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02/24/2004 04:28:26 PM · #51 |
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
Originally posted by space amoeba:
At the risk of threadjacking and putting this comment where it doesn't belong, something to consider might be a "forced comment" for '1' votes. That way, the voter at least needs to say how this picture warranted such a horrible vote. |
AMEN to that! not just for ones but 1,2,3's. |
Hmmmmm, so in order to avoid harassment that comes with leaving negative feedback, I would essentailly have to leave a comment telling the shooter how great I thought their image was while giving it the 1,2 or 3 it deserves?
I suppose that, or just abstain altogether.
Message edited by author 2004-02-24 16:29:08.
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02/24/2004 04:31:01 PM · #52 |
Only 5.7 ?
Message edited by author 2004-02-24 16:40:26. |
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02/24/2004 05:02:11 PM · #53 |
Hey!.... What if we graded each image (1 to 10 scale) in two categories, 'Meeting Challenge' and 'Image quality', so the image grade would not suffer from our 'opinions' of how to vote the challenge. [/quote]
Or you could just split your vote. With my system if you enter, you get a 1. If (IMHO) you meet the challenge +1. If you 'nail' the challenge +2. I continue this for composition, technique and then the last two points are for those hard to define personal qualities such as humor or uniqueness.
This way I never penalize anyone by subtracting points and the low end is well defined.
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02/24/2004 05:53:33 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Hmmmmm, so in order to avoid harassment that comes with leaving negative feedback, I would essentailly have to leave a comment telling the shooter how great I thought their image was while giving it the 1,2 or 3 it deserves?
I suppose that, or just abstain altogether. |
Yes If you can't be honest with someone and tell them what you feel. I mean you must really feel something to rate it so low.
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02/24/2004 06:42:02 PM · #55 |
| Here's a little thing I do when my entry is doing poorly..I go to the "gifted and talented" members of this site, and look back to see how they did when they first began...I always gives me hope....everyone has high and low scores |
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02/24/2004 07:13:20 PM · #56 |
additionally.. just because someone hates something (shown by givin a 1) doesn't mean it IS bad. not everyone is going to understand art, and most definatly not everyone is going to understand MY art. if someone gives me a 1 i might assume, they are a victim of both... or i REALLY need improvement. if i had ALL 1's i might consider the later, but since there is only a few 1's... i would perhaps believe the former. I don't think we can base our lives on what a few percent of the population thinks of us.... or let alone ANYone thinks of us.. however.. we do have to rely on others for feedback.
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02/24/2004 08:11:17 PM · #57 |
CATHERINE! Holy cow! Please don't let one vote ruin your confidence!!! While yeah, it freakin hurts to see that...
I just looked through your site and cant' see for one minute how you could even begin to question yourself by one stupid vote! Your work is out of control awesome! |
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02/24/2004 09:03:12 PM · #58 |
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Hmmmmm, so in order to avoid harassment that comes with leaving negative feedback, I would essentailly have to leave a comment telling the shooter how great I thought their image was while giving it the 1,2 or 3 it deserves?
I suppose that, or just abstain altogether. |
Yes If you can't be honest with someone and tell them what you feel. I mean you must really feel something to rate it so low. |
It's not that I have a problem with telling people how I feel. It's how they take offense to something that is my opinion. Like it is wrong or something because they have built up their emotional attachment to their image and take my dislike of it as a personal insult.
Should I have to justify my opinion about liking or disliking their shot? Should I have to justify disliking coconut? How about the color puce? Or velvet Elvis paintings? My Mother-in-Law's pot roast?
Sorry, but I'm free to have my own opinion and vote accordingly without disclosing that if I choose.
I often don't comment on shots I give 8's, 9's and 10's to either, I just give them to shots I feel deserve them.
Message edited by author 2004-02-24 21:04:25.
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02/24/2004 09:11:23 PM · #59 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
It's not that I have a problem with telling people how I feel. It's how they take offense to something that is my opinion. Like it is wrong or something because they have built up their emotional attachment to their image and take my dislike of it as a personal insult. |
This is why I don't bother commenting on photos I don't like anymore.
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02/24/2004 10:04:08 PM · #60 |
I really don't worry about a few ones. At least not as long as there aren't tons of them. If you are operating near the edge, I would say that you might find high end and low end votes (love it/hate it) as opposed to doing more mainstream work, with mainstream results. Some rare few, not me to be sure, get raves from almost everyone.
Forcing comments for low scores will simply get either "this sux", or a score that reflects the individual's lack of time or interest in commenting. Comment on a 1, 2, or 3? Fine it's a 4.
I'm still shooting to please me, though I don't even do that all the time. My favorite comment was from one individual who told me how poor my picture was, and to this very day has never submitted a picture.
I try to be constructive and supportive in my comments. It is always looks easier after the challenge is over.
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02/25/2004 10:58:23 AM · #61 |
| I'm really new here, and I haven't done much voting yet. Actually...only voted for a few on the last challenge and the current challenge. I'm beginning to see that I am probably an easy vote...I like a lot of the photos I see...but that's okay by me. As a new person to this site...I first look at how well the picture reflects the topic in my opinion, and then at the technical aspects. I am not by any means a knowledgeable photographer and only comment on things that stand out to me. I have given one "1" vote...to a picture I personally found distasteful and not at all related to the topic. But that's just my personal opinion...which is what the vote is, right? Isn't it a reflection of what the viewer thinks of the picture, both technically and in relation to the topic? Do I have the wrong approach here? |
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02/25/2004 01:13:30 PM · #62 |
I noticed the number of PMs I get after voting is going down and are less argumentative on every challenge. I think I only got 1 reply on the textures challenge and that was a sarcastic "tell me what you really think" type of message that made me laugh. I may have gotton a little nicer on my commenting or maybe people are getting use to it?
Don't be afraid to leave negative comments. I've learned a lot from the negative comments I have received in the short time I've been here and I want to keep getting them. |
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02/25/2004 01:22:18 PM · #63 |
Originally posted by ambaker:
I really don't worry about a few ones. At least not as long as there aren't tons of them. If you are operating near the edge, I would say that you might find high end and low end votes (love it/hate it) as opposed to doing more mainstream work, with mainstream results. Some rare few, not me to be sure, get raves from almost everyone.
Forcing comments for low scores will simply get either "this sux", or a score that reflects the individual's lack of time or interest in commenting. Comment on a 1, 2, or 3? Fine it's a 4.
I'm still shooting to please me, though I don't even do that all the time. My favorite comment was from one individual who told me how poor my picture was, and to this very day has never submitted a picture.
I try to be constructive and supportive in my comments. It is always looks easier after the challenge is over. |
Keep in mind that lots of folks don't enter -
doesn't mean they arent able to give a good critique.
"this sux" |
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02/25/2004 01:42:11 PM · #64 |
Catherine,
Thank you for bringing this up. I finally got brave and entered one picture in Road Signs about a month ago. It wasn't the numbers that bothered me as much as the way a couple people were REALLY snotty in what they said. One woman was a real jerk, and when I looked at her portrait and her pictures, I wondered how she regarded herself as such an expert. so I am no longer submitting photos. But I learn alot from looking at the submissions.
Good luck. And I hope you don't draw the wrath of the Hag from California who pooped all over me.
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02/25/2004 02:31:06 PM · #65 |
Originally posted by wagnes:
Catherine,
Thank you for bringing this up. I finally got brave and entered one picture in Road Signs about a month ago. It wasn't the numbers that bothered me as much as the way a couple people were REALLY snotty in what they said. One woman was a real jerk, and when I looked at her portrait and her pictures, I wondered how she regarded herself as such an expert. so I am no longer submitting photos. But I learn alot from looking at the submissions.
Good luck. And I hope you don't draw the wrath of the Hag from California who pooped all over me. |
Don't give up submitting! Email and online forums, including comments are a form of communication where there's no non-verbal cues, so sometimes we interpret things in our own way, not knowing the true spirit by which it was intended. I read all the comments on your photo, and most looked sincere in their intention to critique or at least offer their feelings or a spot of light hearted humor. Always assume the sarcasm is meant in good fun, not a personal attack, and you won't get upset about it. As to negative comments, if you submit you have to expect negative criticism, and you should remember that when backed up with specifics, it's actually more useful than a bunch of "nice photos". People are voluntarily adding comments, and sometimes they don't sugar coat it. People should try to take the time to at least soften it and say "IMHO, this.." or "you might try to ...". I personally don't think people need to comment "I don't like this", because their vote tells you this in a non-personal way. If they say, "I don't like this because..." then we are getting more useful. |
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02/25/2004 02:56:16 PM · #66 |
I considered quitting this site, but am sticking it out. if the scores are any indication, I am improving. However, i have been bothered at times by some comments, but in the textures challenge one commment on my pic was 'less cropping, pull back show more'and the very next one was 'crop more, get closer'. So i take them all with a grain of salt. I put more weight on those that are expecially useful (few) and i really appreciate the 'i llke this pic' type of comment (more please!), they only reinforce my current behavior, which may or not make me a better photographer.
as to voting, i changed my methodology this time. I scroll down past the title and look at the pic.While i have been averaging less then i give, i gave the best pic a 10 this time. I moved several into the 9s, 8s etc. the ones that i left my cut and past comment (regarding them not evoking the concept of 'conflict' witout a title) got a 1 or maybe a 2 if they were good pics, but not on target, subject wise. While this week's 10 may not be a 10 overall, it is a 10 for THIS competition, etc.
Those that have said 'i take pics for my enjoyment and most people don't get it' - well, then do so, but remember thre is a winner so this IS a competition.
If this were a class assignemnt or a job, many submissions would be getting Fs or their photographer fired. If all you want is to submit a nice pic of a sunset, your cat or kid then there are other sites out there for this.
chris |
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02/25/2004 03:15:18 PM · #67 |
I agree with Chris in that you shouldn't take the comments literally. (If you'd like to see some comments with a clear message that I got - take a look at my Letting Go shot LOL!)
I know things could have gotten edited by I looked through all the comments on your shot and where the author lives and I see the only comment "no kidding" that fits. I read this so differently -- not poop but rather finishing yout title "No swimming, no problem..." no kidding. Like ---right, do they really need a sign to tell you no bathing!
Just a new point of view...
Originally posted by wagnes:
from California who pooped all over me. |
Message edited by author 2004-02-25 15:17:55. |
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02/25/2004 03:23:33 PM · #68 |
| Catherine don't get down. As others have said, it is a matter of opinion. Do this for you not the web site. I do not expect ever to win a ribbon I just like the challenge of pushing me to look at things in a different way. |
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02/26/2004 11:55:31 AM · #69 |
Originally posted by nosher:
Catherine don't get down. As others have said, it is a matter of opinion. Do this for you not the web site. I do not expect ever to win a ribbon I just like the challenge of pushing me to look at things in a different way. |
It keeps me taking pix, and thinking, trying new things. For another web site the challenge is local landscape. Well, here it is winter, and every landscape i see is mud brown and dead. How can i make an appealing photo of that? I have tried some night shots with less than entry level results. I have one more thought to try but the sun must cooperate.
As for silence..i have lots of ideas. Some are plain BAD, but i bet i will see them submitted (as in a jackhammer - 'absence of silence' , a head shot of a person 'sitting in silence', or a still life af anything 'it was silent when i took this pic', etc.)
I just need to find the one thing i need in the pic...a scavenger hunt! Now this is why i keep coming back!
chris
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02/29/2004 03:55:20 AM · #70 |
| yeah i get soo many ones i know its sucky but liek look at the winning pics they get ones too, like the 3rd one for texture got a one, and like one time i got a comment on my photo and all it said was "weak, weak, weak" and im like well that wasnt very helpfull buddy, u coulda just kept ur mouth shut, i mean whats the point in a comment like that? |
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03/03/2004 08:47:37 PM · #71 |
I think people have higher expectations of the masses than are reasonable. People hold different values important when it comes to photography. What some people are asking is that everyone look at each photograph as objectively as possible while you rate it. This is absurd- emotions and preferences have everything to do with photography and voting. If you don't like a photograph, don't let this rant sway your vote. Everyone is entitled their protected opinion.
1s are as acceptable as 10s.
Message edited by author 2004-03-03 21:00:19. |
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03/03/2004 10:14:12 PM · #72 |
Originally posted by JumboJim:
...What some people are asking is that everyone look at each photograph as objectively as possible while you rate it. This is absurd- emotions and preferences have everything to do with photography and voting. If you don't like a photograph, don't let this rant sway your vote. Everyone is entitled their protected opinion... |
There's nothing absurd about attempts at objectivity. While many may vote as if in a popularity contest, others may prefer to examine and study a picture.
A good photo, like a good painting or poem, is a composition of facts, which are, indeed, fit for examination. Apart from the visual data immediately available from an image, even feelings, emotions, yes, even intellect is measurable to a fair degree. The scientific method of comparing one slide of a specimen to another is as good for assessing pieces of art as it is for studying marine life. What 'is' different is the job description of respective lab workers.
A poet will have a more thorough understanding of cultural sense, the nature of feelings etc. than, say, a marine biologist or auntie Peggy's hair stylist. A painter may bring a workable understanding of certain aspects of light or composition, a physicist may lack.
Many ordinary people, like you and me, approach photographs with a passion and a heightened artistic sense, which also qualifies them to make reasonable comparisons between one image and another.
If, in addition to knowing a little about a given piece, it also appeals to our very own elective tastes and preferences, well then... we love it when things come together.
Message edited by author 2004-03-03 22:16:37.
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03/03/2004 11:07:10 PM · #73 |
I did my first entry couple days ago, for silence...but my pic is too small for ppl to see so i got an avarage of 4...called Time Out...i tried reducing the size of my pic but it still sayed it was too big LOL...ohh well still have other contests that i can get a chance to figure things out
BTW..my original pic was 1200 by 1700...then reduced so that the larger side went to 640 but when i submited the photo, it said the image size was to big and i wasn't sure what to do so i went even smaller till it accepted it :( |
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03/03/2004 11:16:41 PM · #74 |
Originally posted by elsapo:
I did my first entry couple days ago, for silence...but my pic is too small for ppl to see so i got an avarage of 4...called Time Out...i tried reducing the size of my pic but it still sayed it was too big LOL...ohh well still have other contests that i can get a chance to figure things out
BTW..my original pic was 1200 by 1700...then reduced so that the larger side went to 640 but when i submited the photo, it said the image size was to big and i wasn't sure what to do so i went even smaller till it accepted it :( |
Are you using any type of post-production programs to downsize: Photoshop,Elements,Paint Shop Pro? You can go to forum search and find details on downsizing. |
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03/03/2004 11:22:04 PM · #75 |
| faidoi...yes i used photoshop...and i'll try to find the details about down sizing for next time :) .....but i don't think you can fix your pic when its in the contest :( so i'll know for next time..after all its just my first entry ... thanx for you help :) ...g2g sleep now...big chemistry test tomorrow |
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