Is DPC Voting Really Anonymous? - DPChallenge Forums

Carl Zeiss Planar T 50mm f/1.7

10/09/2006 03:29:12 PM · #1

In several recent challenges I have noticed that some of the ribbon winners have used elements (model, subject, location, a unique border style, etc...) that have been used by the photographer in other challenges where they have won a ribbon. These elements are unique and easily identify the photographer that took the image. Ribbon winning DPC Photographers and the elements they use get exposure on the main page that other photographers who have not won ribbons won't receive. These repetitious elements can "brand" the photographer's images just as elements used in commercial advertisements like an advertising icon or music or a slogan (ie...the Gecko and the caveman for Geiko, The Real Thing for Coke, You deserve a Break today for .... well you get the point ). There are ribbon winning photos in each challenge on this week's Home Page that have elements of a ribbon winning photographer's "Brand".

IMHO - if a photographer's "brand" of images is easily identified in the challenges because of repetive use of certain elements, isn't it possible that the popularity of that photographer can influence the vote?

So my question remains .... Is DPC voting really anonymous?

Thoughts?

PS... This discussion is not meant to impune the character or ethics of the photographers that utilize this approach in their photography.

tryals15

Canon EOS-1Ds Mark II

10/09/2006 03:30:28 PM · #2

Not really anything you can do about that...

mist

Canon EOS-60D

Canon EF 28-135mm F/3.5-5.6 IS USM

10/09/2006 03:33:10 PM · #3

If someone is that good, then they are that good. You can't really legislate against a particular style.

lowonenergy

Canon EF 28-135mm F/3.5-5.6 IS USM

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

10/09/2006 03:37:44 PM · #4

My votes go by first impression, i'm not influed by the winners that are placed at the homepage. Sometime you can recon a photo yes, but for me it's not something I take with me during a vote.

mist

Canon EOS-60D

10/09/2006 03:40:10 PM · #5

Originally posted by lowonenergy:

My votes go by first impression, i'm not influed by the winners that are placed at the homepage. Sometime you can recon a photo yes, but for me it's not something I take with me during a vote.

I'd also agree with this. I've not been here long enough to really start to recognise folk's photos. I imagine after I while I will start to, but even then it would only be a fleeting thought and, I think, would be unlikely to alter my vote in either direction, which is based on the photo alone.

If I personally knew the photog as well.. well, that's another story.

ursula

Fujifilm X-T2

Fujifilm XF 55-200mm f/3.5-4.8 R LM OIS

10/09/2006 03:46:36 PM · #6

You can't avoid recognizing some of the photographers' images during voting, there just isn't a way to avoid it barred telling the particular photographer to not enter images anymore or to change their style, and that just wouldn't be right.

Popularity and recognition are both a blessing and a curse; they work three ways - some people are not affected by it, others will be more inclined to vote the image higher, others to vote the image lower. In the end it evens out I think.

What's fun though is when someone "thinks" they recognize a photographer, and don't :)

Message edited by author 2006-10-09 15:47:04.

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

10/09/2006 03:51:24 PM · #7

Considering that those same elements, styles and models can often be found in the photographers' low-scoring entries too, it should be obvious that people really do tend to vote on the photo rather than the photographer.

Message edited by author 2006-10-09 15:51:42.

scarbrd

Leica M10

Leica 35mm f/1.4 Summilux M Aspherical MF - Black

10/09/2006 03:53:52 PM · #8

I think we should bar Canon Beach photos and DrAchoo. ;-)

Doc knows I'm kidding!

posthumous

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

10/09/2006 04:00:00 PM · #9

My tendency, contrarian that I am, is to vote lower for popular photographers. In fact, I force myself to consider that this particualr photo might be a struggling novice trying a new technique, which engenders in me more sympathy.

yanko

Carl Zeiss 50mm ZE f/1.4 Planar T for Canon

10/09/2006 04:26:15 PM · #10

Originally posted by seenosun:

IMHO - if a photographer's "brand" of images is easily identified in the challenges because of repetive use of certain elements, isn't it possible that the popularity of that photographer can influence the vote?

I would say 100% yes. If you know who it is or think you know of course it's going to influence your vote to some degree. How much? Who knows? Besides it may all just cancel out. If anything I would say it hurts the photographer more than it helps especially if the photographer is shooting a self portrait. I've seen plenty of cases of photographer self portraits not doing as well as their other "portrait" work despite being photogenic themselves.

DrAchoo

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

10/09/2006 04:31:18 PM · #11

Originally posted by scarbrd:

I think we should bar Canon Beach photos and DrAchoo. ;-)

Doc knows I'm kidding!

Haha!

I think this is inevitable. I have three models (my wife and two kids) and use them regularly. Wait, I can do self-portraits too. At least there are four or five photogs who have access to Cannon Beach. I'd call that place Zoomdak's and not mine. :)

There was a former member (he-who-should-not-be-named) who was amazingly good at picking out people's shots. I was always amazed. I can do it a bit, but am usually wrong as often as I am right. I will agree with whomever said that it cuts both ways. I bet there are some voters who vote low on a recognizable shot. Another former member (she-who-should-not-be-named) said that she voted low on shots with people in them JUST IN CASE people were recognizing them and voting them high. I'm sure she's not the only one...

Message edited by author 2006-10-09 16:32:04.

theSaj

Canon EOS-20D

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

10/09/2006 04:41:38 PM · #12

You mean photographer's like this?

Graphicfunk has often been featured in his photographs. But I think few would argue that they were not excellent photos worthy of their scores.

scarbrd

Leica M10

Leica 35mm f/1.4 Summilux M Aspherical MF - Black

10/09/2006 04:42:16 PM · #13

Originally posted by DrAchoo:

Originally posted by scarbrd:
I think we should bar Canon Beach photos and DrAchoo. ;-)

Doc knows I'm kidding!

Haha!

I think this is inevitable. I have three models (my wife and two kids) and use them regularly. Wait, I can do self-portraits too. At least there are four or five photogs who have access to Cannon Beach. I'd call that place Zoomdak's and not mine. :)

There was a former member (he-who-should-not-be-named) who was amazingly good at picking out people's shots. I was always amazed. I can do it a bit, but am usually wrong as often as I am right. I will agree with whomever said that it cuts both ways. I bet there are some voters who vote low on a recognizable shot. Another former member (she-who-should-not-be-named) said that she voted low on shots with people in them JUST IN CASE people were recognizing them and voting them high. I'm sure she's not the only one...

My wife is starting to get recognized. I try to convince her I need to interview new models. She just doesn't understand my art.

dmadden

Canon EOS-40D

Sigma 24-35mm f/2 DG HSM A

10/09/2006 04:52:56 PM · #14

[quote=seenosun]
So my question remains .... Is DPC voting really anonymous?

Does'nt really matter to me. But I have a simple solution to scratch that itch.
Do like they do in certain parts of asia.
"IF WE CANT BEAT IT, WE COPY IT"

jus my 2cents :)

goc

Apple iPhone 4

10/09/2006 05:22:37 PM · #15

Originally posted by david madden:

"IF WE CANT BEAT IT, WE COPY IT"

awesome. let's do it. :-)

Artyste

Sony Ericsson W810i

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Pentax

10/09/2006 05:30:06 PM · #16

This has always been a part of DPC.. However, you also have "copycatters" now as well.. (although less so when it comes to recognizable human models).

Librodo, Zoomdak/Dr.Achoo/Other Oregonians, Elsapo, Graphicfunk, Calliopekel, myself... many others..

We've all tried to play on the "Maybe people will recognize this" card.. and sometimes it works, and sometimes it backfires bad.

Well.. if you're librodo, it never backfires bad ;)

Anyway.. it's a part of the contest, and I used to be angry about it once upon a time.. but I realized that if you can't beat 'em, join 'em..

Don't be angry at the playa.. be angry at the mass of people on this site that can't seem to ever choose something other than the comfortable/familiar/safe bet.. Silly voters.

10/09/2006 05:32:30 PM · #17

I am recognized by some when I use myself and unfortuanatly for everyone I don't have alot of other choices. My wife is in alot of hers and our daughter doesn't really listen to me so she is in alot of my wife's as well. In the end I think I get fair scores from most of the people that recognize me but I know that some people don't like me and vote down. All in All it doesn't really matter IMO.

10/09/2006 05:40:54 PM · #18

Originally posted by theSaj:

You mean photographer's like this?

Graphicfunk has often been featured in his photographs. But I think few would argue that they were not excellent photos worthy of their scores.

I feel this is NOT an example of what I am discussing. in most of these images the subject is disguised or shows only a partial look at the face. I would use graphicfunk as an example of how to use the same model without making it obvious that it is the same model.

Message edited by author 2006-10-09 17:41:45.

10/09/2006 05:45:10 PM · #19

Originally posted by seenosun:

but many of the people voting then knew it was him does it matter that he was recognized or that his style was.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

10/09/2006 06:03:47 PM · #20

Originally posted by Elvis_L:

Originally posted by seenosun:

I feel this is NOT an example of what I am discussing. in most of these images the subject is disguised or shows only a partial look at the face. I would use graphicfunk as an example of how to use the same model without making it obvious that it is the same model.

but many of the people voting then knew it was him does it matter that he was recognized or that his style was.

So to summarize the secret to success on DPC:
1) develop a style that identifies your work as yours to the voters
2) build your fan base through positive comments on the work of others so you can improve your chances of a positive vote.
3) and there's nothing that can be done about it.

Message edited by author 2006-10-09 18:16:03.

DrAchoo

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5

10/09/2006 06:17:36 PM · #21

Originally posted by seenosun:

It's seems funny to me... I don't know if this is a result of this thread but one of the photographers/ribbon winners that led me to start this discussion just changed the layout of their profile page. The profile page was originally three photos wide. Under the "highest Rated photo" section Photos 2 and 3 were almost the exact same photo with only a slight variation. By changing the portfolio to two images wide the repetitous element factor (ie... the photographer's brand) is not as obvious because the third photo is no longer shown on the profile page. hmmm.

Everybody is having trouble with that right now. The photographer doesn't control his/her layout anyway, YOU control how many you see. For example, I have the setting of 10 images per row. That means on everybody I look at I see their Top 10, but you could look at the same one and see 4. However, right now, everybody is seeing one less than usual (see this thread)

10/09/2006 06:19:29 PM · #22

Originally posted by seenosun:

Originally posted by Elvis_L:

Originally posted by seenosun:

I feel this is NOT an example of what I am discussing. in most of these images the subject is disguised or shows only a partial look at the face. I would use graphicfunk as an example of how to use the same model without making it obvious that it is the same model.

but many of the people voting then knew it was him does it matter that he was recognized or that his style was.

So to summarize the secret to success on DPC:
1) develop a style that identifies your work as yours to the voters
2) build your fan base through positive comments on the work of others so you can improve your chances of a positive vote.
3) and there's nothing that can be done about it.

It's seems funny to me... I don't know if this is a result of this thread but one of the photographers/ribbon winners that led me to start this discussion just changed the layout of their profile page. The profile page was originally three photos wide. Under the "highest Rated photo" section Photos 2 and 3 were almost the exact same photo with only a slight variation. By changing the portfolio to two images wide the repetitous element factor (ie... the photographer's brand) is not as obvious because the third photo is no longer shown on the profile page. hmmm.

actually there was something just changed that makes all profile pages show 1 less than they were before. and BTW you decide how many you see not them.

on the other thing you can't tell me with a straight face that graphicfunk is not good. he got his socres on his own merits as do most that are recognized. many of the same people ribbon because they take shots that the voters like.

10/09/2006 06:24:53 PM · #23

i saw that the images on all profiles changed to two across. I edited my post to delete that statement. That observation was my mistake. I have 3 images across selected in my preferences but I'm only able to see 2 images. I have checked another browser. It must be an issue with the DPC system.

pineapple

Canon EOS-5D

10/09/2006 06:26:52 PM · #24

A sort of related question: what do site council members with their extra coded privileges on the site see that mere members cannot see - especially during voting periods? Curiosity has begged me to ask this questions for many months and I have said nothing until now.