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DPChallenge Forums >> Challenge Announcements >> "Free Study XII" results recalculated
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09/12/2006 12:15:46 PM · #1
The image formerly in 5th place has been disqualified because the photographer used ACD Systems to transfer a JPG original from camera to computer, and the dates on the original were invalidated.

Please make sure to remember that files that have been saved or altered with any editing or transfer software are NOT originals.

09/12/2006 12:18:27 PM · #2
Ohhhh man! Bummer!
09/12/2006 12:18:42 PM · #3
Chit, I hate to see that happen :-(

R.
09/12/2006 12:20:27 PM · #4
It is a total bummer.

Just so nobody wonders, we have an original, but the dates were "messed up", and we couldn't use it to validate the image. I have absolutely no doubt that it is the original though.

09/12/2006 12:20:29 PM · #5
:( Too bad. Gary, Gary, Gary... you know better.... total bummer.
09/12/2006 12:22:20 PM · #6
Gaaaaaarrrryyyy! Oh man, that sucks to lose a Top 5 in a Free Study. My heart goes out to ya. On the other hand, you were likely relieved to have a shot DQ'd which only came in 5th. Also, my shot is now 193rd!!! Woo hoo!
09/12/2006 12:48:33 PM · #7
damn cheaters

:)
09/12/2006 01:10:13 PM · #8
What the heck is transfer software doing modifying the file anyway?? We should DQ the software company.
09/12/2006 01:10:30 PM · #9
Originally posted by DrAchoo:

...you were likely relieved to have a shot DQ'd which only came in 5th.


Now that's funny (and potentially true). ;-)
09/12/2006 01:19:28 PM · #10
OH bummer! What a beautiful photo also. Sorry to hear that.

g
09/12/2006 01:46:45 PM · #11
Originally posted by ursula:

The image formerly in 5th place has been disqualified because the photographer used ACD Systems to transfer a JPG original from camera to computer, and the dates on the original were invalidated.

Please make sure to remember that files that have been saved or altered with any editing or transfer software are NOT originals.

Ursula's post is an extremely useful lesson, telling us exactly what went wrong and how to avoid the problem.

So how come that the notes under the DQ'ed photos say this - something totally different and useless:

"You must provide your original photograph when requested, along with the editing steps used to create your submission. This information must be provided within 48 hours of the request. Please review the challenge submission rules."
09/12/2006 01:56:26 PM · #12
I use ACD to drag and drop all of my files when I only shoot JPeg from my CF card. When I shoot TRAW + Small JPeg I use Windows Explorer.

I am interested to know what you did for ACD to change the data? Dont want to make the same mistake.

09/12/2006 02:13:59 PM · #13
More than one program will "update" the EXIF to reflect that the program has been used, even if just to "transfer" the files (and some programs can do more than that).

I always use a card reader and the computer's operating system (Mac, Windows, Linux ...) to drag the files from the card to the hard drive -- this will not affect the EXIF. Further, if you now burn that file to CD/DVD you will always have a backup of the true "original" file for validation ... though I do this anyway just for prudent backup/archival purposes.
09/12/2006 02:47:33 PM · #14
Originally posted by GeneralE:

More than one program will "update" the EXIF to reflect that the program has been used, even if just to "transfer" the files (and some programs can do more than that).


Perhaps all this DQ stuff can help add to the rule descriptions. I'm not talking about changing the rules, just adding information to help users. Under the section for EXIF data, maybe something like, "Programs X, Y, and Z will change your EXIF data and should not be used to transfer pictures for challenges." Or perhaps a before/after example of what happened to Sandy to show what not to do. I believe Scalvert posted something along those lines for original artwork and I found it useful.
09/12/2006 02:53:33 PM · #15
Some programs, such as Adobe Photoshop Album Starter will also alter your EXIF data when you use it to view photos and change the viewing perspective from landscape to portrait.
09/12/2006 03:22:57 PM · #16
Originally posted by Beetle:


So how come that the notes under the DQ'ed photos say this - something totally different and useless:

"You must provide your original photograph when requested, along with the editing steps used to create your submission. This information must be provided within 48 hours of the request. Please review the challenge submission rules."


because, technically, the file that was submitted was NOT an original. it was a modified version of the original.

we didn't disqualify because any editing had been done. we disqualified because the photo that was submitted couldn't be validated as an original.
09/12/2006 03:56:10 PM · #17
Originally posted by muckpond:


we didn't disqualify because any editing had been done. we disqualified because the photo that was submitted couldn't be validated as an original.

Yes, but the REASON that it couldn't be validated was the use of a particular program.

It would be actually USEFUL to us all if that was included in the comment - the way the reason is worded right now, we have no idea what went wrong.
09/12/2006 04:02:09 PM · #18
I would expect a dork like me to do something dumb like that, but not from you Gary. It's good to know you are as human as the rest of us, and that the SC plays by the book. I know this was a painful decision.

This site at times amazes me. This could have so easily been hushed and a blind eye turned, yet everyone was stand-up about it. Makes a HUGE difference in my book!

Think I would trade a DQ for all the favs though...anyone?

Message edited by author 2006-09-12 16:55:33.
09/12/2006 05:36:51 PM · #19
Umm...

Is there a way to tell if the software you use is modifying the files when you transfer them? I use the program that came with the camera so I have no idea and I can't figure out how to move the images from camera to computer another way.

I don't have a card reader and don't plan on purchasing one at this point.
09/12/2006 05:44:07 PM · #20
Originally posted by Prism:

Some programs, such as Adobe Photoshop Album Starter will also alter your EXIF data when you use it to view photos and change the viewing perspective from landscape to portrait.


I always used Adobe Photoshop Album to transfert from the card to the computer. But all editing is done with PhotoShop. When you close the picture in PS CS it brings it back as a new file in Photoshop Album and the original is still there. I had to get picture validated and didn't have problems with altered exif by PhotoShop Album.
09/12/2006 05:44:10 PM · #21
Originally posted by LucidLotus:

Umm...

Is there a way to tell if the software you use is modifying the files when you transfer them? I use the program that came with the camera so I have no idea and I can't figure out how to move the images from camera to computer another way.

I don't have a card reader and don't plan on purchasing one at this point.


submit a ticket with one of your photos and SC should be able to tell you ifit has been altered
09/12/2006 05:46:59 PM · #22
Originally posted by LucidLotus:

Umm...

Is there a way to tell if the software you use is modifying the files when you transfer them? I use the program that came with the camera so I have no idea and I can't figure out how to move the images from camera to computer another way.

I don't have a card reader and don't plan on purchasing one at this point.


When you hook the camera up to the computer with a USB cable, the computer should read it as an "external drive". Exactly what it does with a card reader. At the same time, hooking it up probably invokes your software to action. In theory, all you need to do is cancel the dialogue box the pops up, then go to "my computer" and double click on the drive icon that represents the camera; this will open up a standard drive window and display the contents of your memory card.

Create a file folder where you want the images to be transferred, then select all on the card and drag 'n drop to the waiting folder, and they will copy over. Open a few up to verify that you have clean copies, then you can erase the card by formatting it with the camera.

Robt.
09/12/2006 06:06:57 PM · #23
Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Originally posted by LucidLotus:

Umm...

Is there a way to tell if the software you use is modifying the files when you transfer them? I use the program that came with the camera so I have no idea and I can't figure out how to move the images from camera to computer another way.

I don't have a card reader and don't plan on purchasing one at this point.


When you hook the camera up to the computer with a USB cable, the computer should read it as an "external drive". Exactly what it does with a card reader. At the same time, hooking it up probably invokes your software to action. In theory, all you need to do is cancel the dialogue box the pops up, then go to "my computer" and double click on the drive icon that represents the camera; this will open up a standard drive window and display the contents of your memory card.

Create a file folder where you want the images to be transferred, then select all on the card and drag 'n drop to the waiting folder, and they will copy over. Open a few up to verify that you have clean copies, then you can erase the card by formatting it with the camera.

Robt.


When I had my last validation everything was fine and I used the software from Canon that transferred the files. I believe it's Canon Utilities and then it launches Zoombrowser for viewing. I tried the method you suggest and it was just plain buggy for me. I don't know if it was Windows or the camera, but I had to keep clicking off the camera "drive" to a different drive and back and forth a few times for it see the files. I may try it with the new camera and see if it's better.

Another thought on this whole thing that happened to Gary. Unless he wrote and re-wrote over his card, he may be able to recover the original file, even if deleted. I don't know if it would keep the EXIF intact or if it works the same with a card as a drive (assuming it would), but can't hurt to try. I have a cheapo "undelete" program I got free after rebate that does a remarkable job at recovering deleted files. It's prbably too late for Gary, but if it happens to somebody else is certainly worth a shot.
09/12/2006 06:21:29 PM · #24
Originally posted by mad_brewer:

When I had my last validation everything was fine and I used the software from Canon that transferred the files. I believe it's Canon Utilities and then it launches Zoombrowser for viewing. I tried the method you suggest and it was just plain buggy for me. I don't know if it was Windows or the camera, but I had to keep clicking off the camera "drive" to a different drive and back and forth a few times for it see the files. I may try it with the new camera and see if it's better.


I tried the same thing after reading this thread and only found odd file folders with no images in it, which is why I couldn't figure out how I'd be able to 'manually' do the transfers - there was nothing to transfer! Maybe its just the camera since I had a similar issue?

I use the Canon Utilities/Zoombrowser option as well and if it worked for you I'm going to assume its fine. :)

Thanks!

edited to fix a contraction

Message edited by author 2006-09-12 18:22:26.
09/12/2006 07:00:09 PM · #25
I use both windows explorer and the software that came with my camera, whichever takes my fancy at the time. Fortunately the software doesn't touch the exif data, in fact it displays it. I have Olympus Master.
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