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02/23/2005 02:54:11 PM · #1 |
| Am i the only one who thinks an overhaul of the voting system is due, to stop the underhand low votes given by people whose only reason is to 'bump up' their own placing? Midnight mist from Bridges II was my personal favourite, yet 10 voters decided this picture only merited a 1, the lowest possible score!! Maybe a good idea would be to introduce an additional method by requesting that those who vote 3 or under have to explain the reasons why they thought to do so? And if the reason is deemed dubious then the vote considered void? That way the people responsible would have to rely on their own imagination and skill rather than resorting to underhand tactics. |
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02/23/2005 02:59:06 PM · #2 |
I would think just forcing a comment when voting under 3 would stop many of those votes.
BUT, that comment might be "A", just something to feed the puter to get it to accept the 1,2,3.
Also, then, the number of 4s would go up. The overall scores would be higher, but the placing would be the same - the #1 place is the #1 plate, #234 is still gonna be #234.
I'd like to see the whole 1-10 scale tossed out. I like the voting schema over at //www.fujimugs.com. But we have a LOT more entires here, so i might not be feasible. Dunno.
i doubt anything will be changed here.
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02/23/2005 03:00:11 PM · #3 |
Check out this thread. I think beetle has the way to fix this problem.
Thread
Have copied her suggestion for ease of finding it:
Oh yes it could!
I think this approach could work:
As the challenge moves from submission to voting stage, all submissions are (at random, of course) divided into two lots - let's just say A and B for now.
All people in the A group vote on the B's, and the B's vote on the A's.
You would then need ribbons for each group, but at least it means two things: everyone can participate in the same challenge, and there is no point in voting others down since it won't affect your own chance to win a ribbon.
What do you think..... could that work?
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02/23/2005 03:01:47 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by Patrol:
Am i the only one who thinks an overhaul of the voting system is due, to stop the underhand low votes given by people whose only reason is to 'bump up' their own placing? Midnight mist from Bridges II was my personal favourite, yet 10 voters decided this picture only merited a 1, the lowest possible score!! Maybe a good idea would be to introduce an additional method by requesting that those who vote 3 or under have to explain the reasons why they thought to do so? And if the reason is deemed dubious then the vote considered void? That way the people responsible would have to rely on their own imagination and skill rather than resorting to underhand tactics. |
This subject has been thrashed. The system works because all of the entries, including the ones entered by those few who are low-balling the better images, are subject to the same trolls.
Make people have to explain any votes cast under three and four will be your new one. It would have the exact same effect as if the voting range was changed from 4 - 10, instead of 1 - 10. Everone has a right to vote however they please as long as they stay within the established rules and should have to explain their vote to no one, be it a ten or a one.
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02/23/2005 03:03:23 PM · #5 |
You'll find that this comes up on a regular basis. There must be a dozen or more past threads on the subject. The bottom line is:
1. there are only a very few real outlier votes (I won't refer to them as troll votes since I can't prove that). Usually any given image receives only one or two votes outside a statistically normal distribution.
2.) There is a system in place to discount votes from voters whose pattern indicates abuse of the system.
3.) The effect of voting everyone else down and you own image up is so incredibly small that it's negligible.
Every time anyone has done an analysis, the conclusion is that there is significant spread in the voting, however it is due ot the normal, expected variation in voter perception of the images. In short, the DPC voting process is quite "clean."
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02/23/2005 03:11:19 PM · #6 |
| I think Beetle's method would solve the problem, as she says, there'd be no point voting others down, as it wouldn't affect the result of your particular photo. |
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02/23/2005 03:11:21 PM · #7 |
If it was troll voting, explain how the 10 trolls that hit the second place image all missed the 1st and 3rd place images (both had no 1's)?
Also note the site kicks out all votes from people that display patterns consistent with the troll practice you described. Thus if those ten 1 votes were from people that voted most or many images a 1, the votes would have been discarded.
Looking at the image, I would guess there are 10 people that are anti post editing that thought it was over edited, or they voted a 1 for other reasons. (note, personally I like the image and the editing)
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02/23/2005 03:19:09 PM · #8 |
I don't really have an opinion on troll voting or the like, but ten '1' votes does seem a little out of the ordinary to me for this 2nd place image. Not trying to start a conspiracy mind you :-)
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02/23/2005 03:23:16 PM · #9 |
This has been hammered out here on countless occassions and I dont believe there is any solution that would keep everybody happy.
Do people do this to give their photos a better chance? I cannot understand how anyone would be so mean, nasty and downright small minded.
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02/23/2005 03:24:21 PM · #10 |
| Do Trolls get discounts on membership? |
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02/23/2005 03:24:37 PM · #11 |
What is the definition of a troll on this site?
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02/23/2005 03:24:43 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by richterrell:
I don't really have an opinion on troll voting or the like, but ten '1' votes does seem a little out of the ordinary to me for this 2nd place image. Not trying to start a conspiracy mind you :-) |
Too late!!
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02/23/2005 03:33:59 PM · #13 |
speaking of a conspiracy...it is kinda odd. Out of the first ten images, this is the only one to have gotten that many ones. In fact, the next greatest number of ones out of the top ten is 2.
By the way, I have the flu and it seems to be affecting my writing. I'm usually better at explaining myself than this and my post on the bridge composition thread.
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02/23/2005 03:37:37 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by MikeOwens:
This has been hammered out here on countless occassions and I dont believe there is any solution that would keep everybody happy. |
yea I feel bad for the dead horse that's being repeatedly beaten. Is there no peace for the weary?? ;-)
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02/23/2005 03:41:15 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
Originally posted by MikeOwens:
This has been hammered out here on countless occassions and I dont believe there is any solution that would keep everybody happy. |
yea I feel bad for the dead horse that's being repeatedly beaten. Is there no peace for the weary?? ;-) |
I totally agree. Just the fact that the photo still won second place proves that it didn't hamper the end result of a great photo.
And I am still wanting to know:
What is the definition of a Troll on this site?
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02/23/2005 03:52:15 PM · #16 |
One of the reasons i havent submitted to any challanges becasue when i do i want to make sure nobody has a excuse to give me a one
Leon
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02/23/2005 03:54:59 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by LEONJR:
One of the reasons i havent submitted to any challanges becasue when i do i want to make sure nobody has a excuse to give me a one |
There are almost always one or two people who don't need an excuse, Leon. You might be waiting a while ;-)
e
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02/23/2005 03:55:07 PM · #18 |
I'm not suprised that aprticular image gathered so many low votes to go with its high ones; of all the top-10 images, it's by far the most "distorted" in its geometry. The colors are unreal looking as well, although they apparently are fairly natural based on what the photographer commented. In any case, it seems a composition that has the potential of polarizing people; the same cannot be said for #1 and #3.
Understand, I think the ribbon is deserved... I am just pointing out aspects of the image that may have caused people to be less-than-positive about it. Does it deserve 1's? Certainly not. But hardly any images deserve 1's, and most of them get them anyway.
Robt.
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02/23/2005 03:56:34 PM · #19 |
Originally posted by e301:
Originally posted by LEONJR:
One of the reasons i havent submitted to any challanges becasue when i do i want to make sure nobody has a excuse to give me a one |
There are almost always one or two people who don't need an excuse, Leon. You might be waiting a while ;-)
e |
I might well get prepared seems like everyone else did...
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02/23/2005 03:58:51 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by vince31874:
What is the definition of a troll on this site? |
Someone who lives under a bridge and eats billy goats
(good photo opportunities though) |
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02/23/2005 04:01:27 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by Tallbloke:
Originally posted by vince31874:
What is the definition of a troll on this site? |
Someone who lives under a bridge and eats billy goats
(good photo opportunities though) |
Yup. I knew someone would say that. And I am glad you did, because it just shows you how silly the term TROLL VOTING is.
Message edited by author 2005-02-23 16:01:47.
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02/23/2005 04:04:31 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by LEONJR:
One of the reasons i havent submitted to any challanges becasue when i do i want to make sure nobody has a excuse to give me a one
Leon |
Leon - dont wait just do it!
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02/23/2005 04:05:15 PM · #23 |
This may have already been covered but to vote you need to be registered right and of course a member for member challenges?
The system tracks votes already, so if it tracks someone giving out more than say 3-4% (or X%) of the total votes as 1's then that person is singling themself out for scruteny by the admin (with rules set up for this)?
Just a thought.
Melissa |
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02/23/2005 04:05:35 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by MikeOwens:
Originally posted by LEONJR:
One of the reasons i havent submitted to any challanges becasue when i do i want to make sure nobody has a excuse to give me a one
Leon |
Leon - dont wait just do it! |
Screw the trolls, bust a cherry.
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02/23/2005 04:09:18 PM · #25 |
| I have no idea why that second place photo got that 10 one voting but if those ten voters were taken out then that photo would have 7.54 and first place. So if it were indeed some kind of troll voters then they did cost RulerZigzag his blue ribbon. I would be crazy now if I were he. |
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