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DPChallenge Forums >> Hardware and Software >> And it's the 20D by a nose....
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09/22/2005 04:01:46 AM · #1
Somehow I ended up with two threads so I thought I might as well start a third. :)

Thanks to everyone that posted advice, sent me PMs, and let me play devil's advocate on my pending dive into DSLR cameras.

I took a hard look at all of my options and considered all the advice, thoughtful questions, and grilling. I even got some ideas for how to vaporize rabbits, and what usefulness an f35 lens might have, which was entertaining if not useful information.

In the end the 20D won out. It's a good solid affordable camera. Pretty much can't go wrong with it from what I can see. It will serve all of my needs and leaves room to grow in the future. So here's what I ended up getting:

Canon EOS 20D SLR Camera Body
Tamron SP AF28-75MM F/2.8 MACRO XR Di LD-IF F/ CANON EOS
Canon EF 70-200 F/2.8L USM IMAGE STABILIZER LENS

Now comes all the accessorizing. Extra battery, memory card, and UV filters top my list.

Thanks again, I should have the camera sometime next week.
09/22/2005 04:07:09 AM · #2
I think you'll be more than happy with that camera and those lenses. What about the wide-angle that you were wanting? 28 isn't all too wide on the 20D. Of course, you should have some saved money from not buying the 1D :P

Message edited by author 2005-09-22 04:07:27.
09/22/2005 04:25:04 AM · #3
You'll never think you'd need it... That is until you use it. That is the Vertical/Battery Grip.

See if you can borrow one from someone first if you're not sure. Then buy it.
09/22/2005 04:33:45 AM · #4
I have the vertical grip on my 10D.....you'd have to pry it out of my cold dead fingers to get it away from me... The strap around the back of my hand has saved some ligaments & tendons, particulary in my thumb.
You should know, tho' I shoot 90% of the time with the Canon 70-200 f2.8L beautiful monster of a lens, (quite heavy) Almost every weeknd, 7-11 hours shooting, sometimes 3 or 4 days in a row as I shoot equestrian events with it.
09/22/2005 04:35:18 AM · #5
Originally posted by wimbello:

You'll never think you'd need it... That is until you use it. That is the Vertical/Battery Grip.

See if you can borrow one from someone first if you're not sure. Then buy it.


Oddly enough, I sold mine (got my camera used, and it came with it) so that I could afford another lens :P
09/22/2005 04:36:15 AM · #6
Oh don't worry, I haven't finished buying lenses yet, heh. But I figured those two will keep me plenty busy for the first week or two at least.

I knew I wanted the 70-200, so that was a no brainer, and the Tamron seemed like a really smart bargain. Beyond that (including the wide angle) I want to see what I can get out of those two lenses before deciding what's needed next. Wide angle? Super telephoto? Prime lens? I dunno yet, so I stopped spending money. :)

I've heard about those vertical battery grips, I'll have to check em out. Got a link?
09/22/2005 04:38:25 AM · #7
I'm also looking for filters and a good camera bag. Any suggestions are appreciated.

Oh and whats a good fast card to use?
09/22/2005 05:34:41 AM · #8
I have the 20D and the 70-200 f2.8 L IS, and without the batterygrip on the 20D you will have a hard time holding a balance on that lens, it's very heavy and it really needs the counterweight the grip gives, and you will have a much more professional feeling with the grip...

it's a must have, not something you "might" get later..

BG-E2 batterygrip

and sandisk extreem III is the card to get

Message edited by author 2005-09-22 05:36:20.
09/22/2005 05:49:49 AM · #9
Ditto from me on the grip... With a heavy lens on I find it uncomfortable to hang on to the camera for very long without the grip, especially shooting vertically.

For a good bag, I've got the lowerpro nova 5 AW, which holds two bodies, a flash, and four lenses plus misc crap, although in the bag I have the lenses off the cameras to fit it all in..

For cards, I use a few Sandisk ultra 512's and a couple of Kingston 1Gb 40x cards.

Enjoy...
09/22/2005 06:38:49 AM · #10
Ok added the following accessories.

Lowepro Nova 4 AW Shoulder Bag (Black)
Sandisk 1 GB Extreme III CompactFlash Card
Canon BG-E2 Vertical Grip/Battery Holder
B+W 77mm UV Haze 010 (MRC) Multi-Resistant Coating Glass Filter
B+W 67mm UV Haze 010 (MRC) Multi-Resistant Coating Glass Filter

09/22/2005 07:28:36 AM · #11
Congrats on the Canon. I have the 10D and have been immensley happy with it. Couple of thoughts here -

1) Now that you own a Canon you have a big decision to make - do you put your sense of humor in mothballs and become all-to-serious about photography or do you just screw the artsy fartsy thing and still find pure 10 year old joy in snapping shit. From what I've seen, most Canon choose the former; still it is your decision to make.

2) Check Best Buy and Circuit City frequently for prices on Compact Flash cards. With a rebate I was able to get 512 cards at $34 a piece (this included a maiol in rebate, but still such a deal!).

Again, congrats and you have a good time now!
09/22/2005 07:57:45 AM · #12
if you don't need the "extreme" version of the sandisk card, go for the cheaper ultra instead. all that changes from one to the other is the temperature and stress resistance, NOT THE SPEED - check it out on sandisk's website.

as for UV-filters, DON'T use them if you don't ABSOLUTELY have to. It's much more useful, necessary and lens-protecting to have the provided hood on the lens when it's in use (outdoor or indoor, there's always a source for lens flare inducing light) and when it's not in use, put on the lid. because what breaks a UV-filter can easily break or at least damage the much harder front lens element of an L-lens at the same time - don't fool yourself about being safe with a UV-filter.

PLUS, even a 100 dollar (B+W or other classy) UV-filter is still like putting a transparent film (ceran wrap for the kitchen) over your brand new plasma tv, believe me, I have reduced to hardly anything but L-glass and haven't used my UV-filters ONCE on L glass since then.

It's much better to have your gear protected by a proper insurance instead of an expensive UV-filter. call your agent, get a quote and you'll see that you can get insurance for your gear at a fraction of the price of a decent filter. and it will cover theft, damage by the elements, robbery at home and away, it'll even cover you, your spouse, kids, friends, relatives etc. accidentally or foolishly dropping and breaking your own gear. try that with a UV filter ;-D

As for the Tamron lens, why not get the 24-105 L IS 4.0 or a used 28-70 2.8 L from Canon instead? I'm sure they're even better, they're L, one is longer and the other is better than it's successor, the 24-70 2.8 and the 24-105 has IS in a range where IS starts making sense, not to mention the fact that it's lighter than any 24-70 2.8...

Instead of having to get two different size UV filters, you could instead buy a 77mm polarized filter or a neutral density one - whichever you choose, they fit all of canon's top lenses.

As for bags, I'm very happy with my lowepros, but I have more than one, depending on the occasion. You can get them incredibly cheap at B&H, either used (you won't notice) or with slight color aberrations (nobody will notice) at a fraction of the regular price. Try not to walk around with a bag that looks like you're carrying a million bucks. It's better if it's just you who knows what you're carrying, and not any thug out there - my personal experience from NYC, where I frequently traveled including on crowded buses, boats and subways, with a lot of gear and NEVER got mugged in 2 years, going ANYWHERE I CHOSE TO GO.

Just my two cents, hope I gave you a fresh spin on some of your convictions ;-)

Bruno, fellow, happy 20D (and 1Ds Mk I, on order right now from Adorama) 28-70 2.8 L and 70-200 L IS owner :-D
09/22/2005 07:58:46 AM · #13
UV filters are ok for seaside shooting or in bad weathers, but on L glass it isn't needed for protection against scratches, the front element has a scratch resistant coating, and with the best glass money can buy, why put a cheap class on it, it will not make the pictues better, it will NOT protect the lens anymore than the scratch resistant coating, but in salty air it will protect the lens, you will not be wiping salt of the front element but the filter, that is about the only time I use UV filters on my lenses.

have you EVER seen a used L lens with a bad front element on ebay, they are all "like mint" or something like that, and they do not all use UV filters ;)

I'd rather get the B+W Circular Polarizer for the 70-200L it does wonders for birdshots on water, just look at my only print here on DPC, just natural colors enhanced with the polarizer, almost no PS work done.
09/22/2005 08:13:35 AM · #14
Congrats on the setup! You will love this setup. With the grip, I also recommend the Leather Hand Strap. Makes it real comfortable and safe. Also, with the 70-200 IS and grip on there, the stock Canon neck strap can be, well, a pain in the neck. A neoprene strap helps make the setup feel a lot lighter on the neck.
09/22/2005 08:35:11 AM · #15
Originally posted by DanSig:

but on L glass it isn't needed for protection against scratches, the front element has a scratch resistant coating

To each his own, I guess. I have Hoya Pro-1 UV(0) filters on all of my L lenses. They went on within minutes of being unboxed and only rarely come off for cleaning. I do not consider the quality of my images to have been reduced at all, but I do know how much dust, finger prints and other "stuff" accumulates on the filter... and every time I clean it, I'm glad to know that if something bad ever did happen, I'd probably just have to replace the UV filter and not send the lens back to Canon for a new front element.

And yes, I always use the included lens hoods when shooting. :)
09/22/2005 09:58:43 AM · #16
Originally posted by DanSig:

UV filters will NOT protect the lens anymore than the scratch resistant coating


It IS, however a darn sight easier (and cheaper) to change the UV filter rather than the lens you just paid an arm and a leg for, should it get scratched/damaged etc.



Edit:typo

Message edited by author 2005-09-22 09:59:39.
09/22/2005 10:05:22 AM · #17
Woohoo, three cheers for a wise decision!

I put a super cheap UV filter on all of my lenses but I've been shooting more rodeo, drag racing and spot news than landscapes and studio stuff. Depends on your shooting...if you're all about every pixel being perfect, don't use one. If you're all about capturing the moment, throw one on there and protect your lens.
09/22/2005 04:08:19 PM · #18
If nothing else the UV filters give me peace of mind and I shoot on or around salt water a lot being in Seattle. I have no regrets buying the filters even though I've heard all the arguments before. :)

Telehubbie -- good calls on both of those, I will definitely pick them up as well.
09/22/2005 04:13:32 PM · #19
BeeGee: As for the Tamron vs the Canon you mentioned, the Tamron costs under $400 which frees me up to spend money on either a wide or long lens. It has gotten excellent reviews and seems like it will fulfill my purposes just fine for that range.
09/22/2005 04:14:20 PM · #20
Good choice, enjoy it. Don't forget to check out the Sigma range.

Steve
09/24/2005 02:37:46 AM · #21
I'd recommend a grip to balance the L lens.
Consider getting the non IS lens if you don't need the IS. That way with the money you save, you can buy a Tamron 17-35 and a grip.
I bought el cheapo ebay and Hoya Green label UV filters for protection. If I think a shot is critical, I remove the filter and shoot.
I'd also recommend CPLs as well.

Other than that? Enjoy the heck out of the set up.
09/24/2005 03:24:55 AM · #22
One thing I don't like about the Tamron lenses is they rotate (zoom) in the opposite direction of Canons. I don't know if this would bother you but it drives me crazy.
I agree it's one of the best lenses for the money but because of little things like that, I would get a Sigma.
09/24/2005 10:05:13 AM · #23
welcome to the club
I ditto the suggestion for the batterygrip+strap. gives you a better grip on the camera, better balance with a long lens, and the wrist-strap helps a lot when you are simply holding the camera or walking from place to place. Also does a lot for your peace of mind, because the camera is well attached to you wrist and won't fall out of your grip if somebody bumbs your arm.
the extra shooting-button is handy for protrait orientation shots and the 2 batteries used together last longer than one battery used twice. I have the camera on 1min auto-shutdown (since it's so quick up from standby) and 2sec LCD diplay and the batteries last forever, several thousand frames.
If you're doing landscapes then a CPL is very handy, and maybe some neutral density filters, esp the ones that are half ND and half clear. Check out the cokin filters for that.
09/26/2005 05:49:47 PM · #24
Thanks everyone for the great advice and gues what?

It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here. It's here.

Sep 26, 2005 12:18 PM

Delivery exception
BOTHELL, WA
Customer not available or business closed

I just made arrangements to pick it up after the truck returns to the base facility. In 3 hours I should be happily oohing and ahhing over the new toys.
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