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11/16/2006 06:44:03 PM · #26 |
Originally posted by Hye5:
Originally posted by dsidwell:
I still can't find it in the Rules IV... |
It isn't there. It is in the new ruleset Here, which applies to challenges that begin between November 6th and November 29th. Reflections III started on November 1st, and is governed by Basic Editing IV, which does not contain that specific language. |
Thats true, the old rules were in force and they simply state you may not use the select tool. The distort tool does not make a selection. I believe the SC may need to review this decision.
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11/16/2006 06:55:57 PM · #27 |
| Distortion has never been allowed in Basic. Distortions would either involve a filter (Lens Correction) or a selection used for something other than cropping. That didn't change in the new rules, but hopefully we did make it clearer in the text. The DQ was really unfortunate though, as it was a great photo. :-( |
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11/16/2006 06:58:58 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Distortion has never been allowed in Basic. Distortions would either involve a filter (Lens Correction) or a selection used for something other than cropping. That didn't change in the new rules, but hopefully we did make it clearer in the text. The DQ was really unfortunate though, as it was a great photo. :-( |
The distort tool doesn't use a selection, it operates on all the image. Neither is it a filter.
The old rules don't forbid this at all.
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11/16/2006 07:09:15 PM · #29 |
Maybe the selection is the whole image? And the distort tool doesn't move all pixels equally and therefore against the rules, unlike rotate. Just guessing I think an SC will chime in.
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11/16/2006 07:33:12 PM · #30 |
OK, in Photoshop you cannot use the distortion transform on an image without either making a selection or having the image on a second data layer. Correct?
From the old rules
# Spot-Editing: Absolutely no spot-editing is allowed. ... the use of any type of selection tool is prohibited except to select a non-feathered, non-anti-aliased rectangular area for cropping.
# Layers: ... All other types of layers (including those that contain pixel data or masks) and all other blending methods (modes) are prohibited. Changing the opacity of an Adjustment Layer is permitted.
Thus, you could not use the distortion transform under the old rules.
Also, the old rules prohibitted any filters other than those listed, so we couldn't have used a lens correction filter. So no, I don't believe we were ever able to distort under Basic rules.
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 19:33:25.
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11/16/2006 07:49:52 PM · #31 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
OK, in Photoshop you cannot use the distortion transform on an image without either making a selection or having the image on a second data layer. Correct? |
You don't need to create a second data layer to use the distort. You could just copy and paste into a new document, which will give you just one layer that is distortable (i.e. not locked).
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11/16/2006 08:04:22 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
OK, in Photoshop you cannot use the distortion transform on an image without either making a selection or having the image on a second data layer. Correct? |
You don't need to create a second data layer to use the distort. You could just copy and paste into a new document, which will give you just one layer that is distortable (i.e. not locked). |
or to unlock the bottom layer just double click on it and rename it. |
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11/16/2006 08:11:59 PM · #33 |
| The layer debate is moot IMO. The only things allowed under the Filter menu are specifically those related to noise, blur or sharpen. The rest are off-limits. |
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11/16/2006 08:17:34 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by dsidwell:
Sorry folks, rather than cropping my image, I used the Distort tool to "crop" the photo rather than diminish its full size by cropping. It appears that this is illegal. I must admit that the pilings were slightly elongated due to this, but I see the effects as subtle. |
stretching of the entire image is not allowed? what about in Advanced? Thanks |
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11/16/2006 08:18:38 PM · #35 |
Ok, hold on. I thought a filter was allowed as long as it was applied to the whole image (not just parts)? To convert to B&W, I use Channel Mixer - and I thought that was legal in Basic - no?
I need a refresher course.
Originally posted by scalvert:
The layer debate is moot IMO. The only things allowed under the Filter menu are specifically those related to noise, blur or sharpen. The rest are off-limits. |
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11/16/2006 08:20:28 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by papagei:
Ok, hold on. I thought a filter was allowed as long as it was applied to the whole image (not just parts)? To convert to B&W, I use Channel Mixer - and I thought that was legal in Basic - no?
I need a refresher course. |
channel mixer is not a "filter" - its an adjustment layer which is entirely different.
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 20:21:44.
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11/16/2006 08:20:44 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by papagei:
Ok, hold on. I thought a filter was allowed as long as it was applied to the whole image (not just parts)? To convert to B&W, I use Channel Mixer - and I thought that was legal in Basic - no?
I need a refresher course.
Originally posted by scalvert:
The layer debate is moot IMO. The only things allowed under the Filter menu are specifically those related to noise, blur or sharpen. The rest are off-limits. |
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That would be called an adjustment layer not a filter. Although the tranform tools seem to be referred to here as filters when they are not.
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 20:22:39.
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11/16/2006 08:20:47 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by papagei:
Ok, hold on. I thought a filter was allowed as long as it was applied to the whole image (not just parts)? To convert to B&W, I use Channel Mixer - and I thought that was legal in Basic - no?
I need a refresher course.
Originally posted by scalvert:
The layer debate is moot IMO. The only things allowed under the Filter menu are specifically those related to noise, blur or sharpen. The rest are off-limits. |
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Channel Mixer is fine, it is an adjustment layer and contains no pixel data.
Too slow!
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 20:21:23.
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11/16/2006 08:22:21 PM · #39 |
From da Rules: The use of filters (or non-Photoshop equivalent) is strictly limited. Any filter or stand-alone utility designed and used to preserve the integrity of the image and/or reduce the effects of noise, scratches, etc, are permitted.
Image distortion IS considered a filter or effect. |
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11/16/2006 08:26:18 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
From da Rules: The use of filters (or non-Photoshop equivalent) is strictly limited. Any filter or stand-alone utility designed and used to preserve the integrity of the image and/or reduce the effects of noise, scratches, etc, are permitted.
Image distortion IS considered a filter or effect. |
I understand it's not allowed but the tranform tools are in no way considered filters.
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11/16/2006 08:27:32 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by yanko:
the tranform tools are in no way considered filters. |
Distorting your image is an effect, which isn't allowed in Basic. How you do it is irrelevant. |
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11/16/2006 08:37:44 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by yanko:
the tranform tools are in no way considered filters. |
Distorting your image is an effect, which isn't allowed in Basic. How you do it is irrelevant. |
Anything you do in photoshop produces an "effect". Inverting is legal and that creates a HUGE effect. It's surely not maintaining the "integrity" of the photo yet that is allowed as is curves, blur, unsharp mask and a host of others that can be used to create "effects" in your image. IMO, using the transform tools to correct barrel distortion for example speaks to the spirit of the basic rules far more than most of what is allowed. Granted, that is not why it was used here.
ETA: I'm bored so I'm playing devil's advocate. :P
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 20:46:08.
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11/16/2006 08:45:53 PM · #43 |
| Inverting, levels & curves affect color and tone, which are allowed. Blur and Unsharp Mask are specifically allowed. Distorting an image is not the same kind of edit, nor was it used correctively. |
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11/16/2006 08:46:13 PM · #44 |
 scalvert  yanko LOL, I need to quit procrastinating.
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11/16/2006 08:49:19 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Blur and Unsharp Mask are specifically allowed. |
Dare I ask why? :P Seriously, what's the logic? Neither are used to maintain photographic integrity.
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11/16/2006 08:50:38 PM · #46 |
I think this is more like it.
I don't have nearly enough force to take him. :P
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 20:53:05.
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11/16/2006 08:53:34 PM · #47 |
Not taking sides here, just because I like giving scalvert a hard time, GO Richard yanko!
:)))) *HUGE GRIN*
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 20:53:51. |
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11/16/2006 08:54:07 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by yanko:
Dare I ask why? |
Because the rules say so. ;-P
The Basic Rules allow global edits that enhance the quality of the image as-captured. They allow adjustment of color, tonality, degree of sharpness and noise removal. Other than cropping, they don't allow anything that would "physically" change the content of the image (cloning, distortion, etc.). |
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11/16/2006 08:55:55 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by ursula:
I like giving scalvert a hard time |
Who doesn't? :-/ |
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11/16/2006 09:02:48 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by ursula:
I like giving scalvert a hard time |
Who doesn't? :-/ |
And he bites so well!! |
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