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05/24/2006 07:04:27 PM · #26
Originally posted by TooCool:


I also think that having a P/S challenge is like saying that you aren't good enough to run with the dSLR's. It's kinda condescending...


How can it be condescending? We have folks like SJCarter who uses a 5 megapixel Gateway camera and he hung out with the big boys and girls of DPC. His highest rated shot came from the little camera that could ;)

My intent is not to be condescending but to just see two things:
1. what type of images would we see
2. how many will be DQed... hehehehhee!

Think of the Rubber Ducky challenge. A challenge so specific we had a record number of DQs.
05/24/2006 07:07:36 PM · #27
Originally posted by Rikki:

How can it be condescending?


People with better cameras are not allowed to enter...
05/24/2006 07:17:05 PM · #28
I agree! Will submit my best cell phone picture. It´s the only P&S available to me.
To those that have a more advanced P&S is simple to bypass the AF system to enter. Simply put focus to infinite. It mades AF systens to be in stand by.

05/24/2006 07:21:30 PM · #29
I think that wikilink you posted was mostly referring to film P&S cameras. There's a section on digital P&S cameras here;

Originally posted by wikipedia:

//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_camera#Still_cameras

* Standard Digital Cameras (also called compact digital cameras or digicams): This encompasses most digital cameras. They are characterized by great ease in operation and easy focusing; this design allows for limited motion picture capability. They have an extended depth of field. This allows objects at multiple depths to be in focus simultaneously, which accounts for much of their ease of focusing. It is also part of the reason professional photographers find their images flat or artificial-looking. They excel in landscape photography and casual use. The typical file format they save pictures in is JPEG.

* "Prosumer" Cameras are a general group of higher end cameras that physically resemble SLR "professional" cameras and share some features, but are still geared towards consumers. These cameras tend to have a large optical zoom lens, which compromises a "do it all" ability with barrel distortion and pincushioning. Prosumer cameras are often marketed as and confused with digital SLR cameras. The distinguishing characteristics are they do not have a removeable lens, can take movies, and scene composition is done with either the LCD display or the EVF (Electronic Viewfinder). The overall performance tends to be slower than a true digital SLR, but they are capable of good image quality. Many of the these cameras can save in JPEG or RAW format.


Message edited by author 2006-05-24 19:21:52.
05/24/2006 07:24:27 PM · #30
And for the record, I don't really like the challenge suggestion.

"Okay, all you paupers! - Into steerage with you!"

;-)
05/24/2006 07:24:40 PM · #31
Hey, what's with the "no camera" thing??

05/24/2006 07:27:29 PM · #32
Originally posted by Melethia:

Hey, what's with the "no camera" thing??


It finally broke...
05/24/2006 07:34:44 PM · #33
Bummer!! You will be getting another one soon, right?
05/24/2006 07:57:31 PM · #34
I think the difference between point and shoot and dSLR is the SLR part. "Single Lens Reflex," there is a mirror that flips up to expose the sensor behind it. Point and shoot cameras do not have this mirror. I'm pretty sure that there aren't any point and shoot cameras that use this method of taking pictures and there aren't any point and shoots that have detachable lenses. Sure, you can add them on, but only on top of what's permanently attached to the camera. Is this going to level the playing field? No, definitely not. Someone with a $800 point and shoot is going to get a better quality shot out of that camera than that same person using a $150 point and shoot. I'm not saying that the camera makes the shot, because that's absolutely not true. But the simple quality of the resulting shot is what's going to change just like the difference between a point and shoot and a dSLR camera. The sensor in a dSLR is much different from a point and shoot in the fact that it's larger in size and therefore can capture more detail, color range, and have less noise. Point and shoot sensors are much much smaller and have less detail, color range, and more noise. The color range and noise can be somewhat fixed up in post, so the advanced editing would be very nice to have. So to sum all this up, I would classify a point and shoot as not having detachable lenses and not having a mirror that flips up...which really is the technical difference between the two anyway. Just my opinion on the matter.
05/24/2006 07:58:01 PM · #35
Originally posted by Melethia:

Bummer!! You will be getting another one soon, right?

Depends on finances - I was saving up for a new one anyway.

In the meantime I've got my trusty film slr to fall back on. You remember these? No sensor dust, built like bricks, '30 megapixels', batteries last 2 years, no memory card required... :)
05/24/2006 08:12:41 PM · #36
Originally posted by jhonan:

Originally posted by Melethia:

Bummer!! You will be getting another one soon, right?

Depends on finances - I was saving up for a new one anyway.

In the meantime I've got my trusty film slr to fall back on. You remember these? No sensor dust, built like bricks, '30 megapixels', batteries last 2 years, no memory card required... :)


You know, I think I have one of those is a closet somewhere.... but I'm betting that it probably does need a battery. And film. You had to remind me of the sensor dust part... gotta go try to clean mine again. Pesky stubborn dust spot I can't seem to get rid of!
05/24/2006 08:37:33 PM · #37
Originally posted by SamDoe1:

The sensor in a dSLR is much different from a point and shoot in the fact that it's larger in size and therefore can capture more detail, color range, and have less noise. Point and shoot sensors are much much smaller and have less detail, color range, and more noise. The color range and noise can be somewhat fixed up in post, so the advanced editing would be very nice to have. So to sum all this up, I would classify a point and shoot as not having detachable lenses and not having a mirror that flips up...which really is the technical difference between the two anyway. Just my opinion on the matter.


The sensor size raises the issue of the Sony R1. Sure it hasn't got interchangeable lenses, but because of the larger sensor, it has better picture quality and a larger range of apeture settings. I would hardly call that one a point and shoot.
05/24/2006 09:13:30 PM · #38
Originally posted by karmabreeze:

I like this idea... but like someone else said above, as an Exclusive Open and paired with a DSLR challenge so that no one needs to sit out that week due to a lack of equipment.


amen
05/24/2006 09:14:25 PM · #39
Originally posted by GinaRothfels:

The sensor size raises the issue of the Sony R1. Sure it hasn't got interchangeable lenses, but because of the larger sensor, it has better picture quality and a larger range of apeture settings. I would hardly call that one a point and shoot.


as long as there is no single lens reflect (SLR) system used in the camera, then it is not a SLR.
05/24/2006 09:51:08 PM · #40
Originally posted by crayon:

Originally posted by GinaRothfels:

The sensor size raises the issue of the Sony R1. Sure it hasn't got interchangeable lenses, but because of the larger sensor, it has better picture quality and a larger range of apeture settings. I would hardly call that one a point and shoot.


as long as there is no single lens reflect (SLR) system used in the camera, then it is not a SLR.


Agreed, but perhaps we need a middle ground here. Anyone using a Sony R1 would have an unfair advantage if the object of this exercise was to level the playing field. But to really level things out one would probably need to split cameras into a lot of groups and that's just plain unworkable.
05/24/2006 09:51:55 PM · #41
then we shall call it non-SLR and SLR? sounds great! but everyone has to use the camera under their name...as of now :) sorry Rikki you cant enter!! MUUAAAHHH

Originally posted by crayon:

Originally posted by GinaRothfels:

The sensor size raises the issue of the Sony R1. Sure it hasn't got interchangeable lenses, but because of the larger sensor, it has better picture quality and a larger range of apeture settings. I would hardly call that one a point and shoot.


as long as there is no single lens reflect (SLR) system used in the camera, then it is not a SLR.

05/24/2006 09:54:04 PM · #42
O.O *Goes and finds her Megxon* ok Im ready
05/24/2006 09:56:42 PM · #43
Originally posted by queanbeez:

then we shall call it non-SLR and SLR? sounds great! but everyone has to use the camera under their name...as of now :) sorry Rikki you cant enter!! MUUAAAHHH

Originally posted by crayon:

Originally posted by GinaRothfels:

The sensor size raises the issue of the Sony R1. Sure it hasn't got interchangeable lenses, but because of the larger sensor, it has better picture quality and a larger range of apeture settings. I would hardly call that one a point and shoot.


as long as there is no single lens reflect (SLR) system used in the camera, then it is not a SLR.


Err, I was merely commenting upon the Sony DSC-R1 being a non-SLR and thus makes it a digital-compact camera.
05/24/2006 10:07:28 PM · #44
Originally posted by GinaRothfels:

The sensor size raises the issue of the Sony R1. Sure it hasn't got interchangeable lenses, but because of the larger sensor, it has better picture quality and a larger range of apeture settings. I would hardly call that one a point and shoot.


That is the exact problem that I was mentioning. There really isn't a way to completely level the playing field on this one. The R1 is a point and shoot in the way that it doesn't have a mirror and detachable lenses. A 350D or most SLR's have an auto mode in which you can point and shoot as well right? And many point and shoot cameras now have an aperature priority, shutter priority, and manual modes. So the mode in which they operate shouldn't be a way of judging what type of camera it is.
05/24/2006 11:25:12 PM · #45
I love the idea. 'Cause I'm P&S all the way... There may not be a way to TOTALLY level the playing field, but it will be MORE level, and it'll be fun to see how creative people get.
05/24/2006 11:43:02 PM · #46
Originally posted by SamDoe1:

That is the exact problem that I was mentioning. There really isn't a way to completely level the playing field on this one. The R1 is a point and shoot in the way that it doesn't have a mirror and detachable lenses. A 350D or most SLR's have an auto mode in which you can point and shoot as well right? And many point and shoot cameras now have an aperature priority, shutter priority, and manual modes. So the mode in which they operate shouldn't be a way of judging what type of camera it is.


so what we could do is actually 2 open challenges:
- SLR digicams
- non-SLR digicams
This is much easier to police too.
05/25/2006 03:19:41 AM · #47
exactly crayon, I said that 20 posts before, but I think everybody missed it :)
05/25/2006 03:30:47 AM · #48
Originally posted by biteme:

exactly crayon, I said that 20 posts before, but I think everybody missed it :)

they are just too busy biting you (pun intended) lol
05/25/2006 03:32:41 AM · #49
Originally posted by biteme:

exactly crayon, I said that 20 posts before, but I think everybody missed it :)


I noticed it, and great idea. I'd be all for it.
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