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11/01/2006 04:13:55 PM · #76
Whether or not any entry is post processed, the bottom line will always be; do the voters like it. We frequently see images winning ribbons that are processed far beyond the content of the original camera shot, making an image that could never visually occur in the natural world. I appreciate the talent that it takes to produce these extraordinary images! I have never seen a poor image win a ribbon at DPC regardless of post processing. No doubt there is a fine line between the appearance of 'over processing' and the perception of 'a fine photograph'. The voters are no fools, they know the difference.
11/01/2006 04:26:53 PM · #77
I hear alot of that word, emotional impact. I am curious as to what that means. Are they talking about an overprocessed image that creates oohs and aahs or are they talking about an image that evokes sadness or happiness? When i think of emotional ties, I think of images such as some of the street shots from last month. Yet when an image like that shows up in a challenge, it is hardly ever voted very highly, yet a landscape with a sky gets first place. So for me the emotional tie to the street shot is greater. I am not always dazzled by those landscape shots which seem to be commanding the boards right now. So explain what you mean by emotional ties?
11/01/2006 04:28:33 PM · #78
Originally posted by chafer:

Heida keeps being brought up. The difference between Heida and the pictures I'm referring to now is that she was actually skilled at burning. Her pictures really never looked "cheesy." That's not what I'm seeing now and wouldn't compare the pictures that are winning to what Heida was doing.


I could always spot Heida's photos while voting. They always looked heavily processed to me. Definitely not what you see with your naked eye and enhanced by natural means. She's definitely a talented artist, her style is just not my style preference. Hoooooo boy. Been away from the site for awhile and I jump right into the pot. ;)

I quit entering challenges because of the heavy processing. Even the
basics are over color saturated to the extreme in my opinion.
11/01/2006 04:34:07 PM · #79
Originally posted by Marjo:


I could always spot Heida's photos while voting...


You've touched upon an important aspect in all of this. I can also spot Heida's work, Larus's work, Scalvert's work, etc., It doesn't matter what you do whether it is post processing or pre-processing what should be important is you distinguish yourself from everyone else and so many of these processed images don't do that perhaps because a lot of them are too much tied to a certain filter like dragonizer for example. While I still struggle to find my only style I always try to stay away from presets, actions and stylized filters.

Message edited by author 2006-11-01 16:36:24.
11/01/2006 04:36:03 PM · #80
Another element might be how harshly over processed images get penalised.
If you see an image and you don't like the processing - does it really mark it down that much ? If in general, over processed images get voted up more than down, they'll just become more and more popular.
11/01/2006 06:09:06 PM · #81
Originally posted by glad2badad:

Outstanding photographer [img]

Recent entry in Trains & Railroads. It came in 42nd.

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/572/thumb/414281.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/572/thumb/414281.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

The extreme PP button sometimes works, sometimes doesn't.


Actually, it does work here if you ask me. The processing choice lends a ton of attitude to the subject. It's not "puppies and ice cream" that's why it didn't come in higher.

11/01/2006 06:11:14 PM · #82
I think sometimes they go very well...
11/01/2006 06:14:01 PM · #83
"High" saturation and "heavy" processing has been a tool for photographers way before digital. Like any tool in a toolbox, they have uses for some subjects.

Examples:

Velvia (e,g, //www.fujifilmusa.com/JSP/fuji/epartners/bin/Velvia100_Brochure_Final.pdf

Cross-processing (//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_processing)

Hmmm...I wonder if the realists had similar interchanges back when impressionism first emerged?
11/01/2006 06:26:09 PM · #84
In the old days, if a traditionalist came across a Velvia Slide Man, they would often beat him with their negative processing spools and force him to drink chemical fixer...

Message edited by author 2006-11-01 18:26:32.
11/01/2006 06:27:39 PM · #85
Keeping in mind that the site logo labeled a digital photography contest, seems the concept has strayed a touch from the original site concept. These days its more along the lines of "a digital imaging contest"

To me this site was much more inviting to a photographer when contests were based on photographic vs crative editing.
11/01/2006 06:29:01 PM · #86
'Good' post processing technique is prerequisite to a 'good' final image.
11/01/2006 06:32:01 PM · #87
Originally posted by gusto:

seems the concept has strayed a touch from the original site concept. These days its more along the lines of "a digital imaging contest"


What an absurd notion! Photography is the whole process, from concept to finished "print." Processing is just as much a part of that process now as the darkroom was with film.
11/01/2006 06:35:59 PM · #88
Originally posted by ladymonarda:

I hear alot of that word, emotional impact. I am curious as to what that means. ... I am not always dazzled by those landscape shots which seem to be commanding the boards right now. So explain what you mean by emotional ties?


The emotional tie I feel to a landscape shot is not necessarily happiness or sadness but "this photo reminds me of what its like if I were actually standing there". Maybe my opinion is skewed because I'm an outdoor person and I like seeing those vistas but that's why I like those photos.
11/01/2006 06:36:05 PM · #89
Originally posted by gusto:

Keeping in mind that the site logo labeled a digital photography contest, seems the concept has strayed a touch from the original site concept. These days its more along the lines of "a digital imaging contest"

To me this site was much more inviting to a photographer when contests were based on photographic vs crative editing.


To me, you just redefined what 'photographer' means to 'someone who pushes a shutter button and stops there' then went on to assume this site has strayed.

At least to me, digital photography spans from the concept to the final jpg, it doesn't stop when the shutter is pressed.
11/01/2006 06:40:47 PM · #90
I'm an overprocessor and proud of it! :) But everyone has their own styles and learning to use Photoshop takes quite a bit of time. To each their own, I say...
11/01/2006 06:46:45 PM · #91
Originally posted by DrAchoo:

In the old days, if a traditionalist came across a Velvia Slide Man, they would often beat him with their negative processing spools and force him to drink chemical fixer...


that's true, I've got the scars to prove it :)
11/01/2006 06:48:17 PM · #92
Originally posted by jodiecoston:

I'm an overprocessor and proud of it! :) But everyone has their own styles and learning to use Photoshop takes quite a bit of time. To each their own, I say...


Jodie! Good to see you here.

I wonder if a lot of the dissatisfaction that seems to come out in threads like this has more to do with people growing and changing than with whether images on the front page of DPC now look more processed than they did a year or two ago. Sort of like the feeling of unrest you get when you know you should do something different, but it's so safe to stick to the same.

And if you want to talk about processing, another thing is, some images are just a very good base for a lot of processing, whereas others work without much processing. Some images look good when they look "overprocessed", others look amateurish. Same with images hardly processed. The point is, whether you "overprocess" or not is more up to your style and the image you're making. Duh!

Added: and then I read what I just typed, and think, "Oyyyyy! How 'bout saying something else really bright?" And, "What am I doing here?". Why are we even talking about this? It's so .... I don't know what.

Message edited by author 2006-11-01 18:51:48.
11/01/2006 06:54:33 PM · #93
I personally prefer photographs that are natural & not overprocessed. There are times though where processing, even to an extreme, can make the photograph. But, only if that's the effect you want. I enjoy photographing architecture & nature, both of which I prefer to process as little as possible if I'm trying to capture their natural condition. Then there are times when I wish I had the skills to lay on some of those effects....but I'm not that advanced in photoshop. I was complimented by another photographer recently on how my photographs were not "all photoshopped out", but they admitted that they process their own photos so much to where they look nothing like the original. Oh, they also purchased a photo from me :).
There is a place for both. It really depends on the photographer & what they are envisioning when they shoot the photo. As far as popularity goes, it depends on individual taste. It would be nice to have some challenges that along with the subject might also state minimal processing...... balance it out a little :).
11/01/2006 07:03:20 PM · #94
Originally posted by DrAchoo:

In the old days, if a traditionalist came across a Velvia Slide Man, they would often beat him with their negative processing spools and force him to drink chemical fixer...


We always referred to it as "Velveeta" because it was so cheesy.
11/01/2006 07:04:19 PM · #95
I prefer images to 'LOOK' as though there has been a light touch on post processing, but I'm a realist and know that to get this the author has to be very very skilled in PS (or GIMP, or whatever).

Even the natural images on the front page will have had hours of PS work, just very good PS work.

If you want to change this then I think you are swimming against the tide, though you are welcome to try.
11/01/2006 07:12:10 PM · #96
Originally posted by Gordon:

Originally posted by gusto:

Keeping in mind that the site logo labeled a digital photography contest, seems the concept has strayed a touch from the original site concept. These days its more along the lines of "a digital imaging contest"

To me this site was much more inviting to a photographer when contests were based on photographic vs crative editing.


To me, you just redefined what 'photographer' means to 'someone who pushes a shutter button and stops there' then went on to assume this site has strayed.

At least to me, digital photography spans from the concept to the final jpg, it doesn't stop when the shutter is pressed.


I think what some people are saying and what photography schools are saying and what art directors and editors are saying is that there is a hell of a lot that should go on BEFORE the shutter is pressed. And, there seems to be a desire to do a lot AFTER the shutter is pressed to make up for not doing a lot before the shutter is pressed.

Educating yourself about the basic structure of good composition, looking for the technical aspects and design characteristics within a scene, looking for the light rather than faking it later and waiting for the moment to happen rather than forcing the image to meet your time schedule. There is a lot to photography before the the shutter is pressed and the pixels start to become manipulated in the graphic design step..(which is different than the photography step).

Yeah..I said it and I stand by it...graphic design is not photography. Graphic design and even darkroom work are not "Photography" which is the art of capturing light and the moment and seeing. I am not saying Darkroom and photoshop technique are not integral to photography but they are not photography per se.

Here is another link to Sport Shooters judging of one of their photo contests and what you hear being discussed is not how well processed the photos are but how well they are created...before the shutter is released.

Sports Shooters Judging Video.
11/01/2006 07:35:02 PM · #97
Yeah, hokie!! :)
11/01/2006 07:36:12 PM · #98
' . substr('//www.33smiley.com/smiley/humor/6.gif', strrpos('//www.33smiley.com/smiley/humor/6.gif', '/') + 1) . '

I'm out of popcorn.
11/01/2006 07:48:52 PM · #99
Completely agree but what do you do; People want what they want and that is unreal colours on everything :shrug:
11/01/2006 08:08:15 PM · #100
Originally posted by hokie:

..."Photography" which is the art of capturing light and the moment and seeing.


The capturing part ends when the shutter closes. You have nothing to show others until you process a print or screen image. Must be one of those "dark" arts. :-/
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