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DPChallenge Forums >> Photography Discussion >> What settings for shooting the Moon?
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12/23/2004 09:50:32 PM · #1
I have tried multiple time to try to take shots of the Moon with sad results. What settings do you use?

Here is my best so far:

This was taken with the metering showing WAY low. Is this what I should see?
12/23/2004 09:56:40 PM · #2
What lense please?
12/23/2004 09:57:58 PM · #3
Shoot the moon... lessee, first you get a really big slingshot, step into the pocket, have a friend hitch up a truck, pull way back, aim high... oh, you were serious ;)

Your exposure does look correct. What effective focal length were you using, and what were your shutter, aperture, and ISO settings? I assume this is cropped pretty significantly.
12/23/2004 10:01:55 PM · #4
All of my moon shots are metered WAY underexposed.

I hand hold a 300mm lens at 1/450 or faster (to ensure crisp) and an Fstop of somewhere between 6-10 depending on the phase. Usually, the less light, the better as you have to keep in mind that shooting the moon is really just shooting a mirror of the sun. It's easy to overexpose and lose a lot of detail.
12/23/2004 10:34:23 PM · #5
I believe the sunny f16 rule applies since the Moon is a sunlit object.

What this is is f16 at 1/ISO for the shutter speed. If your ISO is set to 100 this would be approximately f16 at 1/100 or equivalent exposure. This is just a starting point.
12/23/2004 11:02:37 PM · #6
Here is the EXIF data:
Tv( Shutter Speed )
1/30
Av( Aperture Value )
20
Metering Mode
Center-weighted averaging
ISO Speed
100
Lens
70.0 - 300.0mm
Focal Length
300.0mm
Image Size
3072x2048
Image Quality
RAW
Flash
Off
White Balance
Auto
AF Mode
AI Focus AF
Parameters
Contrast +1
Sharpness +1
Color saturation +1
Color tone Normal
Color Space
sRGB
File Size
4395KB
Drive Mode
Self-Timer Operation

I used a Sigma 70-300mm APO Super II
12/23/2004 11:17:44 PM · #7
Originally posted by cpanaioti:

I believe the sunny f16 rule applies since the Moon is a sunlit object.



The moon is a sunlit object, but using the sunny f16 rule will reveal actual color of the moon, which is NOT the way it looks to us at night, but a very dark grey. I would start with at least 1 stop more exposure than the sunny f16 rule would suggest.



Shot through my telescope, f6 1/125s

Message edited by author 2004-12-23 23:20:39.
12/23/2004 11:28:46 PM · #8
here is your problem

Tv( Shutter Speed ) 1/30
Av( Aperture Value ) 20

as others have mentioned, you need a faster shutter speed, at least a 1/100.

James
12/23/2004 11:31:12 PM · #9
also, you could try using aperture priority (or any creative modes except manual), and hit the * button. that will give you partial metering instead of the manual mode's center weighted (actually, pressing * in manual mode might give you partial metering too, i'm just not sure if it will.) partial meters a smaller section of the center than center weighted does.

Message edited by author 2004-12-23 23:32:17.
12/23/2004 11:36:58 PM · #10
Originally posted by jab119:

here is your problem

Tv( Shutter Speed ) 1/30
Av( Aperture Value ) 20

as others have mentioned, you need a faster shutter speed, at least a 1/100.

James


actually this combo is pretty much in the range of what spazmo99 suggests. f20 is about 1 stop less light than f16 and 1/30 is about 2 stops more light than the f16 rule suggests. that nets about 1 stop more light than the f16 rule indicates and the exposure looks good to me.
12/23/2004 11:57:33 PM · #11
Originally posted by BikeRacer:

Originally posted by jab119:

here is your problem

Tv( Shutter Speed ) 1/30
Av( Aperture Value ) 20

as others have mentioned, you need a faster shutter speed, at least a 1/100.

James


actually this combo is pretty much in the range of what spazmo99 suggests. f20 is about 1 stop less light than f16 and 1/30 is about 2 stops more light than the f16 rule suggests. that nets about 1 stop more light than the f16 rule indicates and the exposure looks good to me.


true the range is good, but if you dont have a steady tripod, or you have a slight breeze you will get camera shake and it will show up more at the long end of his lens (300mm). This is why I prefer using a faster shutter speed and a larger apeture.

shot @ 1/100 f/9 @ 1143mm through my telescope using mirror lock up.

James
12/24/2004 01:56:52 AM · #12
OK. What set up are you using to hook up with a telescope?
12/24/2004 02:21:33 AM · #13
i use the telescope too but i'm having a hard time to get fair results, the image is getting blurred. I use 1/100. since the attachment doesn't have settings because it's set to 00. any help here would be nice too.
12/24/2004 03:23:35 AM · #14
A good tripod is needed (at lest if you want to use longer tele). Trided a couple of times before i got the Manfrott 055 tripod, but then the result was always disapointing. Mirror lockup is also needed if you dont get a fast shutterspeed (if using a DSLR).

This image is with 10D, Sigma 70-300 DL Super Macro and Tamron 2x TC. Exif below, but focallengt becomes 600mm and f/16 with the TC.

Moon image

And, yes the metering shows a lot of underexposure, if I expse to the meter i get a overexposed blob instead of the moon...

Model: Canon EOS 10D
Exposure time [s]: 1/8
Exposure program: Manual
F-Number: F8,0
Focal length [mm]: 300
ISO value: 100
Shutter speed [s]: 1/8
Flash: Not fired
Metering mode: Center weighted average
12/24/2004 05:09:47 AM · #15
The sunny 16 rule has a relative - worked pretty well for me last night:

Moony 11, 8, and 5.6 rules There are many different rules that work well when shooting the moon. One favorite for a proper exposure of a full moon is f/11 at one over the ISO setting. For pictures of a half moon, use the same shutter speed at f/8, and for a quarter moon, use the same shutter speed at f/5.6.

Just got this from a friend yesterday. It's part of a collection of 12 rules, facts and formulas that can be found here:
//popphoto.com/article.asp?section_id=4&article_id=1175&page_number=1

Have fun with the upcoming full moon.

Cheers,
Bruno
12/24/2004 08:27:56 AM · #16
To answer your question accurately may require more information concerning the phase of the moon, exposure and metering type, and ASA / ISO setting? Here is what I mean.



For example, my cameras have a variety of light meter settings - matrix, average and spot. The metering results varied wildly with each setting based upon the same framing of subject - the moon.

I found the spot setting to produce the best results, and if you think about it, it does make sense. Matrix and average meter settings accommodate readings from a much greater surface area of the viewfinder than the spot meter reading. So, they try to reconcile the vast black night sky portion of the image in combination with the intensely lit portion of the moon. This contrast in light intensity can fool even a quality light meter, let alone one that is built-in to a standard DSLR.

Normally, a matrix meter utilizes stored references of lighting conditions that the manufacturer programmed into the camera. There may not be a reference model that is perfect of this scenario? So, the camera must use the next closest reference model, which may not be perfect.

A matrix or an averaging meter will likely take reading information from a large array of sensors strategically positioned within the viewfinder. The CPU within your camera applies a weight to each sensor reading and then computes the best overall settings. If you frame your moon shot to be off-centre, then I feel that it is easy to confuse these sensors with this bright object not located within the centre of the "weighted" frame.



I also have had to compensate for the different phases of the moon, but not as much as you might think. Just small increments really.

In my case, there has been a great deal of trial and error, which is one of the great joys of a digital camera, you can easily bracket exposures, see instant results, and then keep or delete as you deem fit.

My longest lens has a fixed aperture of f11, so I can only change the shutter speed. I use the manual mode instead of automatic, which is recommended. I can vary the ISO setting, but use the lowest ISO setting available in your camera is best - 100 to 200.



It has been my experience that I can greatly enhance an image that at first glance appears to be poor by making Photoshop adjustments for brightness and contrast. I have also found that by playing with the colouration of the moon, I can sometimes reveal more detail and surface terrain and still maintain an aesthetically pleasing image. The colouration may not be realistic, but I still find the results pleasing and appreciate the enhanced details revealed on the moon's surface. Let's just call it artistic license?



My typical exposure is about 1/125th of a second. Exposures can range from as long as 1/30th of a second to as short as 1/250th of a second. The ISO is set at 125, 200, or rarely at 400, never higher as noise will result. Remember, my f-stop is fixed due to my catadioptric (mirror) lens design to f11. My Nikkor catadioptric lens focal length is 1,000mm, which I coupled with a Nikkor x2 adaptor for a 2,000mm prime focal length. My Nikon camera's sensor CCD adds x1.5 for an effective total focal length of 3,000mm.



If your camera offers the histogram feature, then use this display when you are shooting. It is a great aid to achieve proper exposure. But, I found that it requires a good, sturdy tripod to raise your camera and lens high enough to permit easy viewing of the camera's back-mounted LCD display without the support of a chiropractic correction the next day (It's an age thing!). It is also available in Photoshop (CS shown) that will be useful in post-production adjustments.

So, give it another try. Play around a bit and use the trial and error method to learn what are the best settings for your equipment. Last night, the near full moon brilliantly illuminated my entire snow-covered backyard; it even cast shadows. It was an eerie and very cool looking scene. So, I suspect that this may be a good time to "shoot the moon", that is if you can tolerate the winter weather, which is rather challenging here in Toronto right now.

I hope that this helps? Merry Christmas and best wishes for the holiday season. Michael

Message edited by author 2004-12-24 08:47:05.
12/24/2004 09:28:42 AM · #17
//home.hiwaay.net/~krcool/Astro/moon/howtophoto/ This site has some good info on this subject.
12/24/2004 09:48:08 AM · #18
Originally posted by fsteddy:

//home.hiwaay.net/~krcool/Astro/moon/howtophoto/ This site has some good info on this subject.

thanks for a helpful link.
I did a few of the moon around the eclipse a few weeks ago. Didn't get any good of the eclipse itself (as it became cloudy around that time) but some OK as I was testing out the apparatus before.

on second thoughts, I prolly have to fix the colour cast on these two.
12/24/2004 09:49:40 AM · #19
Originally posted by Discraft:

i use the telescope too but i'm having a hard time to get fair results, the image is getting blurred. I use 1/100. since the attachment doesn't have settings because it's set to 00. any help here would be nice too.


are you sure you have good focus with the telescope? If the focus is off just a little bit your image wont come out clear, but it will look nice and clear in the view finder.

You will use the f ratio of your telescope, mine is f/9. On my old telecope I used a Hartman Mask, its easy to make yourself.

I have not made one for my new scope yet, so i just connected my camera to the PC and would snap a pic, check it out on the PC and adjust focus as needed until i got the desired results.

Also does your scope have an auto tracking mount? or do you have to manually move your scope? if you do not have auto tracking this could be a problem at the higher folcal lenths of the telescope and you are getting moon movement in your image, unless you use a faster shutter speed.

James
12/24/2004 09:55:55 AM · #20
Originally posted by jab119:

...You will use the f ratio of your telescope, mine is f/9. On my old telecope I used a Hartman Mask, its easy to make yourself....

I've been trying to make Hartman Masks now for awhile, but I find it hard to find any good info on their construction on the internet. You'll find a lot of info about particular scopes but no general info. I've made 2-3 and they work, but I'm trying to find the optimal mask. What is the theory behind this? How many holes should there be, where, and how large?
I have a Leica APO-Televid 77 spotting scope and the relevant photoadapter (800mm F/10.4).
12/24/2004 10:59:27 AM · #21
Hey all...

I am looking for some SUPERB high detail shots of the moon for an album cover I am doing. I am particularly interested in any good shots of a lunar eclipse.

I am willing to pay $$$, not a lot just a token, as I'm not really making anything on this. But I will include the photographer's name on the credits.

Please PM or email me at: Saj@easternstorm.net

12/24/2004 11:08:56 AM · #22
Originally posted by jab119:



You will use the f ratio of your telescope, mine is f/9. On my old telecope I used a Hartman Mask, its easy to make yourself.

James


I am having a hard time getting good focus, even with a mask. I have a Celestron C5 (5" SCT). Before I got the Rebel, I used a Canon A70, and I got much better results. The camera autofocus worked well using eyepiece projection. See pictures with the A70/C5 here:

//www.picsbypurser.com/astro/astro.html

I am thinking of getting one of these:

Canon Angle Finder C

Chad
12/24/2004 02:03:51 PM · #23
Originally posted by cpurser:

Originally posted by jab119:



You will use the f ratio of your telescope, mine is f/9. On my old telecope I used a Hartman Mask, its easy to make yourself.

James


I am having a hard time getting good focus, even with a mask. I have a Celestron C5 (5" SCT). Before I got the Rebel, I used a Canon A70, and I got much better results. The camera autofocus worked well using eyepiece projection. See pictures with the A70/C5 here:

//www.picsbypurser.com/astro/astro.html

I am thinking of getting one of these:

Canon Angle Finder C

Chad


ok I know the C5 is a great scope, I had great results with my LX90 (SCT) and my Sony 707, but only fair results with my D60 and my LX90. Now that I have a refractor the images do seem much nicer.

Does the C5 suffer from mirror flop? This is one reason i went to a refractor, as most SCT's have mirror flop. this is where the primary mirror moves after it is focused, not a big deal for visual at all, but photographically it can cause problems. One solution is to back focus a little so when you are brining the scope into focus you are pushing the mirror towards the front of the scope, this helps to keep the mirror in place for photography so it does not slide towards the bottom of the OTA. I know many people have had excelent results from an SCT, and im NOT saying SCT's are bad, you just have to know their little quirks

I have the angle C finder and you have to spend some time getting the angle c finder focused correctly. And once you have the anle c finder focused you should lock it in place with some masking tape.

here is how to do it
angle c finder

also shop around for it as some places want almost $200 for it.

James

Message edited by author 2004-12-24 14:06:43.
12/24/2004 03:22:59 PM · #24


Used my 1200mm lens. No flash (duh). 1/200 sec exposure. Manual focus on a tripod w/ remote fire cable. Was taken inside my house out a closed window on a very clear night. Probably could have been a bit better done outside on my deck.

Actually, the original shows even more detail. The resizing down to 640 got rid of some additional detail.
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