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08/17/2003 05:08:23 AM · #1 |
Have you noticed all those images entered into the Desolation comp? I have this nagging feeling that most of those entries were not exposed during the dates given as many of them look like snaps that 'sort-of-fits-the-description-so-it's-going-in thing' going on. I have marked and commented on more than 30 % of these photos and the highest rating so far is 4 and there are not many of those. Often the pictures are so bad I just put down a 1 and dont bother commenting for the lack of time...
What do you think?
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 05:09:25.
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08/17/2003 05:18:04 AM · #2 |
I didn't think the Desolation entries were any better or worse than normally. As always there's lots of good pictures and lots of not-as-good pictures.
However, I have to disagree with you on this. How do you know when the pictures have (or have not) been taken?
I'd be interested to see what a photo has to be like to score a 5 or over from you. I've seen a few real gems in this competition.
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08/17/2003 05:23:51 AM · #3 |
Originally posted by colorosilence:
I didn't think the Desolation entries were any better or worse than normally. As always there's lots of good pictures and lots of not-as-good pictures.
However, I have to disagree with you on this. How do you know when the pictures have (or have not) been taken?
I'd be interested to see what a photo has to be like to score a 5 or over from you. I've seen a few real gems in this competition. |
A lot of the entries are getting better as I go along, esp. ^ and such.
I dont think I have been here long enough to know the average standards of the entries. Maybe I was a little crude to assume. After all to assume is to make an ass out of you and me. But it's just that I have seen enough housing to last a life time =)
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 06:09:40. |
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08/17/2003 05:26:16 AM · #4 |
And as for not knowing the dates, you are correct. I don't know the dates and I wasnt planning on moving into action, but I was just wondering what everyone else thought...
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08/17/2003 05:40:27 AM · #5 |
Have you noticed all those images entered into the Desolation comp? I have this nagging feeling that most of those entries were not exposed during the dates given as many of them look like snaps that 'sort-of-fits-the-description-so-it's-going-in thing' going ontext
You accused me of this and I find it not only irritating but pompous. |
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08/17/2003 05:46:10 AM · #6 |
Im sorry, Im not attacking individuals and all entries. Looking back now, I was in a bit of a mood and i know I have written in a pompous manner and I regret having done so.
In fact, I am not attacking at all, it was merely a suggestion and wanted feedback as to what other members thought.
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 05:52:40. |
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08/17/2003 05:54:49 AM · #7 |
I would like to think that most, if not all the entries were taken within the rules. But unless your standing next to the person with the camera you never gonna know for sure.
Thanks justesme for the 2 very helpful comments in the latest challenges but i kinda hoped for more than a 4.
You say the highest score you have given is a 4 and i sense you feel you could do better. I look forward to seeing some challenge entries of yours.
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08/17/2003 06:01:11 AM · #8 |
Your welcome, which picture was yours? I'm sorry if I didnt give you a high a mark as you think deserved, but I stand by my votes. Perhaps other members will bump up the score =)
And yes, going though further, I have spotted more appealing images like '^' which I thought deserved a higher score...
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 06:09:58. |
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08/17/2003 06:06:21 AM · #9 |
Just a note...discussion of specific photo(s) while the voting is still in progress is not a good idea!
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08/17/2003 06:09:14 AM · #10 |
*goes back and edits* Thx for the tip. Ah, what a stupid mistake. I totally forgot...
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 06:10:26. |
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08/17/2003 06:33:37 AM · #11 |
Well, I'm not very fond of the idea someone taking my picture and tell me that it is not a shot that something was put into, (it is surely not a point-and-shoot, though it could maybe look like it for some people)
Well, don't excepect positive replys when you take others work that requried time and effort and poop over it....
[im not mad at all, just pointing you that this is very boring to hear and the discussion will just be boring on these basis]
v.
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08/17/2003 08:54:21 AM · #12 |
Originally posted by vjoz:
Well, I'm not very fond of the idea someone taking my picture and tell me that it is not a shot that something was put into, (it is surely not a point-and-shoot, though it could maybe look like it for some people) |
Where ever did you get the impression that anyone thought that any of your work was 'point-and-shoot'? And even if someone did tell anyone their opinion of their work, perhaps the photographer may not be fond of that opinion, but should try to see why and how that person came to that opinion.
Originally posted by vjoz:
Well, don't excepect positive replys when you take others work that requried time and effort and poop over it.... |
I did not mean to apprear to laugh or make fun of anyone's work, if I did, I apologise.
And likewise, I did not expect all replies to be positive.
Originally posted by vjoz:
[im not mad at all, just pointing you that this is very boring to hear and the discussion will just be boring on these basis]
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Fair enough. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 09:01:12. |
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08/17/2003 09:02:32 AM · #13 |
People who vote in the 3 or lower range on average need to a) look at their own work and b) be damned good or c) they will not be taken seriously.
There's a 10 point voting scale. Everyone votes differently but 1 is really shitty work, 10 is really great work. We're almost all amateurs so "really great" doesn't mean Ansel Adams is gonna hurt financially because of our picture. 5 is average. That should mean a FIVE is "an average picture." Makes sense. Logical. Saying a 4 is the highest you've given? Well then every shot you've viewed is below average. With standards like that, you're obviously far far too good for DPC and we'll all be better off now that you've come to rescue us from our bad photos.
M
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08/17/2003 09:21:39 AM · #14 |
It all depends if you're talking the average of photos on DPC, or the average of all photos. If you're comparing DPC to all photos, then a range from 1-5 out of 10 is probably about right for the majority.
People can vote however they want. Let's not go making snide remarks about them.
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08/17/2003 09:24:40 AM · #15 |
If you're comparing DPC photos to all photos ever created, a scale of about 1-2 is about right. I better revote. I thought a 10 point DPC scale meant a 10 was "one of the best photos on dpc" not "one of the best photos of all time."
M
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08/17/2003 09:25:40 AM · #16 |
Go and revote then. Nothing is stopping you. The scale is there to be interpreted by each individual person.
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08/17/2003 09:37:56 AM · #17 |
Originally posted by mavrik:
Saying a 4 is the highest you've given? Well then every shot you've viewed is below average. With standards like that, you're obviously far far too good for DPC and we'll all be better off now that you've come to rescue us from our bad photos.
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Wait a second. Look around at all the best pictures around here. Most of them are around 6.5 . So it's only 1.5 short of being average? |
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08/17/2003 09:42:23 AM · #18 |
To me,
1: V. bad
4: Avg
7: V. Good
10: PERFECT
Look at your own work. To me, the matrix and the practical joke entries were v. good and what did you get? 6.4, and 6.7 respectively...
Let's pick another example at random. Magnetic's winners got 7.5 and 7.2
They were winners...
So either the majority of the people are voting in 7s and 8s. Or they are voting in 6s and 9s or 5s and 10s &c.
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 10:08:22. |
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08/17/2003 09:48:30 AM · #19 |
Originally posted by mavrik:
Saying a 4 is the highest you've given? |
And that was then. When I got better entries I gave higher marks... |
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08/17/2003 09:57:21 AM · #20 |
Originally posted by mavrik:
If you're comparing DPC photos to all photos ever created, a scale of about 1-2 is about right. |
*Laughs*
Of course I am not comparing the best photos of all time! And it does not necessarily mean on a scale of 1-2. I have seen some pictures that could compete with photographers with more experient and fame.
Originally posted by mavrik:
I thought a 10 point DPC scale meant a 10 was "one of the best photos on dpc" not "one of the best photos of all time." |
Have you seen the standards set by some of these 'amateur' photographers?! They are hard to beat. Have you seen some pictures out there? Often, the marks are lowered because the lack of a link with the topic. And, post competition, if any individual thinks that they deserved a higher mark, show me why, I'll be happy to discuss and I'll be the first to make a correction if I think that they are right!
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 09:59:01. |
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08/17/2003 09:58:23 AM · #21 |
Meaning no disrespect to you regarding any voting or commenting but you've gotten this thread running and kept some attention with semi-inflamatory remarks (the 1-4 you mentioned and the photo you mentioned) and it seems you haven't entered a contest.
I hope in the future we hear more from you but I hope its in the nature of challenge entries so that others have some opportunity to offer their insights into your skills and abilities with a camera, too.
That's the true strength (IMO) of DPC. We get to share opinions with each other, not just get graded. The crativity and ideas flow multiple directions between many photographers. Not just from the "good" to the "bad".
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08/17/2003 10:05:17 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by KevinRiggs:
Meaning no disrespect to you regarding any voting or commenting but you've gotten this thread running and kept some attention with semi-inflamatory remarks (the 1-4 you mentioned and the photo you mentioned) and it seems you haven't entered a contest.
I hope in the future we hear more from you but I hope its in the nature of challenge entries so that others have some opportunity to offer their insights into your skills and abilities with a camera, too.
That's the true strength (IMO) of DPC. We get to share opinions with each other, not just get graded. The crativity and ideas flow multiple directions between many photographers. Not just from the "good" to the "bad". |
I agree. I know I have really jumped into the deep end.
I have enter into the Seasonal [this one is a little hit and miss, and a little experiemental: to see what kind of points will be given] and Past comp, so it's just a matter of time. =) I definately do not expect all positive comments, in fact I would like some negative ones so I can make improvements.
I'm sorry if I have been drawing too unnecessary attention to this thread. |
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08/17/2003 10:26:02 AM · #23 |
Originally posted by Konador:
Go and revote then. Nothing is stopping you. The scale is there to be interpreted by each individual person. |
I think if I gave out all 1s and 2s the system would stop me, first of all.
If someone is going to bring up the marks they are giving pictures and waltz in week 1 saying "cheating? I don't think these were exposed during the dates" they'd better be ready for a discussion, friendly or not, on their post. I didn't enter desolation, so I don't care if she gives everyone a 1 2 3 or 4. Of course people can interpret the scale however they want - it just means the best picture ever on this site is just above an 8. "Winners" are determined not by who does the best but by who doesn't do the worst? I dunno...
M
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08/17/2003 10:37:11 AM · #24 |
i think that everyone is forgetting that the final score on this site is an AVERAGE of all the scores given/received.
it's just a fact of nature than when you're dealing with such an incredibly wide variance in tastes that some will give low and some will give high.
that's why a 7 is so much harder to get than a 6 -- it takes a LOT of people liking it in the high ranges to counterbalance all the inevitable naysayers that will give it 6's and lower. and there are not as many numbers in the high range to give, not to mention that it's just plain rarer to be given 7's 8's 9's and 10's.
i'm not sure what the actual numerical relationship is, but it's almost as if, above 6, each 0.1 gained is almost exponentially more difficult to achieve than the 0.1 immediately below it, simply because that upper end of the range has a smaller number of choices of vote and many people would have to give those high scores to, again, "counterbalance the inevitable voters that think it's average or below."
Message edited by author 2003-08-17 10:43:02.
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08/17/2003 10:52:20 AM · #25 |
I think it is good to have conversations like this. I like seeing how others vote. I may not agree with them but it is still interesting. I myself agree with mavrik. The voting scale is 1-10. To me the number in between is 5 and so that would make 5 average on most other scales. I still don't see how average would be a 4.
If you take a look at some winning photos:
Dusty Roads Let's say 5 was average that means this photo is above average, but there are some who thought this photo was [b]very bad[/] (I think those voters are the ones that give low votes to boost their own score, because how do you give a photo like this a 1?) and some who thought it was just right at or below average. And because of these low votes it brings the score down.
I give out more 5 and 6 votes then any other. I think most photos here are about average. They took a good picture but just not something that says "wow" to me. I give out 1-4 if the photo is technically bad, like out of focus, lighting issues...etc. But I always try to look at a photo and see why they did what they did and ask myself was the soft focus done intentionally? I give out 6-10 to photos that are more creative and make me say "Wow, I want to try this."
Make sure you be a good judge when voting.
I did get a comment from you Justin and thank you. You gave a good critique.
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