Homeless Portrait - DPChallenge Forums

Sony 16-50mm f/3.5-5.6 E-mount

09/19/2003 09:22:54 AM · #1

I just wondered if anyone could pass some comment on this. I asked this guy if he would mind me taking his picture (he requested cash in exchange for this which was fine by me):

It's a delicate issue getting shots like this because it might seem as if I'm capitalising on his misery.

Message edited by author 2003-09-19 11:51:20.

jmsetzler

Sony Alpha a6000

09/19/2003 09:30:29 AM · #2

Jon, I think its an excellent shot. As far as the feeling of 'down and out', i think it could possibly be a little weak in that area. The guy actually appears to be fairly ordinary looking... not like the 'homeless' that I'm used to seeing in my own area.

When I look at this image, without your comments on it, what I see is 'camraderie' between the man and the dog. I get the impression that they are just 'hanging out' and taking a break from whatever is happening in their day. The sleeping bag or blanket in this photo is a key to making him have a 'homeless' feel though.

I think it takes 'guts' to ask someone like this if you can take their photo. I applaud you for that :) Nice work...

amsmyth

Nikon D50

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 55-200mm f/4.0-5.6G ED

09/19/2003 09:41:24 AM · #3

nice portrait...I also would wonder about 'homeless'. I walked onto Fisherman's wharf behind two men with beautiful dogs and beautiful brief cases...when they got to their respective "spots" they took off the good clothes, put on the working clothes and so forth (one of them even has a small oriental to sit on). The tip off really was the dog - very well fed and certainly not allowed in a shelter.

09/19/2003 09:59:11 AM · #4

Thanks for the comments. Perhaps I'm being too literal with that title. He actually is homeless, but that isn't the main focus of the shot for me. It is, like you say John, their camraderie that appealed to me against the backdrop of the man's situation.

09/19/2003 10:37:08 AM · #5

You are capitalising on his misery, doesn't matter which way you look at it. That's the nature of things.

As for the portrait I would say it's a local tabloid shot, there isn't much being said to me, although the dog sure doesn't look down and out. Should of got him with his hand out.

With this kind of shot you have to be brave,candid and use a good zoom lens to get the best from a situation like this. I have had people chase me down the street sometimes, and when your totting your camera it ain't so easy getting away. If you ask them the moment gets lost with a pose or awkward posture.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

09/19/2003 10:48:29 AM · #6

Candid photography is interesting. I think there is a huge difference in approaches available, depending on if you take the voyeuristic approach of using a long zoom and shooting so that the subject is unaware, or take the participatory approach of using a 50mm lens and get in to the situation and take pictures as part of what's going on.

The folk considered greats of candid and street photography typically used simple, rangefinder setups, with a wide angle or normal lens and got up close and personal with their subjects - I think that a large part of the interest in their pictures is that they don't look like surveillance pictures taken with a 300mm lens.

It's obvious which is the harder to do, but it is also pretty obvious that people are likely to react better to a participant than a voyeur.

09/19/2003 10:57:41 AM · #7

Maybe will react better Gordon but not everyone is a model and not everyone is used to having a camera pointed at them close up. I suppose it depends somewhat on the situation and the individual, but my personal experience is that it is better to be as discreet as possible to catch the real nature of the situation.

Everyday Renee

Nikon D80

09/19/2003 11:00:16 AM · #8

Since you said this guy was homeless, my heart really bleeds for the dog. People have choices, animals don't...

Heartbreaking ,simply heartbreaking!

09/19/2003 11:00:17 AM · #9

I have to disagree with Chez...

~ You're not capitalizing on his misery. You asked him with respect if you could take his picture and he said yes. Also, he doesn't look that miserable :)

~ "Getting" him with his hand out would indeed have been capitalizing, and extremely rude. If you want a shot of a homeless person 'at work', talk to them for a little while, help them out by sharing a little wealth, and ask if they mind if you take a few shots. Tell him what you're after is a natural shot of what he does with his day...

~ If you find that you have to run away from your models very often, you should be asking yourself why.

I thought this particular shot shows the benefit of asking for permission. Paparazzi would never get a shot like this. You get behind his 'job' and show him as a person. Well done!

09/19/2003 11:06:49 AM · #10

Originally posted by Everyday Renee:

Since you said this guy was homeless, my heart really bleeds for the dog. People have choices, animals don't...

Heartbreaking ,simply heartbreaking!

I wouldn't worry about the dog here. I know many homeless folks with pets and their pets receive more love and attention then most pets. I feel sorry for the dog of the rich guy that sits in an apartment all day waiting for "master" to come home... The pets of the homeless don't have 'masters', they have 'friends'... As it should be.

They also eat well... Trust me.

OneSweetSin

Nikon D3000

09/19/2003 11:08:47 AM · #11

Originally posted by Jon Lucas:

It's a delicate issue getting shots like this because it might seem as if I'm capitalising on his misery.

You are only capitalizing on his misery if you are making money from the photo and didn't pay him in some way. If all you do is share this photo and ask for comments then you are only making everyone more aware that there are homeless people everywhere.

I have a friend here who sold a photo to the newspaper of a homeless man staring in a resturant just a few days before Christmas. The paper paid him $50 for the photo. He kept $10 for himself and took the other $40 to buy gift certificates at McDonalds and gave them to the homeless man. It was the only way he knew to do it cause if had he gave the man the cash he would have spent it on alcohol and he felt the gc's for McDonalds would at least feed the man for a few days. He later found out the man went into McDonalds on Christmas Eve with 3 other homeless friends and they had a feast for the day. Can't say that homeless man didn't share his wealth.

Ready for real American story out of it all. I asked him why he kept the $10 he told me TAXES! LOL only in America.

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6

09/19/2003 11:09:53 AM · #12

Yes ok, it's polite to ask, I'll give you that, but as for the issue of if it is using someone, well I have to disagree again as I think it is, we all do it, you may say you don't but you do if whether you ask or not.

As for the dog, who's worrying!

Message edited by author 2003-09-19 11:12:55.

joanns

Fujifilm FinePix S5 Pro

09/19/2003 11:11:11 AM · #13

What I see here is "by the grace of God" that could be me. He does look like an ordinary guy. I see in him a man who has worked his whole life, had a home, perhaps a family, and found himself homeless for want of a job. He doesn't drink, do drugs and is a victim of the economy not his own doing.
It is a beautifully shot photo as well but that is secondary to the impact it has. Bravo and thanks for sharing.

Sonifo

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

09/19/2003 11:15:17 AM · #14

This is the type of homeless people we have here. I don't see men/women with shopping carts and raggity cloths walking the streets. I see young folks having a hard time finding there place in this world, with out a job and home. They want so badly to find a job, but not enough experience. To good to work at a fast food joint so they stay jobless.
It is a great shot, but I would have liked to see a candid shot of this man also.
thanks for sharing.

bod

09/19/2003 11:24:37 AM · #15

It's an excellent photo. The composition and the expression on his face make it for me.

09/19/2003 11:29:23 AM · #16

Originally posted by Chez:

I'm assuming that 'suing' was a typo and you meant 'using'?

I think that if you take a shot with a zoom from across the street than make tracks you are stealing. I have taken candid shots of street folk without prior permission, but I always make a point of 'sharing the wealth' afterward and let them know I took the shot, offering to erase it if it's a problem for them... The wealth is theirs either way...

NOTE : I'm a 6 foot 2 guy and am in little danger when I talk to these folks. I would recommend caution when approaching some homeless folks since mental health care is not a huge priority of the current administration.

Oh, as for the dog... EverydayRenee was worried :)

Message edited by author 2003-09-19 11:30:44.

09/19/2003 11:40:14 AM · #17

Stealing is a pretty strong word for taking a photograph without permission, so everytime you take a shot of someone or something your commiting a moral crime are you? Or is it ok if it has a little sign hanging around it's neck. Jeez don't make me laugh, if that were the case we would all be in prison for multiple crimes.

p.s. 'm 6 foot so you get me by two inches, guess you have never been chased tdown the street by an angry Turk, like to keep my camera safe if you know what I mean.

09/19/2003 11:41:31 AM · #18

Dang Chez, I just reread what I said and I sound a bit sanctimonious. I don't mean to imply that your technique is immoral or criminal, and I'm sorry I didn't temper my comments better. This subject is a bit near to my heart for several personal reasons.

I'm just trying to advocate treating folks on the street the same as you would treat folks anywhere else. They aren't props... When treated with respect and as equals, they will often cooperate and become fantastic models. they are also (for the most part) perfectly capable of pretending you aren't there and going about their lives so you can get 'candid' shots. Most street folk are not uptight about being looked at, since they experience it all day long.

Sorry if I sounded a bit 'holier than thou'... It's just a raw nerve for me :)

StevePax

Canon PowerShot S50

09/19/2003 11:51:01 AM · #19

Originally posted by Everyday Renee:

Since you said this guy was homeless, my heart really bleeds for the dog. People have choices, animals don't...

Heartbreaking ,simply heartbreaking!

We're looking at a picture of a man without a home, and your heart breaks for the dog?!?

dwoolridge

09/19/2003 02:38:43 PM · #20

Originally posted by myqyl:

NOTE : I'm a 6 foot 2 guy and am in little danger when I talk to these folks. I would recommend caution when approaching some homeless folks since mental health care is not a huge priority of the current administration.

This seems to reinforce the misconception that somehow people with mental health issues are more prone to violence than the rest of the population; the stats just don't bear it out.

OneSweetSin

Nikon D3000

09/19/2003 03:51:50 PM · #21

Originally posted by Chez:

Stealing sometimes is too weak of a work. What if that photo had been of a mother and a child in the park and taken without permission and posted here? Harmless as it may sound you might have just photographed a person on the run from an abusive relationship and now you just gave the abuser a location on them. Or what if that person is a very private person taking a photo without permission can often violate that person, and depending on the situation can leave the person feeling raped of part of there private life. I'm not saying don't photograph that great shot before getting premission I'm saying don't walk away without getting premission and also be willing to delete the photo if the person isn't happy with it.

That really is the difference between selling your photo to the National Inquirer or the Chicago Tribune or Sun-Times. Which do you want a supermarket rag with your photos in it or to be in the same publication as Pulitzer prize winning writers and photographers?

Everyday Renee

Nikon D80

09/19/2003 05:20:38 PM · #22

Originally posted by StevePax:

Originally posted by Everyday Renee:
Since you said this guy was homeless, my heart really bleeds for the dog. People have choices, animals don't...

Heartbreaking ,simply heartbreaking!

We're looking at a picture of a man without a home, and your heart breaks for the dog?!?

Yes, actually it does. Considering that the UK has some programs for people like this -- he doesn't have to live on the street. It is a choice. He can manage to find work, or seek help. While I realize it isn't ideal and it is a very sad situation -- the dog has no one to help him. His options are accept it or die. Much worse to me... Sorry!

Renee

09/19/2003 05:37:40 PM · #23

I'm very intrigued by the way this thread has developed, and thanks for the feedback.

For the record, the dog looked very healthy (as they so often do) - quite perky and happy, with lots of licking and tail wagging. The bloke in the shot was very loving towards him too.

I would have felt very awkward 'snatching' the shot, and I instinctively felt that asking was the better scenario. There were originally two men next to each other but one of them walked off muttering after I asked the question.

This was another (candid) shot from the same evening:

and a close-up of the man and dog (which was licking him at the time!):

His eyes do seem to tell a sad story I think.

ewall53

09/19/2003 05:44:47 PM · #24

I agree--the eyes do tell a sad story. I also saw pleading in the pathetical stare in your first photo. If anything, it's his clothes that are too clean and new in appearance that throws the homeless portrayal off.