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DPChallenge Forums >> Rant >> I know, I know...
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11/18/2002 01:05:18 AM · #1
I brought it upon myself for submitting a partially "nekked" photo... but man - 15 scores of 1! Oh well... serves me right for showing part of a natural body. Geek that I am, I did the math. If 12 of those 1 people had just not scored me instead of giving me a 1, I would have scored a 5.285 instead of a 5.093.

I guess my plea is this - if you are truly offended by my photo - why not just leave it alone rather than distort the score downwards by giving it a 1. I know there are no monetary prizes and it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme if my photo rates well here, but I like the community and it just seems malicious to mark it low for showing less skin than prime time TV shows do.

Alright, enough said. Getting off my soapbox now. Sorry if it seems I'm beating a dead horse. Congrats to the winning photos - I thought they were all fantastic!

* This message has been edited by the author on 11/18/2002 1:03:15 AM.
11/18/2002 01:10:16 AM · #2
I don't think the nudity was really the cause for your low score, and since none of the comments expressed a negative view on the nudity, I'd have to assume that not many other people did either. I'd agree with GeneralE that the shot needed to be much closer and more appealing to really be effective amongst other macro competitors.

Drew
11/18/2002 01:13:41 AM · #3
Not sure what is going on... Looks like there may have been a couple of folks going through giving everybody 1's. Noticed that the top pics also had 2 or 3 ones. Just don't see how that could happen. (Noticed I also got 2 ones. Coincidence? I think not! <grin>)

Would hate to think that someone is double/triple voting to increase their chances.

Personally I was not offended, did not give it a one, and actually spent my time trying to figure out whether it was male or female.

I do agree, that slamming someone with a 1 because you don't like their choice of subject is a bit unfair.
11/18/2002 01:36:51 AM · #4
I thought it was great :)



Originally posted by shedonist:
I brought it upon myself for submitting a partially "nekked" photo... but man - 15 scores of 1! Oh well... serves me right for showing part of a natural body. Geek that I am, I did the math. If 12 of those 1 people had just not scored me instead of giving me a 1, I would have scored a 5.285 instead of a 5.093.

I guess my plea is this - if you are truly offended by my photo - why not just leave it alone rather than distort the score downwards by giving it a 1. I know there are no monetary prizes and it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme if my photo rates well here, but I like the community and it just seems malicious to mark it low for showing less skin than prime time TV shows do.

Alright, enough said. Getting off my soapbox now. Sorry if it seems I'm beating a dead horse. [b]Congrats to the winning photos - I thought they were all fantastic![/b


11/18/2002 10:17:36 AM · #5
Originally posted by shedonist:
I brought it upon myself for submitting a partially "nekked" photo... but man - 15 scores of 1! Oh well... serves me right for showing part of a natural body. Geek that I am, I did the math. If 12 of those 1 people had just not scored me instead of giving me a 1, I would have scored a 5.285 instead of a 5.093.

I guess my plea is this - if you are truly offended by my photo - why not just leave it alone rather than distort the score downwards by giving it a 1. I know there are no monetary prizes and it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme if my photo rates well here, but I like the community and it just seems malicious to mark it low for showing less skin than prime time TV shows do.

Alright, enough said. Getting off my soapbox now. Sorry if it seems I'm beating a dead horse. [b]Congrats to the winning photos - I thought they were all fantastic![/b


I SYMPATHIZE!! MY MOTHER ALWAYS SAID IF YOU CANT SAY SOMETHING NICE DONT SAY ANYTHING AT ALL. PEOPLE SHOULD ADOPT THIS THINKING WHEN VOTING!
11/18/2002 10:36:47 AM · #6
I'm with Drew - the few negative comments you have seem to be more about the fact that it's not close enough in (to meet the Macro challenge) than any "nudity" issue. As you say, it's not even close to being nude.

I didn't give you a 1, but you would have gotten higher out of me for a closer shot...
11/18/2002 10:56:56 AM · #7
I hear ya! I got twenty-seven one's on my photo and it was of similiar context. I know my photo wasn't wonderful, but a one? Sure, my color was a little off and some said the focus was off. The focus was thrown off purposly by using the old black panty house stretched over the lense. After seeing all the pictures in this challenge I would have given my photo around a 5. I don't understand how some of the photo's in this challenge were ranked better than mine, but so be it.
Shedonist, would have ranked yours higher than mine because I think your composition and color is much better.

Congrats to this weeks winner, great photo!
11/18/2002 11:18:59 AM · #8
Shedonist I did not find your picture at all offensive.

Jumpn2it, however, yours did offend me.
11/18/2002 11:23:42 AM · #9
Originally posted by aelith:
Shedonist I did not find your picture at all offensive.

Jumpn2it, however, yours did offend me.


Just curious, what made mine offensive?
11/18/2002 11:30:16 AM · #10
It is of course all in my mind. How old is that child? Anyway, it seemed to me that the chief subjucet was not texture or lighting but gratuitus sexual connotation. This of course may not have been your intent but sometimes you need to be aware of possible audience reactions.
11/18/2002 11:33:32 AM · #11
That child is my 21 year old fiance. I kept reading on here how cliche flower pictures were, so I did a little twist on that.

Thanks for being honest, I appreciate it and no hard feelings!
11/18/2002 12:45:05 PM · #12
Being the rant section, I think I should be OK with this post...

I have noticed, as per the first comments in this thread, that there does seem to be some interesting trends in the voting. The voters without cameras consistently vote significantly lower than the voters with cameras. There are also several instances where there are more than a few ones and then no twos. I've tested my last few photos on another website that rates images, and my current technology submission is rating a higher absolute score out of seven than my image here is getting out of ten. My current submission is rating about a 30% difference in score between the two sites. Given that the last two challenges were fairly open ended, and my submissions clearly fit both challenges well, I don't think this deviance in the scores is based on challenge interpretation. It's quite a significant difference. I'm not bothered; I'm now beyond hoping my images will do well here based on artisitic merit.

People voting consistently low to skew results, however, does bother me. The only way I could see this being eliminated is if voting is relative rather than absolute - that is, photos are ranked relative to one another rather than assigning values. It would take more work, but then, it would be fairer. Thoughts?

James.



* This message has been edited by the author on 11/18/2002 12:43:32 PM.
11/18/2002 12:54:25 PM · #13
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
Being the rant section, I think I should be OK with this post...

I have noticed, as per the first comments in this thread, that there does seem to be some interesting trends in the voting. The voters without cameras consistently vote significantly lower than the voters with cameras. There are also several instances where there are more than a few ones and then no twos. I've tested my last few photos on another website that rates images, and my current technology submission is rating a higher absolute score out of seven than my image here is getting out of ten. My current submission is rating about a 30% difference in score between the two sites. Given that the last two challenges were fairly open ended, and my submissions clearly fit both challenges well, I don't think this deviance in the scores is based on challenge interpretation. It's quite a significant difference. I'm not bothered; I'm now beyond hoping my images will do well here based on artisitic merit.

People voting consistently low to skew results, however, does bother me. The only way I could see this being eliminated is if voting is relative rather than absolute - that is, photos are ranked relative to one another rather than assigning values. It would take more work, but then, it would be fairer. Thoughts?

James.



James, I have been here 7 months and have come to the conclusion I would prefer to know who is voting on my photos so I can better understand who is rating my photos and if I am reaching some folks regardless of score.

I'll probably hold off submitting here until the new site comes up and I will explore submitting my photos at some of the sites that do have open voting just to get the non-anonymous numerical and commented feedback to see who is doing the commenting/voting and maybe better understand where my photography is going.
11/18/2002 01:07:08 PM · #14
Thanks for all the comments, everyone. I realize that no negative comments were made about the nudity. I also realize that my theory is just that - a theory. But I do think it's odd that I got so more 1s than 2s - usually the graph of scores is a bell curve. It may be pure conjecture on my part, but I have heard people say in these very forums that they score a 1 for photos they think are inappropriate due to nudity. I just wish people who do engage in that sort of behavior would not, especially those who don't even enter challenges. I'm not trying to cry unfair or anything, just ranting about voting patterns.

It is so hard to tell why people score you high or low. On photo.net, the voting scale is from 1-7 and you are forced to make a comment if you give a 1,2, or 7. I find this interesting. Of course, you can also see who gave you what ratings on that site.

Of course, here's the photo I really would have liked to submit. It's not legal by DPChallenge rules though since it's so digitally modified.
11/18/2002 01:22:28 PM · #15
Originally posted by shedonist:
... but I have heard people say in these very forums that they score a 1 for photos they think are inappropriate due to nudity. I just wish people who do engage in that sort of behavior would not, especially those who don't even enter challenges. I'm not trying to cry unfair or anything, just ranting about voting patterns...."


I received 2 - 1's and 4 - 2's even though I placed in the top 10% this week. I think I'd like to see the name/profile of the people who score lowest and highest. Again, my theory of trolls still exists!
11/18/2002 05:38:32 PM · #16
Originally posted by PTMAN:
MY MOTHER ALWAYS SAID IF YOU CANT SAY SOMETHING NICE DONT SAY ANYTHING AT ALL. PEOPLE SHOULD ADOPT THIS THINKING WHEN VOTING!

No, please don't do this! I noticed a great decline in critical comments. While I appreciate it when people tell me they like my photo, it doesn't help me improving my skills. So please be honest and don't hesitate to tell something NOT nice.

@shedonist: Your photo is breathtaking! I like the version at photo.net a whole lot more than your DPC submission. The cloth looks like a curtain ;-)


11/18/2002 11:57:49 PM · #17
i gave it a 6.

i thought there were a few things that could have been fixed, but overall, it was a pretty good photo.

things i would have changed:
the angle. i would have tried to make the tatto appear as flat as possible. i might have shot if from below and above as well, and seen which angle vertically worked best.
the shirt framming the shot doesn't quite work for me. i can't place why, either. it's one of my favourite colors. i might have shot it from farther out or closer up. i dunno.

but overall, it's a pretty good photo.

there is no reason a picture like this should receive a 1. i have never given a 1 on here.
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