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10/16/2008 02:55:18 PM · #76 |
Regarding the tax cuts... they do not always work. They cannot - the world we live in, financial included, is not linear. While cutting taxes was probably a good idea 8 years ago, when the wagon started rolling downhill, adding money to companies might have helped. Therefore, the tax cuts had an expiration date associated with it. Apparently someone in congress at the time realized that this allowance must come with an end date.
Now, the times are such that just removing taxes from corporations won't work, period. Did you try pissing on the house on fire to extinguish the flames? Well, if you didn't, you may imagine it won't work. You'll burn your pee-pee. The same is true for the tax reduction.
The same is true with the tax credit that some people got in the past 12 months... it might have worked (the intent was to inject the money into economy) if people were floating around zero, so they needed some extra cash to buy unnecessary shit. However, the people are way below the surface, and the cash the gov't provided was good enough to buy them a loaf of bread, or perhaps to reduce the debt they are running by, say 0.5%
Every time someone mentions gov't providing some services, people scream 'socialism!" without even knowing what that is. Why don't we give those gov't programs a chance - assign an expiration date to them, if you're so scared of 'socialism' (which this isn't by the way).
That way, we can give it a try for 2-3 years, and judge by the results if it is going in the right direction or not. Reevaluate the law 3 years from now and if it did not work, let it expire. If it worked, expand it!
That simple.
Sometimes you have to try things and see if they work or not. I'm willing to see something new tried out. The current stuff (economic "policy") apparently did not work. Let's dump it. |
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10/16/2008 03:03:54 PM · #77 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by scalvert:
We can argue about who should pay and to what extent, but "just let 'em die" isn't an option for a compassionate person. |
Wow. Because I think we should use other measures to educate these people; train them to be productive members of society, if you will, I am simply saying to "let them die"?
Odd how you don't like it when someone else fabricates things to suit their agenda but you have no problem doing it yourself. |
Originally posted by Phil:
My answer would be to take away the free healthcare from the people who have made the choice to live a life of unemployment and supidity and give it to those deserving individuals you speak of. |
That was the full quote I responded to. Hmm... nothing there about training people to be productive. It looks to me like you said take away their healthcare and give it to the people who are already productive members of society. Were you thinking that healthcare would somehow trickle down to the people you stripped it from or that they would somehow be just fine without any healthcare? |
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10/16/2008 03:09:39 PM · #78 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
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Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
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10/16/2008 03:30:37 PM · #79 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
It does make perfect sense. The people in your state, or any state for that matter, that are receiving Medicaid, are indeed stupid and ignorant if they support McCain. His policies and programs will benefit the rich at the expense of the poor. |
By that ideology, anyone in a household making more then $110,000 per year that votes for Obama is stupid and ignorant too because under McCain they will get a bigger tax break.
//www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html
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10/16/2008 03:32:04 PM · #80 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
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Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
I guess you're incapable of following the entire thread at once. Dude. Sad really, but if it's fun for you, enjoy. |
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10/16/2008 03:40:26 PM · #81 |
Originally posted by LoudDog:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
It does make perfect sense. The people in your state, or any state for that matter, that are receiving Medicaid, are indeed stupid and ignorant if they support McCain. His policies and programs will benefit the rich at the expense of the poor. |
By that ideology, anyone in a household making more then $110,000 per year that votes for Obama is stupid and ignorant too because under McCain they will get a bigger tax break.
//www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html |
Perhaps, but it's not just about taxes, is it?
Pretty much all of McCain's policies and programs give the poor the shaft. |
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10/16/2008 03:42:22 PM · #82 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Hmm... nothing there about training people to be productive. It looks to me like you said take away their healthcare and give it to the people who are already productive members of society. Were you thinking that healthcare would somehow trickle down to the people you stripped it from or that they would somehow be just fine without any healthcare? |
Just to make sure I'm playing this game correctly...
When Obama says that we need stronger enforcement at the border and the workforce he means he's going to kill everyone who crosses or works illegally? No gray area, right? Because he throws a statement out there without fully explaining his mission we are just allowed to make up whatever we ASSUME he'll do?
I think I got it now. Since I didn't explain my plan you get to say what you ASSUME it means. |
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10/16/2008 03:44:32 PM · #83 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
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Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
I guess you're incapable of following the entire thread at once. Dude. Sad really, but if it's fun for you, enjoy. |
Sorry Charlie but my comment wasn't on the thread, policies or anything of the sort. My comment was to how it's okay for one to generalize and speak of a majority's stupidity but not another. You were the one who took it elsewhere.
Message edited by author 2008-10-16 15:48:24. |
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10/16/2008 03:46:29 PM · #84 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
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Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
I guess you're incapable of following the entire thread at once. Dude. Sad really, but if it's fun for you, enjoy. |
Sorry Charlie but my comment wasn't on the thread, policies or anything of the sort. My comment was to how it's okay for one to generalize and speak of a majorities stupidity but not another. You were the one who took it elsewhere. |
You are sorry, that I can agree to.
Who is Charlie? Did you have a 'Nam flashback or something?
Message edited by author 2008-10-16 15:48:47. |
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10/16/2008 03:48:50 PM · #85 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
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Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
I guess you're incapable of following the entire thread at once. Dude. Sad really, but if it's fun for you, enjoy. |
Sorry Charlie but my comment wasn't on the thread, policies or anything of the sort. My comment was to how it's okay for one to generalize and speak of a majorities stupidity but not another. You were the one who took it elsewhere. |
You are sorry, that I can agree to. |
All I really heard there was" WAAAAAHHHHHH!!!". Can you try again? |
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10/16/2008 03:54:31 PM · #86 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
|
Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
I guess you're incapable of following the entire thread at once. Dude. Sad really, but if it's fun for you, enjoy. |
Sorry Charlie but my comment wasn't on the thread, policies or anything of the sort. My comment was to how it's okay for one to generalize and speak of a majorities stupidity but not another. You were the one who took it elsewhere. |
You are sorry, that I can agree to. |
All I really heard there was" WAAAAAHHHHHH!!!". Can you try again? |
No, if you're too slow on the uptake, too bad for you. Maybe you should pay attention or go back to the kiddy pool.
I a m n o t g o i n g t o t y p e s l o w e r f o r y o u r b e n e f i t. |
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10/16/2008 04:00:21 PM · #87 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
|
Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
I guess you're incapable of following the entire thread at once. Dude. Sad really, but if it's fun for you, enjoy. |
Sorry Charlie but my comment wasn't on the thread, policies or anything of the sort. My comment was to how it's okay for one to generalize and speak of a majorities stupidity but not another. You were the one who took it elsewhere. |
You are sorry, that I can agree to. |
All I really heard there was" WAAAAAHHHHHH!!!". Can you try again? |
No, if you're too slow on the uptake, too bad for you. Maybe you should pay attention or go back to the kiddy pool.
I a m n o t g o i n g t o t y p e s l o w e r f o r y o u r b e n e f i t. |
Must be an echo. All I hear is "waaaaaaaahhhhhh" again.
Oh well. I've always heard the ignorant resort to cries and personal insults. Looks like the rumors were true. |
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10/16/2008 04:04:38 PM · #88 |
Originally posted by LoudDog:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
It does make perfect sense. The people in your state, or any state for that matter, that are receiving Medicaid, are indeed stupid and ignorant if they support McCain. His policies and programs will benefit the rich at the expense of the poor. |
By that ideology, anyone in a household making more then $110,000 per year that votes for Obama is stupid and ignorant too because under McCain they will get a bigger tax break. |
That would be less than 20%, and even there the vast majority will still pay less taxes (just not as much of a cut). According to the article you posted, the only people who would see a tax increase under Obama would be those making more than $600,000.... less than 1% of the population. The analogy doesn't hold up though. Stupidity and ignorance only factors in when you look at McCain's chart and think everyone will pay less taxes or believe most people would be taxed more under Obama. It's simply not possible to cut EVERYONE'S taxes when we're already running a ridiculously high federal deficit unless you cut things like healthcare and Social Security. Removing 100% of earmarks and pork barrel spending wouldn't even come close. Point being- it's not ignorance for the wealthiest 1% to believe they'll be taxed higher under Obama (he says as much), but Medicaid recipients who think they'll be paying less under McCain would be in for a rude awakening when they need a doctor. |
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10/16/2008 04:05:57 PM · #89 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Since I didn't explain my plan you get to say what you ASSUME it means. |
No assumption necessary. You said point blank you would take away their healthcare, and without healthcare, people die. |
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10/16/2008 04:10:55 PM · #90 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Dude. Nearly every rusty POS hillbilly wagon around here is plastered with U.S. flag stickers and "W" stickers from 2000 and 2004, so your generalization that the poor vote Dem, doesn't hold water.
I never claimed that the poor would suddenly made wealthy under Obama, I don't know where you get that idea.
|
Nor did I say that the rich would become poorer under Obama.
Never tried my hand at making up crap out of the blue to spin from the point someone was making on hypocrisy. This is fun! |
I guess you're incapable of following the entire thread at once. Dude. Sad really, but if it's fun for you, enjoy. |
Sorry Charlie but my comment wasn't on the thread, policies or anything of the sort. My comment was to how it's okay for one to generalize and speak of a majorities stupidity but not another. You were the one who took it elsewhere. |
You are sorry, that I can agree to. |
All I really heard there was" WAAAAAHHHHHH!!!". Can you try again? |
No, if you're too slow on the uptake, too bad for you. Maybe you should pay attention or go back to the kiddy pool.
I a m n o t g o i n g t o t y p e s l o w e r f o r y o u r b e n e f i t. |
Must be an echo. All I hear is "waaaaaaaahhhhhh" again.
Oh well. I've always heard the ignorant resort to cries and personal insults. Looks like the rumors were true. |
Is that how you show your "intelligence"?
Leaving the poor to die, that's your plan?
Message edited by author 2008-10-16 16:11:46. |
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10/16/2008 04:12:49 PM · #91 |
| C'mon guys! Civil discussion? |
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10/16/2008 04:14:20 PM · #92 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Phil:
Since I didn't explain my plan you get to say what you ASSUME it means. |
No assumption necessary. You said point blank you would take away their healthcare, and without healthcare, people die. |
Trust me, plenty of assumption there. If you were speaking about someone else's comments I would have no argument; however, since you're speaking about mine I think I have the authority to tell you that you are wrong. Especially since I explained my plan. |
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10/16/2008 04:15:45 PM · #93 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
C'mon guys! Civil discussion? |
I have no problem with that but why was there not a cease request until someone retaliated his ignorant bs? |
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10/16/2008 04:17:03 PM · #94 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
C'mon guys! Civil discussion? |
Thank you. And as a public service, edit your quotes while you're at it. |
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10/16/2008 04:20:10 PM · #95 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by scalvert:
C'mon guys! Civil discussion? |
I have no problem with that but why was there not a cease request until someone retaliated his ignorant bs? |
Why did you need to be asked? |
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10/16/2008 04:22:50 PM · #96 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Who is Charlie? |
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10/16/2008 04:23:20 PM · #97 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by scalvert:
C'mon guys! Civil discussion? |
I have no problem with that but why was there not a cease request until someone retaliated his ignorant bs? |
As opposed to your ignorant BS? |
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10/16/2008 04:24:05 PM · #98 |
| Don't start it all over again, please. |
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10/16/2008 05:04:54 PM · #99 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by LoudDog:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
It does make perfect sense. The people in your state, or any state for that matter, that are receiving Medicaid, are indeed stupid and ignorant if they support McCain. His policies and programs will benefit the rich at the expense of the poor. |
By that ideology, anyone in a household making more then $110,000 per year that votes for Obama is stupid and ignorant too because under McCain they will get a bigger tax break.
//www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html |
Perhaps, but it's not just about taxes, is it?
Pretty much all of McCain's policies and programs give the poor the shaft. |
And pretty much all of Obama's policies and programs give families that make over $110K the shaft.
The election isn't just about medicade either. My point, you can't call a group of people stupid because they picked the candidate they thought was best for the country rather then the candidate that would be best for them personally.
It goes both ways... |
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10/16/2008 05:21:23 PM · #100 |
Originally posted by LoudDog:
And pretty much all of Obama's policies and programs give families that make over $110K the shaft. |
That's some shaft. According to they article you posted, most of those families would see a tax cut of $2,000- $3,000. You'd have to make over $600,000 to see a tax increase. Oh, those poor families! :-(
Message edited by author 2008-10-16 17:22:00. |
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