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DPChallenge Forums >> Rant >> another attack in Bali
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10/01/2005 07:25:26 PM · #1
What is going on..

Bali
10/01/2005 08:13:20 PM · #2
very sad, but yes we Australians are targets for terrorist because of our involvement in Iraq.
10/01/2005 08:15:02 PM · #3
Originally posted by keegbow:

very sad, but yes we Australians are targets for terrorist because of our involvement in Iraq.


You were a target even b4 Iraq...

Sad to say, but the biggest losers in this situation are the Balinese, a very gentle and peace loving people being pushed around by Islamic extremists...
10/01/2005 09:09:08 PM · #4
Iraq has has no link to this attack except that the terrorists are willing to kill women, children, infants etc...etc...

Originally posted by keegbow:

very sad, but yes we Australians are targets for terrorist because of our involvement in Iraq.
10/01/2005 09:38:35 PM · #5
Originally posted by photodude:

Islam is a terrorist cult. We are all targets


Thats not true.

But the freaks that blow people up and create this crap ane not doing it because of the war.

They are just horrible people that want to kill infidels no matter what.

Its sick, its twisted and it makes me want to puke.
10/01/2005 09:38:56 PM · #6
In the recent trail of the terrorist who committed the Bali bombings in 2002 in which 82 Australians died it was admitted by the perpetrator that Australians were targeted because of their involvement in Iraq.

10/01/2005 09:47:59 PM · #7
Originally posted by keegbow:

In the recent trail of the terrorist who committed the Bali bombings in 2002 in which 82 Australians died it was admitted by the perpetrator that Australians were targeted because of their involvement in Iraq.


very true. I havent heard anymore on this recent one yet.
10/01/2005 09:48:41 PM · #8
Soooooo....lets get out of Iraq and see if the bombings stop....

Originally posted by keegbow:

In the recent trail of the terrorist who committed the Bali bombings in 2002 in which 82 Australians died it was admitted by the perpetrator that Australians were targeted because of their involvement in Iraq.
10/01/2005 09:55:42 PM · #9

I don't think it would matter now if we got out or not? Their war has started and we are all the targets! We had friends arrive in Bali 2 days ago but I think they are alright! What a crazy time we live in!
10/01/2005 10:00:53 PM · #10
The hate will still be there whatever is done to placate the islamic extremist, they just want an islamic world, no in between or integrated societies, we are just too soft when we catch em and not firm enough with the ones who preach violence and hate.
10/01/2005 10:50:07 PM · #11
Sad, just sad. One reported dead was a 6 year old boy. Really hits home when I look across the room and see my 7 year old. I really wish people could accept each others differences and learn tolerance with one-another. This really is a great place to live....earth and all.
10/01/2005 11:04:22 PM · #12
The terrorists tell everyone that they bomb people because they are in Iraq because that is what they know people want to hear. Use your heads. If they weren't in Iraq, they'd still get bombed. This is not a "let's save Iraq" movement, it's an "Our view of Islam and the world against everyone else who does not think like we do" movement.

Much like in Israel recently, for years Hammas has said if the Jews left Gaza, they would stop the violence. Not 10 minutes after they pulled out, they swore that this was just the first step and they would not rest until all Jews were eliminated.

They say what they think will make the most political impact and help gain sympathy.

They want to divide and conquor, like it or not. Killing innocent people and spreading their own propoganda is their unfortunate way of doing it and if we believe what THEY say, we're playing right into it all.
10/02/2005 12:52:11 AM · #13
Hate to tell all you Islamophobes but the 'terrorists' that committed these bombings to another mans eyes are going to be seen as freedom fighters. It's no-ones right to deny someone their anger with the US/Britain/AUS for their participation in an illegal war, as it is to deny you your right to be angry at these wildly targeted bombs. Just for arguments sake I'll play devils advocate, but why is it acceptable to carpet bomb a city from a mile up and murder 1,000's of innnocent men women and children?

Just try and remember that it's the act that you should be condemning folks, not the person. And blithely tarring an entire race/religion/nation with the same brush is nothing short of racism, and no better than the mis-guided men/women that plant these bombs.

There's no such thing as an evil person. Terrible events like this have reasons for occurring, and the only way to make them stop is to talk to the people causing them. Believe it or not, they're people just like us you know.

Btw, @ rscorp, do you have any links to these claims you make about Hammas? My suspicions are that you are merely paraphrasing the statements of the most violent fringes of a movement which (lets be fair) have been living in a country occupied illegally by an invading force. Their anger is surely understandable, wouldn't you agree? And surely, the fact that the recent withdrawal has happened should be a cause for optimism that there is now the possibility available for both sides in the Palestinian conflict to make proper political negotiations, rather than resorting to violence. Now, more than any other time, I'm hopeful that the chance for the Palestinians to rebuild a normal life in their country will give the growing moderate majority the ability to curb the violent fringes in their society. And since the Palestinian occupation is one of the other major complaints of the jihadists, and a rallying call to international terror, wouldn't it be a better plan to address and solve problems as the Sharon government has finally seen fit to do than going the wrong route and merely providing more martyrs to be celebrated?
10/02/2005 03:38:18 PM · #14
There's no such thing as an evil person. Terrible events like this have reasons for occurring, and the only way to make them stop is to talk to the people causing them. Believe it or not, they're people just like us you know.

Oh, Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot(sp?), were just lovers huh. Oh your so wrong. Ya need to read a bit of history, there are evil people who will kill you, yes you, for just for being a person who doesn't fit their ideas or in the wrong place at their right time.

This bombing is a part of a global religious war and we all should know this by now. Just hope you and others aren't in a cafee and die from a non-evil person blowing their self up in the name of ala.
10/02/2005 04:09:27 PM · #15
Don't forget that Terrorists have a great passion for killing infidels...(listen carefully to their words in EVERY taped announcement they have made..."infidel" and "Allah" come up almost at a rate within 20 word intervals)

Infidels were on their radar way before Iraq was invaded.
10/02/2005 04:49:37 PM · #16
Let the police do their investigations before fingers get pointed at certain groups. Nothing does more discredit to these kinds of situations than "experts" who say: "This attack bears the hallmark of so and so" especially when such stupidity is uttered hours or even days after the event, without a complete investigation backing up the statement.

It might well be that extremists who happen to be Muslims were behind these bombs. They might even use a religious angle to "justify" what they did. For the general public to then presume that these people are representative of Islam is shortsighted. To then think that every Muslim wants to kill "infidels" in the name of "Allah" simply reflects a dangerous kind of ignorance and intolerance.

To put this into context, why is it a bad thing if someone wants Islamic principles to play an active role in a society's social situation, and NOT a bad thing when another person wants Christian values to regulate behavior and moral codes in his or her community? What's the difference?

Message edited by author 2005-10-02 17:09:44.
10/02/2005 05:33:07 PM · #17
Hear, hear! rgo

10/02/2005 05:46:36 PM · #18
Whoooaahhhh Nelly!

I never EVER said the Terrorists "are representative of Islam"

and

I never said "that every Muslim wants to kill "infidels" in the name of "Allah"

Just to clarify, I simply wanted to point out that Muslim Extremists are pretty clear what motivates them and Iraq is just one thing or detail in the general scheme of things.

There is no difference between any group that wishes to instill morals codes regulate behavior....until they start killing people to do so. For me, it's all a bad thing no matter which group is doing it and at any level.

All for now...

Message edited by author 2005-10-02 17:47:26.
10/02/2005 06:16:45 PM · #19
I think, if their wasn't any religion at all there wouldn't be such war / troubles going on as they are now...

To bad we can't do anything about that anymore

*Just my opinion*
10/02/2005 09:18:46 PM · #20
Originally posted by vtruan:

Oh, Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot(sp?), were just lovers huh. Oh your so wrong. Ya need to read a bit of history, there are evil people who will kill you, yes you, for just for being a person who doesn't fit their ideas or in the wrong place at their right time.

I'm not going to start an argument about the semantics of what makes a person 'evil' or not. But just because there are people who will kill me for not fitting in with their ideas doesn't make them 'evil'. There's no such thing, and to believe so is far too simplistic a viewpoint on an incredibly complex situation.

maybe you could read a bit of recent history yourself. You'd see what can be achieved when childish name-calling and blind adherence to your own dogma stops and discussion occurs. Take my country as an example, 30 years of paranoia and bigotry and 1,000's killed, but it doesn't last forever. if you give someone the opportunity to do the right thing they will take the chance, and this involves engaging them in genuine open and meaningful debate. //www.emigrant.ie/article.asp?iCategoryID=9&iArticleID=48226

Originally posted by vtruan:

This bombing is a part of a global religious war and we all should know this by now. Just hope you and others aren't in a cafee and die from a non-evil person blowing their self up in the name of ala.

The thought that many of the conflicts that we have witnessed in the recent few decades have been a throw-back to the horror wreaked by the Cold War between your own counrty and the old USSR hasn't occurred to you by any chance? And just look what happened with that global war.. except that one was a political system rather than a religious one. Were the folks behind the Iron curtain inherently evil? I don't think so. Suddenly they're not so bad now any more, are they? ;)

No, I don't buy it vtruan sorry! These conflicts generally seem a lot more localised upon clooser inspection, and your portrayal of some global 'bogeyman' just doesn't wash with me.

10/02/2005 09:25:46 PM · #21
Ummmm, if the bombings were for being in Iraq -- how long have they been there (Iraq).

Weren't there earlier bombings there (Indonesia). Like three in 2000?

Message edited by author 2005-10-02 21:26:32.
10/02/2005 09:46:03 PM · #22
Originally posted by karmat:

Ummmm, if the bombings were for being in Iraq -- how long have they been there (Iraq).

Weren't there earlier bombings there (Indonesia). Like three in 2000?


no they were in 2002 and these bombings were 2 weeks before the 3 year anniversary.
inbetween these dates we have also had a bombing of the Australian Embassy in Jakarta.
10/02/2005 10:57:06 PM · #23
Originally posted by lowonenergy:

I think, if their wasn't any religion at all there wouldn't be such war / troubles going on as they are now...

To bad we can't do anything about that anymore

*Just my opinion*


Religion is the costliest, most widespread, most dangerous, and most destructive untreated mental illness in the history of the human race, and at this time it is by far the biggest threat to the future of mankind.
10/02/2005 11:24:48 PM · #24
Originally posted by keegbow:

Originally posted by karmat:

Ummmm, if the bombings were for being in Iraq -- how long have they been there (Iraq).

Weren't there earlier bombings there (Indonesia). Like three in 2000?


no they were in 2002 and these bombings were 2 weeks before the 3 year anniversary.
inbetween these dates we have also had a bombing of the Australian Embassy in Jakarta.


I was referring to Indonesia as a whole, not just Bali.

Sorry if that was too broad a generalization.
10/03/2005 01:10:25 AM · #25
Originally posted by karmat:

Originally posted by keegbow:

Originally posted by karmat:

Ummmm, if the bombings were for being in Iraq -- how long have they been there (Iraq).

Weren't there earlier bombings there (Indonesia). Like three in 2000?


no they were in 2002 and these bombings were 2 weeks before the 3 year anniversary.
inbetween these dates we have also had a bombing of the Australian Embassy in Jakarta.


I was referring to Indonesia as a whole, not just Bali.

Sorry if that was too broad a generalization.


Major bombings in Indonesia:
1. 1 August 2000: Residence of Philippines Ambassador in Jakarta. 2 Indonesians died, and the ambassador was severely hurt. He was in his car, trying to make a turn to his home, when another car parked in front of his gates blew up.
2. 13 September 2000: Stock Exchange, Jakarta. 15 Indonesians died.
3. 24 December 2000: Churches in 10 cities. 16 Indonesians died.
4. 1 July 2002: At a mall in Jakarta. Killed one.
5. 12 October 2002: Kuta and Sanur, Bali. The blast in Kuta killed 202 people, mostly foreign tourists. But Indonesians make up the second largest group of casualties, after Australians.
6. 28 April 2003: Pipebomb at the airport. It exploded right outside the KFC outlet. 11 Indonesians died.
7. 14 July 2003: At the parliament complex in Jakarta.
8. 5 August 2003: At the JW Marriott Hotel in Jakarta. 13 people died, including a Dutch national, but most of the rest were taxi drivers waiting to pick up rides at the 5-star hotel.
9. 9 September 2004: Australian Embassy in Jakarta, killing 9 Indonesians.

There are a slew of minor bombings that killed one or two between 2000 and now in Indonesia. You just don't hear about those because they weren't dramatic enough, and no westerner was affected, therefore no media interest.

I was within 2 kms of number 1, 2, 7, 8 and 9, and on the scene within minutes of the event. You don't hear the blast as much as "feel" it. I was in Bali a day after the October 2002 blast. Regardless of whom was targeted, these bombings killed and MOST AFFECTED Indonesians.
70 to 80 percent of Bali's economy depends on tourism. Following the October 2002 blast, tourism arrival in November was at 9 percent of normal figures. Following this past weekend's blast, tourists fled Bali and no doubt, cancellations are happening now. The people who bear the brunt of bombings in Indonesia are Indonesians.
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