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DPChallenge Forums >> Tips, Tricks, and Q&A >> I have some (most likely lame) questions...
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02/24/2002 12:00:00 AM · #1
I want to make sure I'm clear on the rules so...

1- The rotate canvas function isn't considered a modification, right? And that would make it ok to use? Or is considered one and not allowed to be used?

2- The pictures HAVE to be sized to 640x480 or 480x640? I mean, you can't have pictures smaller than that? Or does it mean that you can have anything UP to those specification?

3- Does the Levels Adjustment mean anything that falls under that menu option? Hue saturation and whatever else? Or is there a limit as to what modification functions you can use? Like auto levels or brightness and contrast only?

4- Are we supposed to submit the original and submission photo in a zip file? Or does the submit page take you to another page where you sumbit the original photo afterwards?

5- Could I be anymore anal retentive about this? :P

- BA
02/24/2002 10:07:44 AM · #2
1- It is allowed if you are rotating for the purpose of making your photograph 480x640 equivalent -- as opposed to 640x480. You may NOT rotate it by X degrees and then crop what you don't like out.

2- You may not submit anything smaller than 640x480/480x640. In the case of [url=/vote_wnd.asp?IMAGE_ID=118]"A View"[/url], this would be disqualified, however since we didn't specificy NO BORDERS before we will leave it now. So... 640x480/480x640 ONLY, and NO BORDERS.

3- Hue/Saturation is NOT allowed. You may not convert your photograph to black/white or sepia AFTER it's off your camera. A lot of cameras nowadays support black/white, sepia and other effects. These should be used in place of Hue/Saturation. When we say "Levels" or "Auto-Levels" we mean only these two options.

4- The rules state to submit the original image, however there is no field for this now, so do not do it. We will likely take this rule off due to the size of some camera's original image.

5- I think you could. :)

Let me know if anything stated here is unclear. Our rules section will be updated soon, I promise.
02/24/2002 09:07:32 PM · #3
Don't rules 1 and 3 kind of defeat the purpose of the digital camera format? I can understand not allowing spot-editing, but hue/saturation or rotation? Not even film photographers always get a perfect shot straight out of the camera.
02/25/2002 03:40:39 AM · #4
I see that the rules have been updated.. which is good in a way because whenever I perform a legal touch up function I lose the EXIF data in my images (PS5).. with the new rules I can perform the touch up and not have to worry about the EXIF data not being submitted, all good....

...but, in saying that, touching up feels like Iím cheating. Some say that itís all part of digital photography.. but I just can't stand touching up my photos...

...so Iím submitting my original image, which I took with my camera set up to comply to the resolution rules (ie 640x480 and < 150K) for the macro challenge. I will also strive to do the same for any future challenges...

..after all, if a submitted image does not have the EXIF data how does anyone really know if its an original or hasn't been "touched up" to hell?

Just as well these challenges are "for the love of photography" and are not about winning a million dollars for the best pic :-)

I'm interested in how the rest of the forum feels about this issue.


* This message has been edited by the author on 2/25/2002 5:01:33 AM.
02/25/2002 07:58:10 AM · #5
I agree about the touchups. I've noticed on some other websites that many of the so called experts want to "fix" everyone's submission by suggesting crops and enhancements. My submission for the latest challenge is fresh out of the camera but has been criticized for focusing on the wrong area and being too blurry. I tried their suggestions by manipulating the photo with my software and it totally lost the softness that I was trying to convey. Art truly is in the eye of the beholder.
02/25/2002 11:06:37 AM · #6
Keep the replies coming! We've had intense debates over what edits should be allowed, and you're exactly right -- it depends on where you think the skill of photography ends. More opinions, more opinions!

Cleon --
which is good in a way because whenever I perform a legal touch up function I lose the EXIF data in my images (PS5).. with the new rules I can perform the touch up and not have to worry about the EXIF data not being submitted, all good....

We suggest always keeping a copy of your original photo. As a matter of fact, the rules still state that you need to do so, in case your photo ever comes into question for any reason.

* This message has been edited by the author on 2/25/2002 11:08:51 AM.
02/25/2002 11:13:06 AM · #7
>> ...so Iím submitting my original image, which I took with my camera
>> set up to comply to the resolution rules (ie 640x480 and < 150K) for
>> the macro challenge. I will also strive to do the same for any
>> future challenges...

I highly advise against setting your camera to capture 640x80 images. In my opinion, resizing an image is in no way/shape/form cheating. If you had a roll of film, you could get 4x6, 5x7, or any other prints you wanted.

I would suggest you have the camera take the largest resolution possible for maximum results.
02/25/2002 01:43:09 PM · #8
I agree about the scaling.. but i wish I could scale without losing the EXIF data... I think i read somewhere that Photoshop 6 trys not to lose your EXIF data... can anyone confirm this?

And can anyone suggest a method (some other software maybe) of scaling without the EXIF data being lost? ...freeware would be nice :)



02/25/2002 01:46:51 PM · #9
I know this is dumb, but what is EXIF data? I'm a beginner and I don't have the lingo down yet.
02/25/2002 05:41:53 PM · #10
Check the rules, it says what you can do to keep the EXIF data. I use ACDSee 4.x for my modifications and it keeps all the original data.

One question I had though, that I'm confused about. The rules say modifying 'levels' is fine, which I assume is just B & C? Because the editor that comes with ACDSee 4.x throws 'Gamma' in there, and I want to know if I should not touch the slider. :)
02/25/2002 06:24:07 PM · #11
Adobe Photoshop 6.0 does retain your EXIF data.

It's good to hear that ACDSee 4.x retains that information -- I guess that's reason enough for me to upgrade from 3.1 ...
02/25/2002 07:33:10 PM · #12
re: what is EXIF data
Here is some text copied from www.dpreview.com about EXIF data:

"EXIF supports the storage of extended camera information within the header of each JPEG file. Nearly ALL digital cameras use this format and record such information as the time & date the image was taken, exposure information (ISO, shutter, aperture) and other extended (and often custom) camera details."
03/02/2002 09:30:21 PM · #13
I take all my photos in color, but with the intention
of converting them to B&W later. That's because while
my camera does have a B&W mode, it simply reduces the
image to luminance, rather than having the spectral
sensitivity of B&W film (and/or using filters).

I guess the rules make sense if you consider that
pushing the button is a sign of commitment, and that
the good photographer is the one who can get
everything right up until then.

On the other hand film photographers have a huge
number of options for post-exposure modification
(such as cropping or filtering during printing
with an enlarger).
03/03/2002 03:50:15 AM · #14
where do you find the exif data in photoshop? also, i have the upgraded acdsee, but it doesn't list anything in my metadata. is this maybe due to the fact that my camera's images go straight to floppy and this info is getting lost? i don't get it!

* This message has been edited by the author on 3/3/2002 3:54:09 AM.
03/03/2002 01:06:34 PM · #15
Photoshop before version 7 does not show exif data. If you've already tried the procedure listed on the FAQ page for viewing exif data in ACDSee, I would suggest trying one of the other programs listed on that page to do so.

Andrew
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