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DPChallenge Forums >> Out and About >> new post processing mentorship group
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07/28/2005 10:33:15 PM · #1
Ok some people have told me they were interested in a post processing group So I would like to have one, but I am not very found of thoose closed groups, and I know it could get a bit messy and out of hands if people drop in and out from the thread, any ideas?
I think it should be a way where we could all learn from each other
07/28/2005 10:34:41 PM · #2
i think thats the whole idea of the 'forum'
07/28/2005 10:45:26 PM · #3
I don't have a complete answer, but one aspect of our Freeman Patterson Workshop group which I think has made a difference is that each member is keeping their photo postings together with a description of their work, in an external Blog. I think this results in a more tangible, and more trackable, learning tool than just posting and interacting in a DPC thread.

At the end of the workshop, each of us will have a nice web-published journal of our work, some of the thought processes that went behind it, and people's comments.

It makes it a little harder to go read everyone's journal, and to see when something is new. But a number of us have placed links to the other members blogs in our own to make it easier (which is why it's still good to keep the group small), and we simply post in the thread a link to our blog when we have new material.

Of course, we just got started, so it's hard to say it will work in the long run, but I've been impressed with the participation in this manner so far. See the Freeman Patterson thread for examples.

While setting limits on a group would be less important if everyone is using Blogs, there still is a need to limit it though, since the point of the group is partly to work together and help each other. If possible to comment on everyone's images. And each of us can only do that for so many people.

So that's not an answer to your question, but perhaps some ideas to think about.

07/28/2005 11:25:22 PM · #4
One could always (if they have a paid account) create a folder in their portfolio for this purpose...

Message edited by author 2005-07-28 23:25:51.
07/29/2005 12:29:40 AM · #5
Hey, I like messy. I think that it could work as an open forum as long as you kept some sort of control of the content. In other words don't let people stray from the main topic, gently nudge them back into the group direction. As the leader if you jus kept plugging along regardless of the fact that some will not keep up or may come and go I think we still would learn. Heck, I learn a ton from the free form threads now. One dedicated to post processing would be great.

Only issue I can see is that you would have to stick with one software program and those of us who may not use it would have to figure out the equivalents ourselves. Many of us love your results (look at all the ribbons!) and would jump at the chance to learn some of your tricks of the trade. Limiting the participation would surely disappoint some.
07/29/2005 01:55:53 AM · #6
I haven't been following any of the current mentorship groups very closely, so please forgive me if I'm only summarizing the status quo. As I understand it, the purpose of these groups is:
1. To provide instruction on a specialized topic
2. To assign exercises which reinforce the lesson material
3. To provide feedback on the completed exercises

All three of these can be done by the mentor, but I think that it might be beneficial for mentees to share the load of grading the homework. This will help to ensure that the mentor doesn't get burned out, as well as equipping the group members to one day become mentors themselves.

Ways to make the group seem less like a clique:
1. Require group members to post comments to a given number of photos on DPC suggesting ways in which the picture could be improved.
2. Keep the instruction and assignment roles separate from the feedback / grading of exercises. As totaldis suggested, the existing infrastructure at DPC (forum discussions, comments on individual photos) seems sufficient for providing feedback.
3. Keep it a part of DPC. If all group members spun off and started using a site like DeviantArt to host group-related activity, it may be less visible (and therefore less annoying) to non-members, but I think it would probably qualify as a clique at that point.
4. Aim to have the group produce a DPC tutorial every so often. Perhaps if the mentor provided a rough outline the mentees could prove their learning by contributing to the content.

These are just a few suggestions off the top of my head. I think that for any sub-group within DPC to seem like an inviting circle of friends rather than a clique, each member of the group needs to make giving back to the community a priority.
07/29/2005 01:58:50 AM · #7
Originally posted by metoecus:

4. Aim to have the group produce a DPC tutorial every so often. Perhaps if the mentor provided a rough outline the mentees could prove their learning by contributing to the content.

A really excellent suggestion!
07/29/2005 02:36:41 AM · #8
Post processing definately interests me. I use Elements 2 due to budget considerations and the fact that lenses or a riding lawnmower get my next big dollars...depends which day of the week you ask me one but it will be one of those two next.
07/30/2005 12:10:15 PM · #9
I am another that is interested in a group under your direction. In regards to open mentorship there are + and - to both.

If it is open you run the risk of lossing and gaining people during the duration of the course. It will also make it impossible to provide feedback to each person, which means you will have to pick a few and make sure to provide a projected learning environment. Making assignments mandatory is almost impossible, which leaves the work up to discretion. I think the biggest impact is the level of learning will decrease slightly due to a larger classroom. The class will slow down if not administrated properly and thus becoming harder to focus and learn.

Benefits would be that more people are exposed to a higher level of your experience. If administrated right the class could move quite quickly and those who can keep up will benefit. The class would have more material of students to view and learn. Most of all it gives more people an opportunity learn.

Some would argue that having a closed class with a #'ed group of students doesn't limit learning of others since they can participate as well. It just means they can't engage in direct conversation.

Out of the two options having an open class in my opinion would be the hardest to administrate and maybe the easier to teach.
07/30/2005 12:28:38 PM · #10
I'm interested in learning :)
07/30/2005 12:31:01 PM · #11
I´m really interested in learning and joining to this group! What have I to do to join it?
07/30/2005 02:29:07 PM · #12
I'm one of those interested in this group. I think the Freeman Patterson group is a model that is worth looking at further, I also like the idea of having the group create a tutorial.

The hardest thing for the mentors seems to be getting their mentees to complete 'assignments' within a reasonable timeframe (for all sorts of reasons all of which are pretty reasonable TBH). So with that in mind I would suggest that the mentors set a specified timelimit on the 'assignments' (some are already doing this) and once that limit is reached to move on to the next thing. The mentors are giving up their time to teach us, so it should be up to us to keep-up or catch-up..
07/30/2005 03:48:29 PM · #13
As someone who would dearly like to be part of this group I suggest that maybe it could work to do the group like the others but with no membership restrictions, initially it will be chaotic but over a period of time it should settle.

One problem would be that people will be joining in at various stages which could be confusing and restrictive, a way around this would be to write mini how-tos so that new members can get up to speed, although this would be pressure on the mentor, this could be helped by students writing the how-tos (with the mentor acting as an editor). This approach could lead more to an open post-processing community rather than a closed group.

Just ideas after a few beers :)
07/30/2005 04:33:44 PM · #14
I'd be interested in particiapting. I like the ideas that have been put forward so far. An open and informal group has advantages as people will come and go depending on their other commitments, interest level, etc. This will bring new ideas to the forum constantly. I see only 2 issue with an open forum:

1. Overload - I guess we can see if this happens before starting to worry about it now

2. As someone mentioned, new members will raise questions that have been previously addressed. This is easily addressed by referring people back to previous parts of the thread.

having a more open and informal group also has advantages. For instance, if an assignment is set, then a timeframe can be established and the forum can just move on when that time is up. There is less temptation to have to wait for people as there would be if it were a formal group that needed to be held together.

Overall, I think that having it open and informal should make it easier for the mentor to establish a framework and timetable and just move along with people keeping up or not as they wish. Things like overload with assignments can easily be managed by saying, for instance, that you'll only personally comment on the first 5 assignments to be posted but other participants can comment on whatever they wish. There's lots of easy stuff like that that can be built in if needed.

I would just go for it and see how it works out. Make necessary adjustments as you go along rather than trying to predict everything ahead of time.

Message edited by author 2005-07-30 16:37:02.
07/30/2005 08:46:04 PM · #15
Well, I'm very new to this site (a few weeks) but it's been an amazing learning tool thus far...

I think that an open class is more interesting and beneficial to all if everyone that posts photos is expected to comments on others' as well. This would lighten the load on the mentor.

The mentor could post an assignment photo and have everyone post their post processing in the thread and comment on each other's photos in addition to the mentor giving advice and hints. I have in mind the thread that was started on photoshoping someone with some hair... It worked well, where anyone interested posted post processed photos and got comments from the initial sender and others as well.

After a predetermined period, as someone mentioned earlier, a mini how-to could be typed up by a volunteer and edited by the mentor...

oh and of course, count me in!!!! :)

Message edited by author 2005-07-30 20:47:49.
07/30/2005 09:09:58 PM · #16
I've been watching the workgroups that where set before, but due to my poor time left to be here I didn't cheked them in , but this one makes me really want to enter. Count me in if you can. Also the time difference sometimes is complicated, but Ill try to keep up with you.
07/30/2005 09:45:14 PM · #17
I want to join!
08/01/2005 06:58:45 PM · #18
I have a processing question.... how did you get the colours of your FairyLand picture?

If you shoot it in RAW, I'm GUESSING that you turned up the shadows slider, slightly desaturated everything but greens and turned down the vignetting slider. But that's just a guess. Were any layers involved? Any Photoshop filter combinations? It sort of has the same look as a Sacha Waldman photo - www.sachawaldman.com . Care to share? Great work! Keep it up!
Thanks!
08/01/2005 07:04:22 PM · #19
I would be interested in joining in!!!
08/01/2005 07:14:05 PM · #20
I think it could work fine. I personally have a few direct questions I'd like to ask you in a thread/forum setting but at the same time I might get crazy busy in the next few weeks where a formal group setting wouldn't work for me.

If you wouldn't mind fielding some quick questions....near topic, I'd be a happy dude. I assume many people have the exact same questions as well, so things shouldn't get too scattered.

......and thank you so much for offering, this is a very cool thing.

Message edited by author 2005-08-01 19:15:00.
08/01/2005 07:19:12 PM · #21
Originally posted by heida:

Ok some people have told me they were interested in a post processing group So I would like to have one, but I am not very found of thoose closed groups, and I know it could get a bit messy and out of hands if people drop in and out from the thread, any ideas?
I think it should be a way where we could all learn from each other

Heida... Please... please do a forum... I am DYING to know how you do it. I would hang on your every word! :)
08/01/2005 07:20:31 PM · #22
me too heida. I love your vision, and I feel that I would be able to learn a lot from you.

drake
08/01/2005 07:22:18 PM · #23
me too plz!
08/01/2005 07:35:35 PM · #24
Im in just let me know when and where.
08/01/2005 07:38:44 PM · #25
I would be interested in this as well. Thanks!
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