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06/06/2007 09:23:20 PM · #101 |
Originally posted by rinac:
Originally posted by TechnoShroom:
It's a matter of perspective. Not getting voted higher because you aren't a "friend" is equivalent to intentionally voting other images lower. Voting to manipulate the score is troll voting. So if the shoes fit... |
What makes you think you're not getting voted highly? [example] It doesn't necessarily follow that if I vote a friend 10, that I am going to vote all others lower. |
I never commented about the votes I've received. Voting a "friend" higher (friend voting) implies that the non-friend vote is lower. Follows quite nicely. |
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06/06/2007 09:25:48 PM · #102 |
you know i started on this site a year ago. because my friends used to tell me, that i was a great photograph, my highest score for almost 8 month was a 5.7 that i reached once and never dreamt of again.
i used to get pissed as why my pictures are getting killed when obviously my circle of friends(that know nothing about photography to start with) loved it.
then i got a 6.2, and realize that's it not a consiparacy, i started to look more into my pictures, the weakneses, and i realized the mistakes and how to improves , and it's been more than 2 month that i have not gotten a 4, i know by some standards that's so easy, for a self taught beginer that was an achievement.
maybe a 6 is not a bad picture , in fact probably it's great, BUT, the truth is , there is better, do we REALLY want to reject the fact that there is better? and consider ours the best? i know i don't, i am slowly getting better and one day i hope i can reach that level.
now granted there are different tastes and some pics appeal more to some than others, but the whole point is to appeal to as many as you can.
recently in the religion challenge i submitted a pic i was expecting a 6 , i ended up with a 5.4, i was kinda pissed but a great comment from graphicfunk explained to the weakness, and now that i see it i agree.
bottom line this site is about learning on many levels, and hte best way to do that is to be honest with ourselves first otherwise no chance for improvement, trolls or no trolls everyone is suffering the same fate, pics for scalvert , librodo, kiwiness among others have gotten 1's and 2's and still ribboned. friends pushing our scores up are hurting us more than helping us.
bottom line just keep shooting and enjoy the ride!
cheers,
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06/06/2007 09:26:13 PM · #103 |
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06/06/2007 09:27:00 PM · #104 |
Being suspended on DPC is like being tossed in Jail...
by Walker Spaight
Message edited by author 2007-06-06 21:28:19.
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06/06/2007 09:28:41 PM · #105 |
Originally posted by Lowcivicman99:
Being suspended on DPC is like being tossed in Jail... |
You become a stereotypical foreigner? |
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06/06/2007 09:32:21 PM · #106 |
Originally posted by TechnoShroom:
Originally posted by Lowcivicman99:
Being suspended on DPC is like being tossed in Jail... |
You become a stereotypical foreigner? |
OMG HAHAHAHAHAHA OMG I have never laughed so flipping hard in my life. That is the funniest thing I have ever read. hahahahahahaha
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06/06/2007 09:33:21 PM · #107 |
I am saddened that the same Steve that hundreds on this site were so worried about and expended such energy to find when he went missing awhile back ...
is the same Steve that has apparently lost his sanity as evidenced by this issue. Steve, you are spending the currency of good will towards you ...
and by my accounting, you're essentially bankrupt at this point. Recant. Apologize. Do your time. We'll welcome you back.
Would it be possible to move along now? |
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06/06/2007 09:35:30 PM · #108 |
i think its a good idea to get this thread back on topic. Steve is welcome to speak to SC about his suspension, and of course, he's also welcome to enter and vote once his suspension is up.
thanks for your co-operation, everyone.
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06/06/2007 09:37:59 PM · #109 |
Originally posted by TechnoShroom:
I never commented about the votes I've received. Voting a "friend" higher (friend voting) implies that the non-friend vote is lower. Follows quite nicely. |
Sorry, wasn't meaning to suggest you personally. I do understand what you're saying though, and sure, that may happen. But, I'm not sure it's fair to tar everyone with the same brush. Which is what speculation and conspiracy theories tend to do. I'm not condoning friend voting. I was just trying to point out that one can very well vote a friend 10 as well as many others, with no need/desire to vote down any other image. |
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06/06/2007 09:40:37 PM · #110 |
Originally posted by stdavidson:
I have no problem with being "busted", but does someone have the fortitude or GUTS to tell me why? That is what chaps my hind! |
Steve in you original thread people including myself tried to tell you what you were doing was wrong. The word “bias” was defined from dictionary to examples but you did not seem to want to get it. After reading your OP I said to myself, “what is he doing? Does he really do this? Then it hit me, you were trying to prove a point (that I think is mute) by getting busted. Then you could move on to this debate that you would have not been caught if it weren’t for you admitting to ‘friend voting’. I feel you were trying to play the SC into banning you in hopes to make a point and I still don’t see the point your trying to make.
Originally posted by stdavidson:
I wasn't "busted" until I questioned the rules. Is that right? Nope! The RULES must be defined... DO IT! |
You were busted after you admitted opening in the forums for all to see that you were a ‘friend voter’. In your words, “I’m a “Friend Voter”… there, I said it… and I’m glad! My first confession… I don’t plan to change.” I would guess to say this sparked a look into your voting patter and your confession was found to be true by the facts held within the sites vote history. Questioning the rule did not get you busted!
Originally posted by stdavidson:
If you are going to accuse and convict someone of a crime at least have the common decency to define the crime! |
The crime was defined many times and in many ways in attempts to get you to understand.
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Nobody questioned me or told me what I did wrong prior to to the 'offense' for what I was accused, tried and convicted. All, I did was question the rules? Is that right? I don't think so. I don't believe anyone else thinks that either. |
We live in a world where everyone that does wrong will not be caught, that’s a fact. And in the internet world it is magnified. You admitted to the offence then questioned the rule. So no you did more than just question the rule.
In your original thread I posted an example of friend voting using a different state and substituted it with DPC ( ). Did you read it? If so could you possibly say that judge (voter) was doing nothing wrong?
Here is the scenario I posted incase you did not see it amongst the many post.
Simplified:
You’re a judge (voter) at the Olympic games (DPChallenge). A gymnast (friend) starts her routine (takes a picture) on the balance beam (enters a challenge). She has an average routine (photograph), she bobbled a few times (photo not technically sound), didn’t go for a high difficulty performance (took a dull photograph) and she didn’t stick her dismount (had no wow factor). But yet you give her a 10 (I would call that a bias "friend" 10 vote).
Message edited by author 2007-06-06 21:42:08. |
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06/06/2007 09:42:42 PM · #111 |
Originally posted by frisca:
i think its a good idea to get this thread back on topic. Steve is welcome to speak to SC about his suspension, and of course, he's also welcome to enter and vote once his suspension is up.
thanks for your co-operation, everyone. |
Just a real quick ??? If Steve was suspended and he is in a challenge right now What happens to his image?? Also if he has on submitted to enter a challenge and the submission deadline ends prior to his suspension termination what happens to that image (since voting isn't over when his suspension will be lifted).
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06/06/2007 09:45:23 PM · #112 |
The rules are clear, you break them you pay the penalty.
Nothing to see here, move along... |
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06/06/2007 09:54:03 PM · #113 |
Originally posted by stdavidson:
All I know for sure is that I got a suspension ...What do you think about that? |
I would argue that that is exactly what you DO know and that the rest of your bantering is sheer speculation...THAT Sir is what I think about that.
Ray. |
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06/06/2007 09:59:18 PM · #114 |
Originally posted by Lowcivicman99:
Originally posted by frisca:
i think its a good idea to get this thread back on topic. Steve is welcome to speak to SC about his suspension, and of course, he's also welcome to enter and vote once his suspension is up.
thanks for your co-operation, everyone. |
Just a real quick ??? If Steve was suspended and he is in a challenge right now What happens to his image?? Also if he has on submitted to enter a challenge and the submission deadline ends prior to his suspension termination what happens to that image (since voting isn't over when his suspension will be lifted). |
If he (or anyone who gets an "entry" suspension) has an entry in, it is usually allowed to stay in. I'm not sure what your second question is asking. Most suspensions are long enough that it wouldn't be a situation. (I think, if I understand your question) |
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06/06/2007 10:01:19 PM · #115 |
Originally posted by karmat:
Originally posted by Lowcivicman99:
Originally posted by frisca:
i think its a good idea to get this thread back on topic. Steve is welcome to speak to SC about his suspension, and of course, he's also welcome to enter and vote once his suspension is up.
thanks for your co-operation, everyone. |
Just a real quick ??? If Steve was suspended and he is in a challenge right now What happens to his image?? Also if he has on submitted to enter a challenge and the submission deadline ends prior to his suspension termination what happens to that image (since voting isn't over when his suspension will be lifted). |
If he (or anyone who gets an "entry" suspension) has an entry in, it is usually allowed to stay in. I'm not sure what your second question is asking. Most suspensions are long enough that it wouldn't be a situation. (I think, if I understand your question) |
How long is a suspension???
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06/06/2007 10:04:14 PM · #116 |
Originally posted by escapetooz:
Not saying it's true one way or the other, just that the general concept is false. |
The general concept in this specific instance is NOT false. The perpetrator identified himself as such, confessed to the transgression, and evidence presented to bolster the claim of guilt... ergo the concept is certainly NOT flawed in this instance.
Ray
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06/06/2007 10:12:11 PM · #117 |
the suspension varies depending on the severity of the "infraction."
If you get two dq's within 25 entries, you will get a one week suspension from entering challenges. This can increase if you have more dq's within the 25.
In this instance (steve voting biasedly), it was a one month suspension from voting and entering.
If he had been swapping 10s with several people, had created several accounts to vote on his own image, and was voting everyone but himself a 1, he could get suspended for a year or longer. (Please note, this was NOT what happened in the steve-thing, I was just generalizing).
Suspensions can also be for different parts of the site. We have suspended forum posting privileges (most of the time just for a day or two to give them time to cool down), just from voting, just from commenting, etc.
In the five years I have been here, I can only think of a couple of people (meaning genuine users who did not have multiple accounts) who have been given a lifetime site ban. Obviously, those accounts that were "ghosts" are eliminated. AND, spammers can get the same lifetime ban. :)
That was a long answer for a short question. Sorry if it was more than you wanted to know. |
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06/06/2007 10:12:14 PM · #118 |
Originally posted by Lowcivicman99:
How long is a suspension??? |
It depends on the offense. Suspensions usually start at a week for relatively minor things and progress to more weeks, months or years for more serious violations. The worst offenders are welcome back when icicles form in the underworld. |
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06/06/2007 10:16:19 PM · #119 |
Originally posted by zaflabout:
you know i started on this site a year ago. because my friends used to tell me, that i was a great photograph, my highest score for almost 8 month was a 5.7 that i reached once and never dreamt of again.
i used to get pissed as why my pictures are getting killed when obviously my circle of friends(that know nothing about photography to start with) loved it.
then i got a 6.2, and realize that's it not a consiparacy, i started to look more into my pictures, the weakneses, and i realized the mistakes and how to improves , and it's been more than 2 month that i have not gotten a 4, i know by some standards that's so easy, for a self taught beginer that was an achievement.
maybe a 6 is not a bad picture , in fact probably it's great, BUT, the truth is , there is better, do we REALLY want to reject the fact that there is better? and consider ours the best? i know i don't, i am slowly getting better and one day i hope i can reach that level.
now granted there are different tastes and some pics appeal more to some than others, but the whole point is to appeal to as many as you can.
recently in the religion challenge i submitted a pic i was expecting a 6 , i ended up with a 5.4, i was kinda pissed but a great comment from graphicfunk explained to the weakness, and now that i see it i agree.
bottom line this site is about learning on many levels, and hte best way to do that is to be honest with ourselves first otherwise no chance for improvement, trolls or no trolls everyone is suffering the same fate, pics for scalvert , librodo, kiwiness among others have gotten 1's and 2's and still ribboned. friends pushing our scores up are hurting us more than helping us.
bottom line just keep shooting and enjoy the ride!
cheers, |
Thank you for your imput on the topic! I agree with you on most points. There is some learning to be done from the bad scores, especially when someone tells you why, which is often not the case. The problem I see happening though is many good photos that don't have the pop and wow people crave on here end up with really amateur poorly done photos and some "pop" images lacking any real interest when looked at for more than a second get elevated to great heights.
This site is really good if you want to be a stock photographer, technically proficient in the studio or as a landsape photographer but not so great if you want to expand as an artist. |
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06/06/2007 10:18:42 PM · #120 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by escapetooz:
Not saying it's true one way or the other, just that the general concept is false. |
The general concept in this specific instance is NOT false. The perpetrator identified himself as such, confessed to the transgression, and evidence presented to bolster the claim of guilt... ergo the concept is certainly NOT flawed in this instance.
Ray |
The key is the evidence. If there had been no evidence the concept certainly WOULD be flawed. A confession does not equal a conviction, a person could be lying. |
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06/06/2007 10:34:12 PM · #121 |
It hit me one day that I was judging everyone too harshly. After all, I am just a hack photographer - plus we are all taught in school that 7 out of 10 is average, 8 out of ten is good, and five or less is a failure.
I have since tried to adjust my scoring and I have gotten my average vote up to 6.3.
Yet I would certainly not expect everyone to vote the way I vote. The important thing is that everyone vote consistently within each challenge. If we all do that - the scores work out as fair as possible.
As to all the friend voting stuff - character is doing the right thing when no one is watching - so do unto others the way you would have them do unto you. Comment as much as you can.
That's all you need to know to feel good about being a part of this community.
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06/06/2007 10:41:50 PM · #122 |
Originally posted by MonicaJames:
It is such a pity site and sight to see a place wherein you cannot even vote or support your own friends, boyfriend/girlfriend, family members, etc. If this isn’t a popularity photography site, then why is this even open to public voting? |
It's not "open to public voting" -- in order to vote, you have to register and agree to certain rules, including rules about how you can vote. It should be obvious that it's not intended to be a "popularity contest" -- why else would we hide the photographers' names during voting?
The unfairness is brought about when some people vote knowing the identity of the photographer (and allow that to influence their vote either up or down), while to other voters the same photos are anonymous and their votes are based solely on artistic merit.. |
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06/06/2007 10:59:52 PM · #123 |
DPC is not a democracy. No one was born with certain inalienable rights to participate. The site belongs to Drew and Langdon and it is they, and their assigned who allow us to all play along --- IF we play within the rules they have set forth. If we don't like those rules or cannot play within them, we have a zillion other options on the internet where we can find some rules which better suit us.
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06/06/2007 11:10:16 PM · #124 |
Originally posted by escapetooz:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by escapetooz:
Not saying it's true one way or the other, just that the general concept is false. |
The general concept in this specific instance is NOT false. The perpetrator identified himself as such, confessed to the transgression, and evidence presented to bolster the claim of guilt... ergo the concept is certainly NOT flawed in this instance.
Ray |
The key is the evidence. If there had been no evidence the concept certainly WOULD be flawed. A confession does not equal a conviction, a person could be lying. |
try saying "i have a bomb" to a stewardess on an plane.
then re-think about what you said above about "a confession does not equal a conviction" and also re-think about how the SC and the site has handled the entire situation. i think it is just. |
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06/06/2007 11:13:19 PM · #125 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
It's not "open to public voting" -- in order to vote, you have to register and agree to certain rules, including rules about how you can vote. It should be obvious that it's not intended to be a "popularity contest" -- why else would we hide the photographers' names during voting?
The unfairness is brought about when some people vote knowing the identity of the photographer (and allow that to influence their vote either up or down), while to other voters the same photos are anonymous and their votes are based solely on artistic merit.. |
Mine were just questions and own thoughts to what I have read earlier. I sincerely got your point. Thank you so much for the clarification.
Message edited by author 2007-06-06 23:14:28. |
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