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04/23/2002 09:20:31 PM · #1 |
is there a way to respond to the people who have given my picture comments? i don't need to know who they are, i just wish to ask them to be a little more specific in helping. because my last few pictures have had the same problem and i could use some help on how to fix it..thanks
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04/23/2002 09:28:24 PM · #2 |
This sounds like a great idea to me. To be able to respond immediately and anonymously through the administrator. Shouldn't that be possible?
Tim |
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04/23/2002 10:00:32 PM · #3 |
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04/23/2002 10:32:55 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by timj351:
This sounds like a great idea to me. To be able to respond immediately and anonymously through the administrator. Shouldn't that be possible?
Tim
Good Idea! I second it. |
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04/23/2002 10:49:22 PM · #5 |
You guys sure are fickle :)
We keep going back and forth on this. Among the many threads that have dealt with this, at least two resulting in changes to the site, here's the latest that brought about the anonymous commenting in the first place.
//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.asp?action=read&FORUM_POST_ID=3113
Part of the problem is that we haven't made clear on the comments page that you'll see all of the names of people who commented come Monday. I'll fix that.
Drew |
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04/23/2002 11:38:59 PM · #6 |
I think what people want is two fold:
1) anonymous comments until voting is over.
2) the ability to respond to comments for clarification and help.
I think the Private message system is almost perfect for this. Why not make the system such that the recipient doesn't know the sender of the message, and any response will be sent and only known to the origianl sender. An anonymous IM type message system. Almost all of teh guts are already in place...
Sorry, I've been imersed in tech all day and my brain has slowed down, so I may be talking non-sense. Let me know if I need to clarify.
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04/24/2002 12:40:54 AM · #7 |
I think that suggestion might make people happy in both camps, since it keeps things sorta anonymous but allows immediate comunication for feedback. Somehow I doubt that it will appease everyone paranoid about bias, since you could easily idenify youself in a response. Not that I think that's a good enough reason to make anonymous in the first place! I'm all for the way it was until recently.
Sorry you have to put up with all this, drew. People mostly talk about what they don't have. :)
I know, why not an option on your preference page to turn on names if you like them, or turn them off and pretend? :)
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04/24/2002 01:22:45 AM · #8 |
I agree that the two-way anonymous thing is probably the best compromise. Although, I too miss the old way!:) Ahhh progress...
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04/24/2002 09:53:09 AM · #9 |
Originally posted by mykoleary:
I think what people want is two fold:
1) anonymous comments until voting is over.
2) the ability to respond to comments for clarification and help.
I think the Private message system is almost perfect for this. Why not make the system such that the recipient doesn't know the sender of the message, and any response will be sent and only known to the origianl sender. An anonymous IM type message system. Almost all of teh guts are already in place...
Sorry, I've been imersed in tech all day and my brain has slowed down, so I may be talking non-sense. Let me know if I need to clarify.
thats exactly what i was suggesting, thanks for making it more clear. |
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04/24/2002 10:07:45 AM · #10 |
I started this mess about remaining anonymous. During the voting for the stopped motion challenge, there was a LOT of communications in the forums about questionable photos, and after all was said and done between that and comment responses, I knew who the owners were for quite a few photographs.
I enjoyed the idea of being able to communicate as well, but I would rather remain anonymous myself during the voting.
I could live with the concept of turning the names back on. If I received a comment that required a response, I *could* use the private message feature to reply. This would allow me to remain anonymous to the voter.
In the spirit of anonymity, or lack thereof, I think the voting would change drastically if the voter didn't remain anonymous after the voting period. I think this would eliminate quite a bit of slanderous voting.
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04/24/2002 10:11:48 AM · #11 |
Maybe if the names were re-included with the comments and the "PM" link right beside the name as well, this would offer a quick and dirty anonymous reply to a comment....
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04/24/2002 11:10:28 AM · #12 |
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
In the spirit of anonymity, or lack thereof, I think the voting would change drastically if the voter didn't remain anonymous after the voting period. I think this would eliminate quite a bit of slanderous voting.
It's my understanding that the voters information will appear next to their comments AFTER the voting period has elapsed. |
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04/24/2002 11:11:51 AM · #13 |
| i was referring to the anonymity of the score given rather than the comment... sorry.. i wasn't very clear there... |
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04/24/2002 11:27:21 AM · #14 |
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
Maybe if the names were re-included with the comments and the "PM" link right beside the name as well, this would offer a quick and dirty anonymous reply to a comment....
The problem with this is one of the reasons we hesitated with the private messaging system in the first place. If I comment on 90 photos, I don't want 90 replies in my inbox. I certainly would like replies to questions I've posed in my comment or maybe incorrect statements. But it's been brought to our attention that there are photographers on this site who reply to every comment they receive, even if it's just "thanks for the comment."
Anonymous replies during voting is probably the best solution, though I urge photographers to not take advantage of this -- respect your commenters just as you'd expect they respect you. (and that includes their inboxes! :)
Drew |
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04/24/2002 11:44:40 AM · #15 |
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
i was referring to the anonymity of the score given rather than the comment... sorry.. i wasn't very clear there...
Revealing who voted what is probably more dangerous than receiving a few 'slanderous' votes. I can imagine some rather terse emails being sent from an angry photog who disagreed with a score a voter may have given them. In the end you'd have nobody voting because of a fear of personal attacks. Taking the example further, attacks on the web sites you proudly advertise in your profile could also be possible.
OK it's probably a little extreme, and hopefully no one on this site would want to do anything like that, but seeing as anybody can join these contests, I believe some care must be taken.
In the end, a couple of one votes probably won't sway your entire score that significantly. Arnit's photo last contest was a different kettle of fish ... some voters may not have read the posts proving the authenticity of the shot.
That's my 2 pence ...
I am happy with anonymous replies to anonymous comments tho :)
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04/24/2002 11:57:42 AM · #16 |
I would go for two-way anonymous messaging.
1) I won't know who commented
2) I can privately message the person who comments
3) The commenter won't know who is replying to his comment
4) The commenter will know which photo is being referred to when getting a reply to his comment
Is all this even possible?
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04/24/2002 12:03:22 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by yyyap:
I would go for two-way anonymous messaging.
Is all this even possible?
Yes, it is -- a sort of double-blind comment and reply system. I think that's a good idea, though I do wonder how that will affect the tone of the photographer's response... under his veil of anonymity. I guess no more than it affects the voters, and the anonymity is just until Monday :)
Drew |
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04/24/2002 12:31:26 PM · #18 |
| My .02 as well. Double-blind comment and reply sounds great. Keep the actual votes anonymous even after the challenge concludes. But no matter what system we und up with, someone will be dissatisfied. Drew, i feel your pain with all of these mods. At some point you'll just have to draw the line in the sand, say "this is how it is" and move on. I think everyone will deal. |
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04/24/2002 12:47:09 PM · #19 |
but maybe this is good. maybe we're all learning about what works and human nature.
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04/24/2002 12:47:50 PM · #20 |
| The "double-blind commentary" has me a little worried. If I submit a bad photo and get a knee-jerk vote that is also bad, yet I can then start an anonymous correspondence with an anonymous voter, I might be able to convince them that there is more there than what they initially thought, and raise my score as a result. Maybe this is or isn't good. I don't know. It just seems to reward people who more actively campaign for their photos. I guess I'm fine with not being able to communicate with voters until after the voting is completed. But maybe this is just thinking about this too much :) |
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04/24/2002 12:58:53 PM · #21 |
| The reason I like the concept replying to comments right away is that it takes a certain amount of effort to properly critique and comment on a photo. If someone takes this time and comments on my work, I'd like to initiate a conversation for more help as to what is wrong with my photo while the photo is still fresh in their minds. If I have to wait until a week or so after, I force the person to have to take the time to go back and re-invest time again. Some people and rightly so, just can't afford to do that. If that's the case, then I get no more input on the comment, and if I didn't understand it or wanted more help, I'm not going to get it. |
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04/24/2002 01:04:55 PM · #22 |
I totally agree with myk, making comments anonymous stifles the immediate communication possible between a photographer and a voter who has the image fresh in their minds. We've sacrificed learning for the almighty score. If we want this website to have an emphasis on learning, we need the non-anonymous comments back, but if we want an emphasis on winning and paranoia, anonymous comments should help. :)
And let me reiterate, a 'double-blind' system is only as anonymous as people are willing to make it, for I could easily send an anonymous message:
"Hey! This is Mousie! Your comment makes me feel violated!"
* This message has been edited by an administrator on 4/24/2002 1:08:38 PM - .
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04/24/2002 01:10:28 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by TrickyBuddha:
The "double-blind commentary" has me a little worried. If I submit a bad photo and get a knee-jerk vote that is also bad, yet I can then start an anonymous correspondence with an anonymous voter, I might be able to convince them that there is more there than what they initially thought, and raise my score as a result. Maybe this is or isn't good. I don't know. It just seems to reward people who more actively campaign for their photos. I guess I'm fine with not being able to communicate with voters until after the voting is completed. But maybe this is just thinking about this too much :)
Yeah, pro's and con's to any method. Kind of relates to Balinski & Young's Impossibility Theorem - basically no system of representaion is both perfect and useable. No matter what changes are made to the current system, there will be ways in which it can be abused and exploited. So, we just choose our poison and go with it. |
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04/24/2002 01:16:32 PM · #24 |
I agree with anonymous comments but would like the chance to reply to those that have requested information and to those who have made totally 'out of order' comments - very hard to ignore.
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04/24/2002 01:20:25 PM · #25 |
Why are people so afraid of someone modifying their votes based on feedback? In certain situations it's justified (ask arnit about it) and in other cases it's the fault of the voter's poor judgement. The *proper* solution is to clearly discourage people from changing their votes based on feedback unless it's actually merited.
Maybe I'm naieve, but I really don't see that much of a problem even if people do change their votes. I would be way happer with a website that engourages learning and community at the expense of hyper-accurate scoring. There's no prize, it's just an exercize, folks. Why even flirt with chance of obsessively fixating on absolute ranking? I've even been told by more than one person not to leave clues to which photo is mine in the forums or on my webite, because they feared that people might maliciously lower my score since I've won a couple challenges in the past. Let those few jerks vote me down, for all I care... the worst it will do is give someone else first place.
Then again, I've never really been into sports.
* This message has been edited by an administrator on 4/24/2002 1:26:19 PM - .
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