What's your favorite channel for B&W?

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM

01/31/2006 03:48:37 PM · #1

When I learned to convert to B&W using the channel mixer, I had read a few places that people liked the red channel best, especially for portraits. I find that I totally disagree. To me, I wind up using Green as my major channel in probably 3 of 4 B&W conversions. I tend to like Blue too, except it's noisy, but it can be really nice and dramatic.

Anybody else tend to not use the Red channel? or are there Red champions out there?

Joey Lawrence

PhaseOne P45

01/31/2006 03:49:48 PM · #2

Blue channel :-D

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

01/31/2006 03:52:03 PM · #3

Originally posted by Joey Lawrence:

Blue channel :-D

that figures... ;)

hanneke

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

01/31/2006 03:52:41 PM · #4

Actually, i don't know. I've never really been aware of the colors to use. I just push the buttons and check the photo. If I like it, it's ok. If I don't like it, I'll push it some more.

I'll check it out next time I'm gonna convert to B&W again and tell you over here, ok? :)

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

01/31/2006 03:53:46 PM · #5

None of the above. I often switch to LAB color and use the Lightness channel.

Samsung Galaxy S21, S21+, S21 Ultra

01/31/2006 03:55:33 PM · #6

Well, this is exactly how I came to this realization. Before conversion I'd always hit Ctrl-1, 2 and 3 to get an idea of what each channel held. I learned over time that I tended to like the green channel best so start with a baseline of like 80% green and work from there.

It doesn't hold for all pictures, of course, but for me, it's true lots of the time.

Bear_Music

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

01/31/2006 03:57:35 PM · #7

Green channel can be VERY effective for landscapes. It heightens contrast and brightness in foliage and darkens sky somewhat, but not to extremes.

R.

hanneke

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

01/31/2006 03:59:22 PM · #8

Originally posted by DrAchoo:

I learned over time that I tended to like the green channel best so start with a baseline of like 80% green and work from there.

80%?
that's a lot if you consider the total should be around 100% (uuhm... that's probably a blonde observation :P)

I assume you'll reduce the green channel in the process?

faidoi

Pentax K10D

Pentax DA 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 AF

01/31/2006 03:59:34 PM · #9

Depends on the picture. Each individual picture may need a different post-processing.

mycelium

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

Canon EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM

01/31/2006 04:00:36 PM · #10

I often use the red channel most. Sometimes I'll have two channel mixer layers--say one for blue and one for red--and I'll mask one off in some parts to let the other show through.

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

01/31/2006 04:02:56 PM · #11

Originally posted by biteme:

Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I learned over time that I tended to like the green channel best so start with a baseline of like 80% green and work from there.

80%?
that's a lot if you consider the total should be around 100% (uuhm... that's probably a blonde observation :P)

I assume you'll reduce the green channel in the process?

No, I'm serious. it isn't uncommon for me to do 15/80/5 or so. This shot was 5/5/90 for blue, but probably because I only had a red dress for her and wanted it in black.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

01/31/2006 04:03:22 PM · #12

I tend to use different parts of different channels for different parts of the scene. Depends what tonality I want and what's in each channel.

I don't find doing a whole image conversion in one pass very satisfying, usually.

hanneke

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

01/31/2006 04:06:28 PM · #13

I know you're serious, so was I. Just wanted to make sure we were talking about the same thing.

the photo looks quite great with this convert to B&W. Looks like the extreme sometimes just works.

I'll be a bit more aware of what I'm doing next time when I'm gonna convert.

Canon EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM

01/31/2006 04:10:35 PM · #14

Originally posted by faidoi:

Depends on the picture. Each individual picture may need a different post-processing.

A very powerful way to convert to Monochrome is to use two Hue/Saturation layers in Photoshop:

1. Create new H/S layer
2. Set mode to 'color'
3. Set saturation to '0'
4. Create another H/S layer
5. Ensure it in 'underneath' the first H/S layer
6. Open the 'bottom, H/S and adjust the hue slider to alter and accentuate the tones of the image.

It's worth noting that this method would fall foul of the 'basic' editing rules (if I understand them correctly) as it uses a layer set to other than 'normal'

mycelium

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

01/31/2006 04:23:08 PM · #15

Originally posted by biteme:

Looks like the extreme sometimes just works.

I'll be a bit more aware of what I'm doing next time when I'm gonna convert.

I wouldn't really consider using 80% green extreme at all, any more that it would be extreme to put a green (or any other colored) filter over the lens for B/W photography. For comparison, using 100% green is the same thing as simply filtering out the red and blue.

Extreme is something like 180 red, -40 green, -40 blue... I've done that for skies sometimes :)

// edited for clarity

Message edited by author 2006-01-31 16:24:50.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

01/31/2006 04:32:57 PM · #16

Originally posted by mycelium:

Originally posted by biteme:
Looks like the extreme sometimes just works.

I'll be a bit more aware of what I'm doing next time when I'm gonna convert.

I wouldn't really consider using 80% green extreme at all, any more that it would be extreme to put a green (or any other colored) filter over the lens for B/W photography. For comparison, using 100% green is the same thing as simply filtering out the red and blue.

Extreme is something like 180 red, -40 green, -40 blue... I've done that for skies sometimes :)

// edited for clarity

I've used -100 blue for skies on occasion, works quite well,

Bear_Music

Samsung Galaxy S21, S21+, S21 Ultra

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

01/31/2006 04:34:32 PM · #17

Originally posted by front_element:

Originally posted by faidoi:
Depends on the picture. Each individual picture may need a different post-processing.

A very powerful way to convert to Monochrome is to use two Hue/Saturation layers in Photoshop:

1. Create new H/S layer
2. Set mode to 'color'
3. Set saturation to '0'
4. Create another H/S layer
5. Ensure it in 'underneath' the first H/S layer
6. Open the 'bottom, H/S and adjust the hue slider to alter and accentuate the tones of the image.

It's worth noting that this method would fall foul of the 'basic' editing rules (if I understand them correctly) as it uses a layer set to other than 'normal'

That's an EXCEPTIONALLY interesting approach. I had never seen it before. On the bottom layer, after you have set the HUE to favor the range you want, playing with the SATURATION makes nice changes in value to the image...

R.

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

01/31/2006 04:34:43 PM · #18

I've never dabbled in negatives. oooohhh, new ground to experiment...

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

01/31/2006 04:38:25 PM · #19

I'm often frustrated trying to use the Channel Mixer. Lately, I've had the best success just copying the Green channel out to a new Grayscale image, but I did have one photo recently where the Red channel worked better.

It makes sense that the Green would often contain the "highest-quality" image, since most sensors have twice as many Green pixels as Red or Blue.

I've used the Blue channel a couple of times when I intentionally wanted a grainy/gritty look to start with.

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM

01/31/2006 04:38:25 PM · #20

Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Be care with the saturation on that layer Bear. If you go too far 'positive' it can generate artefacts as it causes the color to block up.

Turning off the top layer allows you to check for this easily - but it will look a very funny color :-)

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

01/31/2006 04:55:41 PM · #21

FWIW, I tend to have half a dozen pre-set channel mixer settings that I have saved and I'll run through when I'm thinking about converting an image.

3 of them are just the individual channels on their own (like ctrl+1,2,) Couple more are ones that give good contrast or typically blue skies and so on.

From that run through, I should have a good idea which bits of the image I want converted, on which settings.

Then I'll use masks to pick and choose from the various conversions - so I might pull from the red channel for one area and the blue for another and then a 80/10/10 mix for yet another part of the scene.

This gives some actual control over the tones, rather than just hoping the colours were right in the original capture. Also works well with the hue/sat technique mixed in for other layers.

Has a lot more possibility to get something that looks how you want it to, rather than just picking 3 percentages for the whole scene.

Joey Lawrence

PhaseOne P45

01/31/2006 07:01:39 PM · #22

Originally posted by front_element:

Wow! this is a very cool method, thanks for the tip. I've been playing around with it and setting the bottom H/S layer to overlay gives some interesting results as well, especially for black and white images.

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM

01/31/2006 07:09:58 PM · #23

Originally posted by Joey Lawrence:

I've been playing around with it and setting the bottom H/S layer to overlay gives some interesting results as well, especially for black and white images.

Nice idea Joey - I hadn't tried changing the bottom layer mode before!

It offers even more options for this conversion method.

Joey Lawrence

PhaseOne P45

01/31/2006 07:10:58 PM · #24

Originally posted by front_element:

Originally posted by Joey Lawrence:

I've been playing around with it and setting the bottom H/S layer to overlay gives some interesting results as well, especially for black and white images.

Nice idea Joey - I hadn't tried changing the bottom layer mode before!

It offers even more options for this conversion method.

Go team!