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08/08/2006 04:33:00 PM · #1001 |
Originally posted by MrEd:
Originally posted by karmabreeze:
Originally posted by MrEd:
Well, let a man go through the drive through (mentioned earlier). Unless he frequently uses the bank and the teller knows Steve, there shouldn't be a problem. One credit union bank I use (unfotunately) gives me my balance upon every withdrawal AND deposit.
Edited to add: I have never been asked ID when depositing money, unless I'm getting money back. |
Unless they know who you are, I find that extremely frightening and would switch banks ASAP. They are violating a lot of BSA stuff that could land people in jail if they keep that up. Not joking. |
Theres no law that says you cant deposit money nto someone elses account. Dont ask for the balance, if its there....it worked. If its not, you tell Steve he owes you $20. |
That's not the problem. The problem is that they're giving an account balance without confirming that they're giving it to the account owner and therefore could very well be giving it to someone who is NOT a signer on the account and who is NOT entitled to any account information at all.
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08/08/2006 04:56:19 PM · #1002 |
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08/08/2006 05:02:22 PM · #1003 |
Has the family been able to open his mail?
Maybe there are some credit card / bank balances for month ending July that have come in the mail..
Sorry if this has been mentioned previous, its a Long Thread..
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08/08/2006 05:12:14 PM · #1004 |
| Can someone in Arizona try to call the Civil air patrol and see if they can be of help. I have been trying to call from oregon and all I am getting is a busy signal. I have checked with the operator because I thought after a few hours of only a busy signal that there might be a problem with the line but they assured me that all circuits were working it was just a very busy circuit. Same thing happened when I tried to call "Arizona track and Rescue" and the "superstition search and Rescue" both places are nonprofit for free experts in search and Rescue in the Arizona area. If someone has a min could you try calling these numbers and see if you also get a busy signal. |
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08/08/2006 05:21:05 PM · #1005 |
Here's the link again for the civil air patrol so nobody has to search thru the thread.
Civil Air Patrol, Arizona Wing
Message edited by author 2006-08-08 17:21:17.
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08/08/2006 05:28:11 PM · #1006 |
I have made many deposits into accounts without getting the info back--they will give you a receit for your deposit but will black out the personal information.
I'm in Oregon with the rest of the family and I posted a Missing Sign on my front door. Silly? Maybe, but the more eyes that see his face the more eyes that may SEE HIS FACE!!! With my nephew's approval, I may start posting in Oregon, but only if it is actually worth while.
As far as opening mail--mail fraud. Orion can't so much as touch a thing in Steve's house, or enter it, without the threat of a criminal act. It sucks but what can you do??
I just hope that my brother-in-law shows up soon. His kids really need him to be safe and present. Steve also has a beautiful granddaughter and a grandson on the way--they need him also.
On a happier note, I want some of Steve's prints!!!!! Dang it, I want to buy from him!!!!!
Jennifer, trying to find the sunshine in all this mess! |
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08/08/2006 05:40:10 PM · #1007 |
Excuse my ignorance, as I have only read a part of this thread, but at what point do the police get involved? Can't (won't) they get the necessary permissions, warrants, etc to get access to info on if he is still active on his bank accounts, etc. At what point does the FBI guy from "Without a Trace" get brought in? Or does that not really exist in non-tv life?
As to opening mail, etc, if my dad was missing for two weeks without any sign of life, you can be damn sure I'd open any mail, enter his house, and do almost anything to get the info I needed to help find him.
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08/08/2006 05:41:42 PM · #1008 |
Originally posted by ClubJuggle:
(Reminder - I'm speaking personally here and not on behalf of the Site Council)
Hey everyone,
I want to extend my personal thanks to everyone here who is helping to find Steve. Whether you're coordinating the efforts, out looking for Steve, or offering suggestions, prayers, financial or emotional support, you're doing a lot of good and I owe each of you my gratitude. Each of you is helping not out of some sense of obligation nor for any reward, but because simply each of you feels it's the right thing to do. You all should be proud of yourselves and each other for that. Once again, you all have reminded me why I value this community so much.
When I visited Arizona last year, Steve was kind enough to help show me around, so needless to say he has been dominating my thoughts lately, as he has the thoughts of many here. I totally understand, then, when I see signs that some people are starting to grow frustrated, and even when the occasional "heated exchange" happens. Still, we're all working toward the common goal of getting Steve back home safely to his friends and family, so with that in mind I'd like to offer a couple parameters that might help us reach our common goal.
1. I think we all trust that Orion, Iva, Daryl, Tina and Terry G. are operating with Steve's best interests at heart, and that they are in a better position than any of us to gauge those interests. With that in mind, we should take our cues from their reactions and from the information they provide. If they believe, for example, that the police are doing everything they can and should be doing at this point, then I think the rest of us need to accept that at face value. It's helpful to offer suggestions for possible further action, but it's not our place to second-guess decisions that those closest to Steve have stated were satisfactory.
2. We need to remember that Steve has certain rights which must be protected. As an adult, Steve has a right to take off and not tell anyone. The fact that we miss him does not diminish his rights, and in particular does not give the police or Steve's friends and family an automatic right to his medical or financial records, unless there is evidence of foul play or that Steve presents a danger to himself or others. In fact, there are laws preventing medical (HIPAA) and financial services (GLBA) providers from disclosing that information to third parties without a valid subpoena. Yes -- I know about Steve's heart condition, but again, we need to trust that Steve's close friends and family are in the best position to gauge the existence and level of danger that presents.
Put yourself in Steve's shoes here for a moment -- let's say that, for whatever reason, you needed to get away from everything for a couple weeks, and you came back to find out that the police had turned given copies of your medical and financial records to your family. Might you feel that your rights had been violated in some way? In any case, the fact that the police have not sought (or the courts have not granted) a subpoena of those records actually tells us something. It indicates that there's no evidence that Steve is in danger. That's great news.
3. When offering suggestions, we need to make sure we use available resources in the most efficient way possible. This includes taking into account the geography of the area, costs, time commitments necessary and what other options might be more productive.
Some facts that might be helpful:
- Phoenix (Mesa is a suburb of Phoenix) is the 5th most populous city in the United States. It passed Philadelphia in population in 2005.
- The Phoenix metropolitan area is the 14th most populous in the United States.
- The city of Phoenix covers 475 square miles of land (1230.5 km²), making just slightly larger (in terms of land area) as Los Angeles.
- Mesa itself, though a suburb of Phoenix, has a population of about 452,000 -- larger than the cities of St. Louis, Pittsburgh and Miami.
- Mesa covers 125 square miles of land (324 km²), slightly larger than the land area of San Francisco.
- Only 15% of Arizona's land area is privately owned. The remaining 85%, nearly 100,000 square miles (259 000 km²), consists of government forest and park land, recreation areas and Native American reservations.
As an example, someone suggested talking to people at the gas stations in the area. A phone book search returns 668 results for "Gas Station" within 25 miles of Mesa, AZ, or 811 within 25 miles of Phoenix. Expanding to 50 miles yields about 890 results. When one adds in the fact that "pay at the pump" means most gas station customers are never seen, other options start to look more productive. If one figures an average time of only 10 minutes per station (to talk to employees, post flyers, and drive between them), it would take over 100 hours just to hit the stations within 25 miles of Mesa. It's a noble suggestion, but other courses of action might be more productive.
Likewise, I looked into the cost of renting a helicopter for an aerial search. I had difficulty finding prices listed online, but one place I did find cost $220 per hour for a helicopter with pilot. We might find airplanes for half that. If we knew a general area to look, an aerial search might be an option. Right now, though, all we'd probably accomplish is blowing through a lot of money without yielding any meaningful results. Even if we can find someone willing to donate prop time, it might be better to call in that favor when we have information suggesting that we search a specific area.
Another suggestion I saw was a reward fund. I suggest we take a cue from Steve's closest friends and family on this. Right now they are requesting donations for a search fund, and not for a reward fund. This suggests that they feel that committing funds to a search will be more productive than committing them to a reward. I trust their judgment and suggest that we hold off on that idea, unless and until it's requested.
I'm not looking to single anyone out here, but I use these merely as examples.
With that in mind, I'd like to offer a couple suggestions:
1. Coordinate with Daryl and Tina as much as possible. If you're going to go out looking for Steve, they know his favorite places and might be able to suggest some places to check.
2. If possible, avoid posting private or sensitive information. If you have any such information that might be valuable, contact Daryl and Tina directly. Along with Steve's family, they can make the decision whether to post it.
3. Understand that we (Site Council) may use our ability to hide or edit posts somewhat differently than in "typical" DPC threads. This thread is insanely long, and a user who sees a post containing incorrect information might not see a later post correcting it. Since it is critical that we ensure everyone is working with accurate information, we may edit out or delete posts containing any such incorrect information, especially if Daryl, Tina, or Steve's immediate family requests that we do so. In the context of this thread, a deleted or edited post does not imply that you violated the site rules in any way. If you have a question about why whe edited or deleted any post, please do not sidetrack this thread with a discussion of it, but rather go to Help/Contact and submit a ticket there asking for clarification.
4. Stay positive! There is absolutely no evidence to suggest that any harm has come to Steve. Let's have faith that Steve is perfectly fine, and keep his family focused on a positive outcome.
Thanks,
Terry |
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08/08/2006 05:56:36 PM · #1009 |
As much as all that makes lawful sense, if I disappeared, without telling anyone anything about my leaving, and I came back after two or three weeks to find that they'd opened some mail and gotten a warrant to check some bank records, because they were hugely worried and to see if I was still active and alive, I wouldn't feel that my rights had been violated. I'd probably be alot more upset if I was in trouble somewhere, and they hadn't done it to try to find me.
Maybe that's just me.
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08/08/2006 06:00:21 PM · #1010 |
A business associate just saw Steve's story on the local news in the Portland area--I have no further info, just that she recognized his name from TV. Good, now the search widens.
Jennifer
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08/08/2006 06:02:44 PM · #1011 |
Originally posted by mariomel:
As much as all that makes lawful sense, if I disappeared, without telling anyone anything about my leaving, and I came back after two or three weeks to find that they'd opened some mail and gotten a warrant to check some bank records, because they were hugely worried and to see if I was still active and alive, I wouldn't feel that my rights had been violated. I'd probably be alot more upset if I was in trouble somewhere, and they hadn't done it to try to find me.
Maybe that's just me. |
I tend to agree. I've always believed that action, even "inappropriate" action, is better than inaction. IMO, there's nothing to lose by trying the bank idea. If they give the info, all the better for everyone. If not, nothing lost.
However, it's in the capable hands of Steve's family, and I'm sure they'll do what's best. More than anything, this is just to say that I'm still thinking of him, and hoping for the best. Even out here in VT, I have my eyes open and am watching, just in case!
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08/08/2006 06:07:50 PM · #1012 |
Originally posted by mariomel:
Excuse my ignorance, as I have only read a part of this thread, but at what point do the police get involved? Can't (won't) they get the necessary permissions, warrants, etc to get access to info on if he is still active on his bank accounts, etc. At what point does the FBI guy from "Without a Trace" get brought in? Or does that not really exist in non-tv life?
As to opening mail, etc, if my dad was missing for two weeks without any sign of life, you can be damn sure I'd open any mail, enter his house, and do almost anything to get the info I needed to help find him. |
My understanding is that without evidence of foul play, it's very difficult to get the police to take much of an active part in situations like this because, as an adult, it's completely within his rights to disappear if he chooses to.
I, too, would have no qualms about opening my parents' mail if I felt it necessary but we don't know anything about Steve's relationship with his family and given the effort I've seen here, I'm sure they are doing whatever they feel is right in this situation. |
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08/08/2006 06:24:20 PM · #1013 |
Originally posted by mk:
I, too, would have no qualms about opening my parents' mail if I felt it necessary but we don't know anything about Steve's relationship with his family and given the effort I've seen here, I'm sure they are doing whatever they feel is right in this situation. |
I'm sure you're right. They are probably doing what's appropriate.
Does anybody know if they have entered his house? Seen if he took any clothes, suitcase, toothbrush, or anything that might indicate a long journey?
Is all his camera gear gone? I would obviously take very different gear with me for a photo daytrip (1 body, 2-3 lenses, light tripod in a backpack), compared to a long stay, no matter how much I might be trying to stay under the radar. Being the photo nut I am, if I was going away for a long time, I'd probably take ALL my gear. That would give me away.
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08/08/2006 06:46:04 PM · #1014 |
Originally posted by mariomel:
Is all his camera gear gone? I would obviously take very different gear with me for a photo daytrip (1 body, 2-3 lenses, light tripod in a backpack), compared to a long stay, no matter how much I might be trying to stay under the radar. Being the photo nut I am, if I was going away for a long time, I'd probably take ALL my gear. That would give me away. |
I don't think Steve HAS a lot of gear; a Sony prosumer camera, that doesn't have interchangeable lenses, so...
R.
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08/08/2006 06:48:21 PM · #1015 |
Originally posted by mariomel:
Originally posted by mk:
I, too, would have no qualms about opening my parents' mail if I felt it necessary but we don't know anything about Steve's relationship with his family and given the effort I've seen here, I'm sure they are doing whatever they feel is right in this situation. |
I'm sure you're right. They are probably doing what's appropriate.
Does anybody know if they have entered his house? Seen if he took any clothes, suitcase, toothbrush, or anything that might indicate a long journey?
Is all his camera gear gone? I would obviously take very different gear with me for a photo daytrip (1 body, 2-3 lenses, light tripod in a backpack), compared to a long stay, no matter how much I might be trying to stay under the radar. Being the photo nut I am, if I was going away for a long time, I'd probably take ALL my gear. That would give me away. |
he has the sony 717... no other cameras.. and I believe it is gone along with one of his two tripods.
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08/08/2006 07:06:50 PM · #1016 |
Just want to send out a little online hug to everyone on here. I am very new to this site and have done nothing more than admire other people's photography. But I am touched and amazed at the dedication of this tight-knit community to one another.
I've never been in this position but I can imagine how terrible it is, being part of a very close family.
My thoughts and prayers are with Steve, his family, and all of his friends online and off.
- Laura |
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08/08/2006 07:09:42 PM · #1017 |
| Just emailed missing flier to civil air patrol with a plea for there help in locating steve. Lets hope for something from them. I will let everyone know when and if there is a reply from them. |
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08/08/2006 08:58:46 PM · #1018 |
Some news coming in this morning, maybe...
First off, this is totally unconfirmed, so it is unknown for sure if this was even Steve's car. I'm hesitant to even post it because I don't want anyone to get their hopes up, but it may show up in a news article on line so I wanted to post it here where I can explain it.
What we know: On Sunday 8/6 someone claims to have been driving behind a car that matched Steve's car. They had read the story in the paper earlier and were pretty sure the last three digits of the lic plate matched Steve's. They passed the info on to local police who contacted Mesa Police. The sighting was on Hwy 260 between Payson and Show Low heading to Show Low.
We do not know if this was Steve's car, we do not know who was driving the car and we do not know where it was going or where it went. However, IF (note the big if) it was Steve, my best guess is that he's heading to the White Mountains as it's beautiful there this time of year.
Regardless, this morning I have contacted the White Mountain Independent
(local paper) and they will be doing a story. I've also sent all the information on to the Show Low Police and Chamber of Commerce and asked that they distribute the flyer. We have friends in that area that are on the look out and I have a friend on the local search and rescue team up there that will spread the word.
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08/08/2006 09:09:00 PM · #1019 |
| It's a very common car, but it's worth the shot to send the info out. You're doing great work, Daryl. Thanks for the update. |
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08/08/2006 09:30:51 PM · #1020 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
You're doing great work, Daryl. Thanks for the update. |
Ditto that, wishing the best. |
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08/08/2006 09:31:29 PM · #1021 |
You know, when (and I insist on saying when) Steve comes home, he's gonna hear the refrain that's been going through my head for the last couple of days:
A Good Nature Photographer is Hard to Find.
I keep hoping for the very best. |
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08/08/2006 09:57:35 PM · #1022 |
| I got a response to my request from the Maricopa County Sheriff's Office Posse volunteer patrol; they have the flyer and they are all on the look out for Steve and his car as well. |
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08/08/2006 10:03:49 PM · #1023 |
Originally posted by Cam:
Originally posted by Melethia:
You're doing great work, Daryl. Thanks for the update. |
Ditto that, wishing the best. |
I'm going to ditto that to everyone that is helping and offering their support!
Message edited by author 2006-08-08 22:04:09.
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08/08/2006 10:30:28 PM · #1024 |
Originally posted by Southern Gentleman:
One thing I though of today when I went to the bank.
If his son or friend knows what bank Steve uses go and deposit $20.00
1. If Steve has closed the account they will let you know. "I'm sorry that account is closed"
2. If it is still open when you get the receipt of deposit it should show the balance.
3. In a day or two go deposit another $20 and see if the balance has changed. This would show activity on the account by Steve. It will not show where but a good sign that he kept his account open and is using it.
Just a thought.
SDW |
My bank will give me a receipt for a deposit, but unless I produce a picture ID, they won't put the balance on it. |
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08/08/2006 10:57:58 PM · #1025 |
Found another page on Steve. Maybe it's from someone here...?
LINK 1
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