA's hand was on my shoulder. |
He must have a hell of a reach then, because I felt his hand on mine as well... :-) Of course my shot isn't a protypically Anselish subject matter, so my expectations are limited. The light and the processing look good though :-)
R.
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01/16/2009 04:30:41 PM · #78 |
Bear,
Do you think Ansel would've used a Lens Baby? :) |
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01/16/2009 05:53:55 PM · #79 |
Originally posted by hahn23:
My entry is "in". The weather and light cooperated. It was fun. AA's hand was on my shoulder. |
I used to drink, too. |
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01/16/2009 05:56:08 PM · #80 |
| Im in finally after a mishap with the first try. :=) |
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01/16/2009 05:58:35 PM · #81 |
Originally posted by rugman1969:
Originally posted by Nuzzer:
Originally posted by rugman1969:
I am trying to understand, how is Ansel such a great photographer when one of his photographs recently appeared on the DPC Shadows challenge, and only scored a 4.6. It sounds like this guy is only a great photographer if you know it's his photo. If you don't know it's his, he obviously isn't all that great. So, how can you say how great he is, if his photo doesn't score so well on DPC? |
Times change. With the equipment and techniques he had to work with you'd not see many of the shots that do well on DPC today being produced. You can't compare shots from his day and today like that.
PS: I wonder why DPC doesn't require original to always be uploaded with entries and have automatic EXIF checking just to weed out the obvious "submission errors" |
It doesn't matter by standards. His pic scored a 4.6 on dpc. If his pictures are that great, they would stand the test of time and score at least an 8. You can't compare shots from his day you say? You are saying the shots from his day are great. You are not making any sense by saying that. |
People on DPC look for a certain image. Not every image shot by Ansel Adams will fit within those 'guidelines'.
Ansel Adams became famous for his technical expertise as well as his ability to produce stunning images. I also think that Ansel himself would have told you that not all of his images are 'good'-- I think his saying was that "producing 3 significant images in a year makes for a very good year". There are hundreds of thousands of images shot by Ansel that we DON'T see because they weren't up to his meticulous technical and artistic standard. I think its very poor judgment indeed to take a shot that was probably part of a larger photo essay, hold it on its own in front of a crowd that likes snazzy, colorful images, and say "this got a 4 and its an Ansel Adams shot! DPS sux!"
That's my 2c.... |
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01/16/2009 06:02:37 PM · #82 |
Originally posted by rugman1969:
So, how can you say how great he is, if his photo doesn't score so well on DPC?
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Best chef in the world could cook his best meal ever and if he served it to a bar full of rednecks they'd probably say it sucked and start clamoring for more cheeseburgers. Says nothing about the skills of the chef or the quality of his art. |
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01/16/2009 06:05:26 PM · #83 |
Originally posted by vxpra:
Bear,
Do you think Ansel would've used a Lens Baby? :) |
Not a chance. He was totally about clarity and precision, detail upon detail.
R.
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01/16/2009 06:09:29 PM · #84 |
Originally posted by Sachlichkeit:
I think his saying was that "producing 3 significant images in a year makes for a very good year". |
It was 12, actually, but you got the principle right. That's what makes me laugh about this thread; Ansel himself was an "ordinary guy", he didn't have a swollen head at all. He'd never have been so presumptuous as to suggest, or even imply, that ANY of his images, entered in a competition, were guaranteed winners. Not even the best of them.
R.
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01/16/2009 06:25:31 PM · #85 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by rugman1969:
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by rugman1969:
I am trying to understand, how is Ansel such a great photographer when one of his photographs recently appeared on the DPC Shadows challenge, and only scored a 4.6. It sounds like this guy is only a great photographer if you know it's his photo. If you don't know it's his, he obviously isn't all that great. So, how can you say how great he is, if his photo doesn't score so well on DPC? |
Michael Jordan wasn't very good at baseball. |
WTF? If there was a contest for not making any sense, I think you would when. |
And you'd win for typos? ;)
There is no single test of greatness. If Ansel Adams does poorly on DPC it means he does poorly on DPC. It does not mean he is not a Master. Micahel Jordan was one of the best basketball players of all time. Just because he sucked at baseball does not make that any less true. |
Sorry I work for a living, and I squeeze these forums in here and there. So when I typo on here, it's because I'm in a rush and busy. I don't have the luxury of sitting home all day and typing in these forums. But stop trying to take the spotlight off of the subjuect and project it to my spelling error. This will not change the obvious fact of the supposed to be expert photographers who voted on the Ansel picture. I would assume an expert would be able to notice expertise with no problem. Not a single 10 for his picture. Go figure. |
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01/16/2009 06:31:28 PM · #86 |
Originally posted by rugman1969:
Sorry I work for a living, and I squeeze these forums in here and there. So when I typo on here, it's because I'm in a rush and busy. I don't have the luxury of sitting home all day and typing in these forums. But stop trying to take the spotlight off of the subjuect and project it to my spelling error. This will not change the obvious fact of the supposed to be expert photographers who voted on the Ansel picture. I would assume an expert would be able to notice expertise with no problem. Not a single 10 for his picture. Go figure. |
C'mon! That's been gone over. It was a poorly chosen example for "Shadows". No matter how good Annie Leibovitz' picture of the Queen is, it isn't going to win in a Playmate of the Year competition. Duh.
Message edited by author 2009-01-16 18:32:05. |
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01/16/2009 07:22:25 PM · #87 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Originally posted by vxpra:
Bear,
Do you think Ansel would've used a Lens Baby? :) |
Not a chance. He was totally about clarity and precision, detail upon detail.
R. |
I think he would've tucked one away for when no one was looking. :) |
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01/16/2009 07:24:38 PM · #88 |
Robert, a quick question. For the last couple days, I have looked at Adam’s photos. Seems to me he liked to slightly overexpose, then apply whatever burning technique was available with film at the time. Something else I noticed was that it seems he preferred the sun at about the 45 degree angle. Am I barking up the right tree?
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01/16/2009 07:34:37 PM · #89 |
Originally posted by citymars:
Originally posted by hahn23:
My entry is "in". The weather and light cooperated. It was fun. AA's hand was on my shoulder. |
I used to drink, too. |
Your comment was meant to be funny. I laughed. However, trying to emulate an amazing artist who excelled in his presentation of remarkable tonal range and inspiring landscape photography has nothing to do with being intoxicated. Quite to the contrary. I didn't see any "drinkers" at sunrise this morning at 11,000 feet elevation.... 5 miles up the trail, through deep snow. It takes a lot of work to do landscape photography. If you've never felt the presence of a "departed from this earth" admired person in your expression of your artistry, then you are not "tuned in". |
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01/16/2009 07:36:03 PM · #90 |
Originally posted by alans_world:
Robert, a quick question. For the last couple days, I have looked at Adam’s photos. Seems to me he liked to slightly overexpose, then apply whatever burning technique was available with film at the time. Something else I noticed was that it seems he preferred the sun at about the 45 degree angle. Am I barking up the right tree? |
Well, the 45-degree light is reasonably close, though I'd say his preference could better be defined as "raking light", the light that nearly parallels the key subject in the image. Certainly, you'll rarely see him shooting witht he light from directly behind him. He did a lot of work with backlit landscapes also.
As far as the exposure bit goes, an understanding of the zone system would show you that there's an element of truth in the "overexpose" part, but it isn't really "overexposure". In Zone System you expose for the shadows, so as to preserve detail where you want it, then adjust the processing time on your negative so the highlights can't block up and get opaque. It's characteristic of silver halide emulsions that the thin areas of the negative (the shadows) reach their fullest expression very early in the processing, and the densest parts of the negative (the highlights) continue to build up density for a considerable length of time during development.
So if there is, say, a 7-stop range between shadows and highlights and you want that to be a 4-stop range, then you will do what's called "minus 3" processing, to arrest the development of the highlights before they go opaque. Similarly, if there is less contrast in the subject/scene than you want, so the spread between shadow and highlight is, say, only 3 stops, then you'd "UNDERexpose" the negative, keeping the shadows darker, and "push" the processing plus 1 or plus 2 to force the highlights further up the scale.
In the digital world, we handle this to a certain extent with curves, and for extreme tonal ranges we have HDRI processing, which allows us to compress the tonal range of the image to a viewable range.
R.
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01/16/2009 07:45:27 PM · #91 |
Originally posted by hahn23:
Originally posted by citymars:
Originally posted by hahn23:
My entry is "in". The weather and light cooperated. It was fun. AA's hand was on my shoulder. |
I used to drink, too. |
Your comment was meant to be funny. I laughed. However, trying to emulate an amazing artist who excelled in his presentation of remarkable tonal range and inspiring landscape photography has nothing to do with being intoxicated. Quite to the contrary. I didn't see any "drinkers" at sunrise this morning at 11,000 feet elevation.... 5 miles up the trail, through deep snow. It takes a lot of work to do landscape photography. If you've never felt the presence of a "departed from this earth" admired person in your expression of your artistry, then you are not "tuned in". |
You did catch the AA - Alcoholic's Anonymous reference right? ;) |
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01/16/2009 07:54:02 PM · #92 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Originally posted by alans_world:
Robert, a quick question. For the last couple days, I have looked at Adam’s photos. Seems to me he liked to slightly overexpose, then apply whatever burning technique was available with film at the time. Something else I noticed was that it seems he preferred the sun at about the 45 degree angle. Am I barking up the right tree? |
Well, the 45-degree light is reasonably close, though I'd say his preference could better be defined as "raking light", the light that nearly parallels the key subject in the image. Certainly, you'll rarely see him shooting witht he light from directly behind him. He did a lot of work with backlit landscapes also.
As far as the exposure bit goes, an understanding of the zone system would show you that there's an element of truth in the "overexpose" part, but it isn't really "overexposure". In Zone System you expose for the shadows, so as to preserve detail where you want it, then adjust the processing time on your negative so the highlights can't block up and get opaque. It's characteristic of silver halide emulsions that the thin areas of the negative (the shadows) reach their fullest expression very early in the processing, and the densest parts of the negative (the highlights) continue to build up density for a considerable length of time during development.
So if there is, say, a 7-stop range between shadows and highlights and you want that to be a 4-stop range, then you will do what's called "minus 3" processing, to arrest the development of the highlights before they go opaque. Similarly, if there is less contrast in the subject/scene than you want, so the spread between shadow and highlight is, say, only 3 stops, then you'd "UNDERexpose" the negative, keeping the shadows darker, and "push" the processing plus 1 or plus 2 to force the highlights further up the scale.
In the digital world, we handle this to a certain extent with curves, and for extreme tonal ranges we have HDRI processing, which allows us to compress the tonal range of the image to a viewable range.
R. |
Thank You Robert, It seems I have a little more homework to do, but it's a good thing..
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01/16/2009 08:15:43 PM · #93 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by hahn23:
Originally posted by citymars:
Originally posted by hahn23:
My entry is "in". The weather and light cooperated. It was fun. AA's hand was on my shoulder. |
I used to drink, too. |
Your comment was meant to be funny. I laughed. However, trying to emulate an amazing artist who excelled in his presentation of remarkable tonal range and inspiring landscape photography has nothing to do with being intoxicated. Quite to the contrary. I didn't see any "drinkers" at sunrise this morning at 11,000 feet elevation.... 5 miles up the trail, through deep snow. It takes a lot of work to do landscape photography. If you've never felt the presence of a "departed from this earth" admired person in your expression of your artistry, then you are not "tuned in". |
You did catch the AA - Alcoholic's Anonymous reference right? ;) |
Oh, yeah! It was an unintentional acronym. It never occurred to me that someone would think of alcoholics, but then, it would not be the first time I misjudged and wrote poorly. |
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01/16/2009 11:14:07 PM · #94 |
Originally posted by chip_k:
Last Ansel challenge someone posted a real Ansel and it originally placed 11th. .......... I think was a good example of the competition quality of DPC's shooters. ......... |
Your kidding me with this right??? are you seriously suggesting that just because the DPC voters didn't rank it number one that ANYONE on this site can consider themselves in remotely the same league as a legend such as Ansel Adams!
I would propose that it demonstrates the ignorance of DPCs voters and not the exaltedness of its photographers as you so ludicrously suggest.
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01/17/2009 12:34:29 AM · #95 |
Originally posted by jhomrighaus:
Originally posted by chip_k:
Last Ansel challenge someone posted a real Ansel and it originally placed 11th. .......... I think was a good example of the competition quality of DPC's shooters. ......... |
Your kidding me with this right??? are you seriously suggesting that just because the DPC voters didn't rank it number one that ANYONE on this site can consider themselves in remotely the same league as a legend such as Ansel Adams!
I would propose that it demonstrates the ignorance of DPCs voters and not the exaltedness of its photographers as you so ludicrously suggest. |
The "someone" was me, with the help of SC, and it wasn't a very good reproduction of an Ansel either. No surprise at all that it didn't make it to the ribbons, given the technical flaws of the web version, and kudos to the voters that they saw beyond the flaws to the real quality of the image itself and placed it very high in the challenge.
R.
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01/17/2009 02:24:06 AM · #96 |
shot mine today and i wish i had found this site beforehand
Ansel Adams Archive |
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01/17/2009 03:45:12 AM · #97 |
Wow that was a pretty cool tour. Just goes to show you how much work went into the prints in the darkroom!
Originally posted by Ter:
shot mine today and i wish i had found this site beforehand
Ansel Adams Archive |
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01/17/2009 03:47:56 AM · #98 |
| And why is there an Ansel Adams shot in the Shadows challenge anyway? |
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01/17/2009 06:23:44 AM · #99 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
And why is there an Ansel Adams shot in the Shadows challenge anyway? |
I didn't have time to shoot so I just threw one of his in. :P |
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01/17/2009 06:45:08 AM · #100 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
And why is there an Ansel Adams shot in the Shadows challenge anyway? |
There is another Ansel Adams picture in The Business Person Challenge to. I just reported it like I did the other one a few days ago. This time I used the click on button from the voting area but I guess the Site Council is on it.
Message edited by author 2009-01-17 06:47:13. |
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