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11/17/2004 02:43:54 PM · #26 |
Originally posted by mk:
You said you voted on all the photos which means you voted a 1 or 2 on around 700+ shots. That's the problem. |
Of 700+ images that I voted on, I gave out plenty of 5s, 6s, 7s, 8s, 9s and even a few 10s. And, yes, a bunch of 1s and 2s. But... the shots I gave 1s and 2s to got a hell of a lot of 1s and 2s from other users and members.
xian |
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11/17/2004 02:48:26 PM · #27 |
I didn't give out 1's to very many photos, but alas, my votes for most of the shots have mysteriously disappeared. A phenomenon yet to be explained. I usually vote in the 4-8 range.
Not that it matters since the votes I cast are my own! Mine I tell you! Now give 'em 'ere!
j/k |
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11/17/2004 02:49:07 PM · #28 |
xian-I did read through all your comments, and I don't think they are harsh, straitforward, yes, but not really harsh.
The pattern I saw, is that you mentioned cliche, or there are too many of these types in this challenge. I am not saying this is what's happening, but you many be voting them lower because there are a bunch of them or because they are cliche'.
This is basically a site for learning, and of course there are going to be repeated themes over and over and over (just like the freakin cats! (C:). Someone comes up with something "new," a million bucks that there are going to be a ton of them in the next challenge. That's how it goes. Only learn by trying. |
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11/17/2004 02:50:39 PM · #29 |
Originally posted by xian:
No, I was never "told" by anyone that my votes were being tossed out.xian |
Originally posted by EddyG:
"Do my votes count?"
the simple answer is "not if you vote a lot of 1's and 2's". |
The earliest post I could find about votes getting thrown out:
//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.php?action=read&FORUM_THREAD_ID=1226&highlight=voting%20patterns
Clubjuggle:
At the end of voting, a program is run that looks at the voting patterns of each user. If a voter''s pattern suggests they were trying to disrupt the voting process rather that provide honest opinions, their votes are ignored. This is based strictly on predefined patterns. For example, if a user were to score one photo a 10 and all the rest ones, those votes would be ignored.
There, you've been told.
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11/17/2004 02:50:48 PM · #30 |
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11/17/2004 02:51:39 PM · #31 |
If xian doesn't like repetitive shots he should have the write to vote down a shot for its lack of imagination. Nothin' wrong with that.
It's interesting how the governing body which is DPC is reflective of a typical democratic society. Meaning, it's usually not very democratic at all :-)
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11/17/2004 02:53:24 PM · #32 |
As someone else who as also seen some of his votes tossed out (and also think there are many out-of-focus, poorly composed shots in open challenges) it strikes me as though the site creators and admins want everything to be judged on a nice and happy bell-curve.
But guess what? Life doesn't judge on a bell-curve. When I rate photos, personally - I'm trying to use a mindset of what I think a stock photo agency like Getty Images might say when they see such a photo -- because I believe that only by being honest ... even if it's painful ... can anyone improve. Sitting around and throwing around 6's and 7's for bad photographs - and I see plenty of that based on the comments people leave - doesn't do anyone any good at all.
But, let's not talk about what makes a 6 or a 7 .... let's take a look at a very specific case where one of my 1's was tossed ... the "Macro of a Plane" photo in the most recent challenge -- //www.dpchallenge.com/image.php?IMAGE_ID=119647
I voted this one a 1. Or a 2. I can't remember. But my vote was tossed out since I have no "red" indicator of which vote was mine. Yet, 85 other people (at least) also felt that this photo was a 1. Was I "overly harsh" on this photo. Nope. So, clearly the "vote screening" system leaves a lot to be desired if it can't detect that my vote - in this instance - was right on the money.
If the screening system can't detect that, then it's rather poorly implemented in my opinion, and clearly seems to be designed to create nice happy bell curves for everyone.
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11/17/2004 02:56:22 PM · #33 |
Dtoombs - did you vote on at least 20%? Your votes would be thrown out for voting on 19%.
M
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11/17/2004 02:59:49 PM · #34 |
| Hi. I'm math challenged so could someone answer a simple question about the thrown out votes. xian said he voted on 2 challenges yet he has 33 votes counted. If his votes got thrown out on macro w/o, that would leave 225 pictures for him to vote on in the other challenge. He would have had to vote 20%. SO here's the question. Since when is 33 20% of 225? My math says that he would have to have 45 as the number of his votes counted. Even if there were some dq's, there wouldn't have been 12 in one challenge would there? |
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11/17/2004 03:00:11 PM · #35 |
Just confirming that your votes were marked as suspect. Out of your 802 votes, 80% of them were 1, 2, or 3. You've never given a 10.
I can't argue with some of you examples you've given, but one or two of them were pretty decent.. and some elements from most of the photos were actually pretty good. I can't imagine how you can just reduce a photograph to a 1 because 1 element is poor. We're not trying to tell you how to vote, we're just trying to keep vote tampering to a minimum. Maybe you can adjust your voting scale a bit higher so everything evens out.
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11/17/2004 03:01:02 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by dtoombs:
So, clearly the "vote screening" system leaves a lot to be desired . |
The point is, there should be no vote screening at all. The people who think they can vote everyone down to make their shot rate higher get filtered out naturally in this type of system.
xian |
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11/17/2004 03:02:33 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by pcody:
Hi. I'm math challenged so could someone answer a simple question about the thrown out votes. xian said he voted on 2 challenges yet he has 33 votes counted. If his votes got thrown out on macro w/o, that would leave 225 pictures for him to vote on in the other challenge. He would have had to vote 20%. SO here's the question. Since when is 33 20% of 225? My math says that he would have to have 45 as the number of his votes counted. Even if there were some dq's, there wouldn't have been 12 in one challenge would there? |
I suspect he voted on an earlier challenge. Perhaps team sports, where the overall participation was much lower.
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11/17/2004 03:03:30 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by pcody:
Hi. I'm math challenged so could someone answer a simple question about the thrown out votes. xian said he voted on 2 challenges yet he has 33 votes counted. If his votes got thrown out on macro w/o, that would leave 225 pictures for him to vote on in the other challenge. He would have had to vote 20%. SO here's the question. Since when is 33 20% of 225? My math says that he would have to have 45 as the number of his votes counted. Even if there were some dq's, there wouldn't have been 12 in one challenge would there? |
Sorry, I should clarify that I voted on at least 20% of a previous challenge.
xian |
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11/17/2004 03:03:49 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by xian:
Originally posted by dtoombs:
So, clearly the "vote screening" system leaves a lot to be desired . |
The point is, there should be no vote screening at all. The people who think they can vote everyone down to make their shot rate higher get filtered out naturally in this type of system.
xian |
yes there should be a screen because someone could log onto 10 different computers as guests and vote everyone else down and give themself a 10
Message edited by author 2004-11-17 15:04:20. |
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11/17/2004 03:04:50 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by langdon:
I can't imagine how you can just reduce a photograph to a 1 because 1 element is poor. We're not trying to tell you how to vote, we're just trying to keep vote tampering to a minimum. Maybe you can adjust your voting scale a bit higher so everything evens out. |
You just did tell me how to vote...
xian |
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11/17/2004 03:04:58 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by xian:
Originally posted by dtoombs:
So, clearly the "vote screening" system leaves a lot to be desired . |
The point is, there should be no vote screening at all. The people who think they can vote everyone down to make their shot rate higher get filtered out naturally in this type of system.
xian |
If there were no vote screening, you could get a large list of friends to join or people off other places or get togethers (DPCFanatics would come to mind) and tell each other whos photo is whos and vote 10's on them and 1 on everything else.
That is why it is there!
I think Langdon SUGGESTED something for you , so that your votes WILL count. You have to change something, cuz we already know the outcome
WOW!!!! 80% of all photos below a 3. Now we know.
Message edited by author 2004-11-17 15:06:42. |
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11/17/2004 03:05:21 PM · #42 |
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11/17/2004 03:06:14 PM · #43 |
Originally posted by mavrik:
Dtoombs - did you vote on at least 20%? Your votes would be thrown out for voting on 19%.
M |
Yes, on the two challenges I voted in - Bizarre Nature, and Macro without Bugs or Flowers - I made sure that I voted on exactly 20% of the photos (enough so that the indicator that I hadn't voted on enough went away).
I don't know if some of those photos got DQ'd -- and then my votes with them -- thus putting me under 20% ..... making the rest of my votes not count. That would be another significant flaw with the scoring system, if it were to be true (I have no idea one way or the other).
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11/17/2004 03:15:22 PM · #44 |
Hi xian...I'm mostly going to be on your side here. You did not actively 'vote tamper' yet your votes were thrown out.
That sucks, even if most people disagree with your voting structure. I think I disagree with most people's voting structure here as well...
Also, I have no problem with your comments. Sure, I've seen much more helpful comments, but at least you're making your opinion known.
So, here's the solution so your votes don't get thrown out:
Vote on all types of photos, not just the ones that you think are no good...that way 80% of your votes won't be on crappy photos.
I hope this helps...and hopefully you don't get turned off by the occasional mob mentality in these forums.
:0)
Message edited by author 2004-11-17 15:16:26.
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11/17/2004 03:15:46 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by xian:
You just did tell me how to vote.., |
I don't see it that way at all. He was simply suggesting how to avoid having your votes discarded. Re-think your use of the low-end of the voting scale.
To me, a '1' should be reserved for somebody who submits a picture of the lens cap. i.e. absolutely no thought or skill involved whatsoever; a mouse could be trained to do that. And note that it is OK to use the low-end of the scale for pictures that you consider really bad. But to lump 40-50% of the challenge entries into a '1' bucket is unreasonable. There is something about almost every picture that makes it deserve higher than a '1' (and I'm sure most people on this site would agree with me).
dtoombs: your votes are still counted even if a DQ causes your votes to fall below the 20% floor. The only way they would be removed is if they were "scrubbed" because of voting too many with excessively low scores. |
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11/17/2004 03:19:33 PM · #46 |
for everyone who votes here is a simple thing to think about -
if you dont give out 10s you shouldnt give out 1s either.
also, 5 is in the middle...
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11/17/2004 03:19:59 PM · #47 |
Originally posted by EddyG:
Originally posted by xian:
You just did tell me how to vote.., |
I don't see it that way at all. He was simply suggesting how to avoid having your votes discarded. Re-think your use of the low-end of the voting scale. |
Ok, here's an analogy: Im not telling you who to vote for in the next presidential election, I'm just "suggesting" that you vote for candidate X so your vote is counted.
yeah, ok.
I'm done.
xian |
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11/17/2004 03:23:27 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by xian:
I'm done |
doubtful |
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11/17/2004 03:23:50 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by hopper:
Originally posted by xian:
I'm done |
doubtful |
gracious
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11/17/2004 03:25:02 PM · #50 |
Thats a horrible analogy imo.
Originally posted by xian:
Originally posted by EddyG:
Originally posted by xian:
You just did tell me how to vote.., |
I don't see it that way at all. He was simply suggesting how to avoid having your votes discarded. Re-think your use of the low-end of the voting scale. |
Ok, here's an analogy: Im not telling you who to vote for in the next presidential election, I'm just "suggesting" that you vote for candidate X so your vote is counted.
yeah, ok.
I'm done.
xian |
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