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03/25/2002 11:40:06 AM · #1
make it so the photographers can reply to comments on their photos because other people assume to much about photos and we have no way to defend ourselves
03/25/2002 12:46:13 PM · #2
Frustrating, isn't it?
03/25/2002 01:45:00 PM · #3
Originally posted by heartsdivide:
make it so the photographers can reply to comments on their photos because other people assume to much about photos and we have no way to defend ourselves

For photographers with their email disclosed, you can email them. Click their username in the comment to go to their userpage, then fire off an email. Hopefully the "send message to user with undisclosed email address" will work soon so that you can converse with them as well.
03/27/2002 12:27:22 PM · #4
but then all the people who posted comments cant see it.. you need to make it so photographers can reply publicly. its only right
03/27/2002 02:48:10 PM · #5
heartsdivide,

if people aren't "getting" your photo - then you have to go back and assess why that's happening, and do a better job next time - that's why it's called a "CHALLENGE" and NOT "wait let me tell you what I was really thinking" ...

try not to take it personally, if you're playing the game, you're in the same boat as everyone else!
03/27/2002 03:40:26 PM · #6
Mikey, you are right on. Wish I'd said it.
By the way, Ever notice your running score? Mine stays within + - .4
from start to finish.(usually) I think it means the voting is a fairly good indication of the quality of the shot and is a reflection of the fairness of the voters. Surely no one would vote high on the shots they didn't think could win and lower on the better ones just to keep theit voting average from looking bad, while not raising the score of the better competition.

* This message has been edited by the author on 3/27/2002 3:50:58 PM.
03/27/2002 04:20:03 PM · #7
Originally posted by David Ey:
... Ever notice your running score? Mine stays within + - .4
from start to finish.(usually) I think it means the voting is a fairly good indication of the quality of the shot and is a reflection of the fairness of the voters.


I agree with you David the voting system is fairly resistant to tampering, thanks to the admins!

I did figure out a way to tamper with the votes though, you could register as multiple users and be able to:

1. Vote multiple times on the challenge photos
2. Submit multiple photos!

The registration has a unique email address for every user BUT if you own your own domain, you could make up as many email addresses as you like.

So that would be something to watch for.
03/27/2002 06:58:03 PM · #8
i would like to be able to reply to comments during voting not to defend something, but because i would rather respond when i get a comment instead of waiting until the voting is over and having to face a whole list of comments.

i mean, i realize that people probably never go back and follow up their comments. but even so, if i felt the need to respond to a comment, i'd want to do it right after i got it--not a week after. and it doesn't really matter when we respond since it won't be visible until the voting period is over.
03/27/2002 07:07:53 PM · #9
it has nothign to do with people getting my photo.. it's just the fact that i can't defend myself.. truthfully i don't care what people think of my stuff.. i just feel people should have a right to defend themselves to comments made by people that aren't true.

it's nothing major.. you guys are making a big deal out of nothing.

just a simple thing
03/27/2002 07:18:56 PM · #10
Nobody can see comments until the challenge is over and the results are up. If your problem is with an individual user and would like only him to see the comment, follow the steps given by Reuben. If you'd like to reply to the comment publicly as a comment on a comment, you can do that the second the challenge is over -- and nobody has seen the comment before that, so you've lost nothing.
03/27/2002 09:26:55 PM · #11
i guess you didn't understand anything i said.
03/28/2002 12:39:11 PM · #12
Your photo should stand for itself during voting. End of story if you ask me. The challenge is to take a convincing photo -- if you haven't convinced, you should not be able to coax people into giving you a better rating.

And let's take this hypothetical situation: a single user on our site is the only user highlighted in every challenge for consistently rating ~90% of entries a 1 ... shouldn't the users whose averages he destroys have the chance to defend themselves?
03/28/2002 01:42:09 PM · #13
And maybe you should filter out those votes cast by this type person.
03/28/2002 02:35:42 PM · #14
Can't have admins deciding whose vote should count. I say if there is ever such a person, we organize the first DPC group get together and treat him/her an ass kicking. Always use violence. Always.
03/28/2002 06:19:22 PM · #15
hehe
03/28/2002 10:28:25 PM · #16
Originally posted by mikeys_bistro:
heartsdivide,

if people aren't "getting" your photo - then you have to go back and assess why that's happening, and do a better job next time - that's why it's called a "CHALLENGE" and NOT "wait let me tell you what I was really thinking" ...


This is partially correct, but the real problem is that the visual / photographic literacy of the site is still on the low side. A lot of the comments are just flat-out wrong: people with uncalibrated monitors complaining about the brightness or colors of an image, for example. I suppose it doesn't do any harm, since comments aren't visible until after the voting is completed, but some people not "getting" an image isn't necessarily a reflection on the image.


* This message has been edited by the author on 3/28/2002 10:29:09 PM.
03/29/2002 12:18:19 AM · #17
Personally, I would like to be able to reply because I got a comment from a photographer with no listed email. Thus, I CANNOT talk to him/her!

This was the comment:
mikeys_bistro - 3/25/2002
An okay photo, it's cool to look at, the low angle was a good idea, I hope it wasn't too wet down there. But I think you had 4-5 subjects in this photo, I think if you'd picked just one, it would been an excellent photo! The scene has a lot of potential.


Well, the fact that they commented and gave a suggestion is great (almost on one else did) but the fact that I'm not really sure how I could have isolated the subjects (and I don't think I should have tried to, but that's a whole other can of worms). And so I have no way of saying "Really? How? Why?" and opening a dialogue so that I can learn something.
03/29/2002 02:25:24 AM · #18
You know, during the red challenge there were a couple of comments on my picture that were completely useless in terms of constructive criticism. Basically, they were presumptuous and dismissive or cryptic. I really wanted to talk to these people and ask them about why they said what they did DURING the challenge as I read them.

By the time the challenge had passed, I'd decided I just didn't care. The impetus was gone. I don't know if it's good or bad, but that's how it plays for me. But I never did learn anything from them - well, I learned that some people are prudish and pretty much rude. *shrug*

Commenting after the fact might be the smartest idea. Or not.
03/29/2002 03:07:01 AM · #19
I'm really not trying to make any more work for you guys, but... if there was an option to individually reply to each comment on your submission as they come in I think it could have many benefits. It could be as simple as a 'Reply' link next to any comment, with your response displayed directly below once it's entered. Then show your reply on the page where the comment was made so the voter can see it, and show them all on the picture's results page when voting is over.

It would help appease the people who want a chance to immediately reply to or refute a comment, without being tempted to go to the message boards. If the photographer wanted more information from a someone without an e-mail address, they could ask for clarification immediately. Finally, it's not really practical to try and respond to multiple comments in a single reply once the voting is over, it would take a *much* more careful response than just dashing off a little thanks, rant, question, or return comment for a singe item at a time. Trying to thank, refute, and chat to many people in one big post is asking for disaster and madness. :)

That said, I really don't think that refuting a comment is going to help much with your score, people are capricious. I bet it'll be practically useless to try to redeem a photo that someone doesn't 'get', possibly more frustrating than not being able to reply at all. I see it as more of a tool for improving communication between the photgrapher and precisely the people who care enough to comment, posivtively or negatively, all collected in one location. It also saves this limited correspondence for posterity, everyone could benefit from the improved dialogue.

This is nothing crazy in the programming deparment either, it's just grunt work. :)

03/29/2002 06:26:53 AM · #20
The Mouse makes a lot of sense. If they make this change I hope they continue to suppress the artist's name. The real problem is neither one of these guys is a grunt. While they are gruntin, I wish each shot showed the ISO,fStop and shutter speed and that the thumbnails were still used after the close of the contest. The white balance setting would be nice too.


* This message has been edited by the author on 3/29/2002 6:59:27 AM.
03/29/2002 07:04:32 AM · #21
No one asked for my opinion, but here goes anyway. I think we have a pot with different skilled photographers. We have a certain few that have been doing this alot longer than others and offer their opinion on what they would like to have seen done with the photograph. I don't think that they realize that us "amatuers", really don't have any idea about what they are talking about. It would be nice to be able to contact that person. I think if someone is going to comment on a pic about how to make it better, it should be a requirement to make their email address available. That is common courtesy. How are we to learn?

As far as the jokers, the wisecrackers and the out and out rude comments made, I think ignoring and not paying attention to what they have to say is a deterrant to them continuing. I can't see getting into a fight with someone who doesn't know what this site is all about to start with. Let them stay amatuers.

And finally, for us "wannabe" photographers, who don't know the terms used or just exactly what we are supposed to be judging, except from our own perspective, say things like: "Wow, nice photo, very nice colors, I really like this"..... or How did you do that? We would very much like to know just how you did that, and if you don't have your email available, how are we ever going to learn?

I think while we are all still grouped in the one category, the ones that know more, should share their knowledge. Give up your email address so we can ask you questions. Then we wouldn't have the comment to the comment problem.
03/29/2002 11:31:40 AM · #22
Originally posted by skywalker404:
Personally, I would like to be able to reply because I got a comment from a photographer with no listed email. Thus, I CANNOT talk to him/her!

Sorry about that, I thought my email address was turned on in my preferences. It's on now. I was wondering why I wasn't getting any responses from my comments.
03/29/2002 11:57:03 AM · #23
Cinnery,
You have made some very good points! Ones that I agree with wholeheartedly! I have found that I, as a "wannabe photographer" could learn a lot from some of those that are obviously more experienced. It would be great to be able to fire off an email that asks some questions about either their submission or a comment on one of mine.

I have gone through many of the comments that others have left on the previous challenges and you are right, there are many that say things like "could have used more depth", "too much noise","this shot is flat", "this is an abstract composition", "too much flash". What does that mean???

Any way to have communication between those that know and those of us who are still learning would be great!


03/29/2002 01:39:17 PM · #24
Would another forum work? Anatomy of a Photograph forum?. Each week one of the more active "pros" selects a photo or two from the past challenge and those of us that want to can talk about what's wrong and what's right. Of course that gets to much like trying to have a class. Maybe a term of the week and an example?
03/29/2002 01:48:40 PM · #25
Mousie, do you think the feature which allows you to send email through dpchallenge to people with undisclosed email addresses will suffice, once they implement it?

Langdon, drewmedia, I think you should consider moving this one up the priority list if it isn't already somewhere near the top.

Originally posted by Mousie:
I'm really not trying to make any more work for you guys, but... if there was an option to individually reply to each comment on your submission as they come in I think it could have many benefits.


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