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02/18/2003 02:46:00 AM · #1 |
| Ok, there are only 40 shots of flowers in this challenge, I would have thought people would have gotten it out of their system in the cliche challenge. Approximately 1 in 6 submissions are of flowers! A distant second is lemons (12, I think), and some of the lemon shots were good, IMO. Only one school bus, though, and I remember someone predicting a whole fleet of buses in this challenge. |
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02/18/2003 03:49:36 AM · #2 |
| I agree. i'd give people a little leeway on the lemons but the cliche contest (that specifically mentioned flowers) was just over 2 weeks ago. For me, the worst thing you can do content-wise is cliche. I automatically take anything down at least a point or two if i see a cliche, regardless of technical skill. Maybe I won't do that if they use a particularly stunning method, but that rarely happens. |
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02/18/2003 07:49:23 AM · #3 |
| I have decided to vote all non-cliche pictures down a point or two. |
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02/18/2003 07:54:14 AM · #4 |
Mine is not cliche but I have aboslutely no problem with cliche shots if they are done properly. I prefer a well shot cliche over a tecnhically weak "oh so original, and so deep in meaning, and so out of the box" (which it turns out most to the time to be only in the eye of the creator of the photograph) shot any day.
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02/18/2003 08:25:36 AM · #5 |
I'm with Jacko on this! I don't see how you can say that an image that isn't 'original' even if technically perfect is worthy of point deduction because it has been done before! What I'm taking from this thread is that since there were almost 250 photo's, we needed 250 original yellow ideas? Absurbed! It's all been done before!
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02/18/2003 08:28:32 AM · #6 |
Instead of deducting points for what YOU consider a cliche, why not ADD points to those you think are NOT cliche?
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02/18/2003 08:55:05 AM · #7 |
Originally posted by Jak:
Instead of deducting points for what YOU consider a cliche, why not ADD points to those you think are NOT cliche? |
This is pretty much what I do... and why my average score given is around 7. I rate all photos fairly objectively based on their technical merit, but I always give meaningful or original photos a little boost. This is why the photo that came 3rd in Perspective got a 10 from me, but so did the one that came 80th. The one that came 3rd was technically spot on, and a good idea if not amazingly original (there were a large number of tree shots but this one had the added interest of the buildings... still not much to make it unique). The one that came 80th was, to me, technically well done... it used shallow DOF to good effect, I thought. But its rakish composition and the feelings it gave me of childhood memories long gone made me give it those extra couple of points. |
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02/18/2003 10:05:56 AM · #8 |
I agree with Jacko. If done properly, a cliche is worthy of a just vote, and why not if it's meeting the challenge?
I've seen well taken pictures, both cliches and original, but that have no relation to the challenge. One example is a beautiful B&W portrait of a kid on the Waldo challenge.
And I also agree with Jak. A well done picture, that meets the challenge and that it's original, can have extra points. Instead of the other way around (well done, meets challenge, cliche).
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02/18/2003 10:54:39 AM · #9 |
I have a perfect photo, not interesting though and is doing ok, but I am thinking I should have shot a flower now. I voted some of the flowers pretty high. I am not docking their score just because it is a flower. That is childish and uncalled for. It IS yellow, right? Did the rules say NO flowers? No it didn't, then judge it for the picture. :-)
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02/18/2003 11:16:43 AM · #10 |
| the challenge was yellow! what exactly did you expect from amateur photographers or any type of photographers for that matter. get over it and take each picture at its face value. |
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02/18/2003 11:26:33 AM · #11 |
| I didn't do a flower in the cliche challenge, but I was inspired by some of the beautiful flower shots. If it fits the challenge (it is yellow btw, not originality) then move on to bigger and better criteria. Automatically deducting points for a cliche subject just seems rather absurd to me. The whole point of the cliche challenge wasn't to get it out of our system. IMO, it was to appreciate just how hard it is to take a good photo of a cliche subject. Lighting, focus, composition - those things don't get easier just because it's a cliche subject. |
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02/18/2003 11:31:48 AM · #12 |
| I don't think it'll hurt anything to admit that I'm the owner of one of the cliche shots in the yellow challenge. I debated submitting it because of just this kind of sentiment. In fact, I sometimes fall prey to this "anti-cliche" thinking myself. But I don't know if conciously deducting points for cliche is the way to go. I think the vast potential for cliche shots to suffer in relation to other, superior shots of the same subject is "punishment" enough. |
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02/18/2003 02:00:51 PM · #13 |
One of the things I think that needs to be remembered is that many of the people on this site are new both to DPC and to photography itself. While a shot may seem cliche to someone with more experience it may not be cliche to a newbie. For example, my Rose shot in the cliche challenge is the first time in my life I've ever shot a still life flower photo. The experience was new, the problems new, the lessons learned were all new and therefore appreciated as the learning experience that I believe Drew and Langdon intended in the challenge. To those of you who have "Been there, done that. . ." please let the rest of us "Go there and try it. . .".
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02/18/2003 03:05:19 PM · #14 |
| My submission probably wouldn't be considered cliche' but I must defend them. Soooooooo what if there are 80 flowers or kids, or pets....so what!!! It's condescending to think they are somehow inferior, or mundane. C'mon, we're all at different levels. Lighten up! |
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02/18/2003 03:27:34 PM · #15 |
I think the point of the cliche challenge was to show people that "cliche" subjects could be done well. No where in the site guidelines does it say to dock points for subject matter.
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02/18/2003 05:43:58 PM · #16 |
How do the "site guidelines" determine how we should or should not vote? Any voting is a personal matter, and if I have different criteria for voting than you, it doesn't make one of us "wrong".
Message edited by author 2003-02-18 17:59:13. |
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02/18/2003 06:12:18 PM · #17 |
| Everyone is free to vote how they wish, and originality is certainly a valid factor in determining how to rate a photo. While an automatic "flower deduction" might not be appropriate, a lack of originality even on a wonderfully executed shot is definately a valid reason to give a lower score. |
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02/18/2003 06:26:42 PM · #18 |
Originally posted by Seeker:
To those of you who have "Been there, done that. . ." please let the rest of us "Go there and try it. . .". |
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02/18/2003 07:56:18 PM · #19 |
As always there's more than a couple of cats. Dog owners may be scum around here but at least we don't shoehorn our pets into *every* challenge! ; )
Seriously though - flowers are beautiful subjects to photograph, and lots of flowers are yellow. Are you really surprised they feature so prominently? I've just finished voting rhythm so I'm looking forward to seeing the good flower shots.
I'm also looking forward to getting my bonus 'originality' points : ) |
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02/18/2003 08:08:12 PM · #20 |
cliche cliche.
after seeing photos everyday, every week, don't they all become cliche?
who cares?
did the person photo it well?
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02/18/2003 08:30:26 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by KarenB:
cliche cliche.
after seeing photos everyday, every week, don't they all become cliche?
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No. Every week there are a small number of photos that use completely unexpected or unpredictable subjects or highly unique approaches to their subjects. These photos are not cliche. While I have no intention of diminishing the value of those who create beautiful photographs of flowers, sunsets, animals, or other commonly used subjects, I see these unique subjects or unique approaches as exponentially more valueable.
Photography isn't purely a technical endeavor. Selecting a good subject is vital to creating a good photograph. And originality or uniqueness does have an effect on how good a subject is, therefore it effects how good a photo is.
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02/19/2003 06:56:16 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by Seeker:
To those of you who have "Been there, done that. . ." please let the rest of us "Go there and try it. . .". |
WooHoo!! Well said! |
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02/19/2003 09:13:11 AM · #23 |
Originally posted by wingy:
Originally posted by KarenB:
cliche cliche.
after seeing photos everyday, every week, don't they all become cliche?
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No. Every week there are a small number of photos that use completely unexpected or unpredictable subjects or highly unique approaches to their subjects. These photos are not cliche. While I have no intention of diminishing the value of those who create beautiful photographs of flowers, sunsets, animals, or other commonly used subjects, I see these unique subjects or unique approaches as exponentially more valueable.
Photography isn't purely a technical endeavor. Selecting a good subject is vital to creating a good photograph. And originality or uniqueness does have an effect on how good a subject is, therefore it effects how good a photo is. |
Sorry. I was not in a good mood yesterday, and did not express myself properly.
All I meant was I think after seeing a variety of photos on this site and other sites every week, just about any subject matter can become cliche merely because we are exposed to more because the internet covers the world.
While I agree with you about looking for originality, people make their life work out of child portraits, pet portraits, flower photography, etc. So, some here may be trying to hone their skills. Also, in one week's time, it is not always possible to make that dream trip to see the dali llama and photograph him in the perfect setting, or chase that tornado for the perfect shot. ;0)
Jokes aside, I think Seeker also said it very well:
Originally posted by Seeker:
To those of you who have "Been there, done that. . ." please let the rest of us "Go there and try it. . .". |
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