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03/13/2019 02:37:32 AM · #1
My entry in Headshot from Behind finished 13th (on 13th!). I really don't care that it finished low I am just very curious what were the reasons for 18 voters of 40 to rate it below average?
The image:
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Maybe déjà vue? PP was bad? Bad composition? Einstein is dead so hence it is not him? Boring subject? DNMC because you could see the face in the mirror? An image of an image because you cannot see me in the mirror? Suspected digital manipulation?

I am not defending and won't defend the image, and I might enter a similar image in the future knowing in advance that it won't do well with the voters but next time I will know why.
03/13/2019 02:59:49 AM · #2
OK, just noticed that my top scorer for this challenge finished even lower:
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Very clever and creative, very well executed. Why so many low votes?
03/13/2019 03:03:24 AM · #3
in my opinion in this case the head from behind isn't the principal subject. Good photo for other titles ( for example: a mirror vision :) ) but here is too forced as a "headshot from behind"
IMO
03/13/2019 03:19:26 AM · #4
OMG. I just wrote a well thought out answer and did something stupid that refreshed my screen before sending. Lost it all. Here's a feeble attempt to rewrite...

I think it's all relative. Yes, I said it... "relative." And I'm not the least bit sorry... well maybe a little sorry.

Despite the expected level of technical and compositional excellence you bring to the game, I gave this a five... for three reasons: The front of the head and the back of the head, and what I consider to be a borderline issue of DNMC.

The front of the head is sharp and placed at a powerful compositional intersection of the rule of thirds. It's location, focus, and exposure immediately draws my eyes. Then there's the back of the head which is covers and appropriately (for the challenge) large portion of the lower right quadrant of your frame. But (despite its equally powerful compositional placement) its darker, lower contrast and soft focus push my eyes right back to the full face portrait above it and that's where I get stuck.

Then I review the challenge rules and read the phrase "Show us the back of somebody's head. [...] nothing but the back [...]" and I'm nudged over the subjective line of DNMC. I understand that this image succeeds in allowing me to see "front" "back" and "reflection" of the head. It just succeeds too much at minimizing the "back."

There you have it. And, BTW, even had the issue of DNMC not been a factor, I don't think the score would have been much better for me. My primary objection is the amount of area given to the OOF subject "back of the head" that to me is the least interesting part of an otherwise wonderful tableau.

And don't forget. Scoring is relative... Oops, I did it again.
03/13/2019 03:33:44 AM · #5
OK, thanks. I understand that it was DNMC factor after all, what about the other image?
03/13/2019 04:15:49 AM · #6
Originally posted by wbanning:


There you have it. And, BTW, even had the issue of DNMC not been a factor, I don't think the score would have been much better for me. My primary objection is the amount of area given to the OOF subject "back of the head" that to me is the least interesting part of an otherwise wonderful tableau.
I just re-read it, yes, it was difficult to give this challenge topic justice by producing an interesting image and meet the challenge! :)
03/13/2019 05:13:31 AM · #7
Originally posted by marnet:

OK, just noticed that my top scorer for this challenge finished even lower:
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/2000-2999/2809/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1233583.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/2000-2999/2809/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1233583.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

Very clever and creative, very well executed. Why so many low votes?


Thanks Margaret (and Marion),
Looking at the top scorers my guess is had we cropped in and focused more on the back of the head we would have scored higher!

Message edited by author 2019-03-13 05:20:22.
03/13/2019 05:17:04 AM · #8
Originally posted by marnet:

OK, thanks. I understand that it was DNMC factor....

Not a very DNMC, if you had focused on the neck the result would have been different. Imagine Albert Einstein's face defocused, for me it would have worked better
03/13/2019 06:54:49 AM · #9
Originally posted by GolferDDS:

Originally posted by marnet:

OK, just noticed that my top scorer for this challenge finished even lower:
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/2000-2999/2809/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1233583.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/2000-2999/2809/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1233583.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

Very clever and creative, very well executed. Why so many low votes?


Thanks Margaret (and Marion),
Looking at the top scorers my guess is had we cropped in and focused more on the back of the head we would have scored higher!

Well, there are at least 3 images that showed more than the back of the head in TT so there are some other factors at play.
03/13/2019 07:36:48 AM · #10
Originally posted by marnet:

Originally posted by GolferDDS:

Originally posted by marnet:

OK, just noticed that my top scorer for this challenge finished even lower:
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/2000-2999/2809/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1233583.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/2000-2999/2809/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1233583.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

Very clever and creative, very well executed. Why so many low votes?


Thanks Margaret (and Marion),
Looking at the top scorers my guess is had we cropped in and focused more on the back of the head we would have scored higher!

Well, there are at least 3 images that showed more than the back of the head in TT so there are some other factors at play.


Always!
03/13/2019 11:43:55 AM · #11
Challenge: Headshot from Behind
Description: Show us the back of somebody's head. No profile, nothing but the back, the view you'd see if walking or standing behind them.

************************

"Headshot" has a specific meaning in the photography world. Every model has headshots in their portfolio, in addition to other sorts of shots. "Nothing but the back" means just that: no face, no profile.

IMO, both images being discussed here are DNMC, despite that both show the backs of heads and are otherwise very well done. I gave them both a 5 for this reason. Also, for what it's worth, I think the Blue Ribbon, lovely though it may be, is not a head shot either, and it got a 5 from me as well.
03/13/2019 12:12:19 PM · #12
We have right brain and left brain voters at work. The (forgive me) nitpickers pay attention to the rules and flaws and whatever else they focus on. The more visual voters respond to the creativity, the impact and the artistry. At least that is the way I see it..and the way I vote.

I did not vote in this challenge but if I had: Einstein #1 Golfer DDS "2 ...both impactful and interesting photographs (imho).
03/13/2019 12:34:59 PM · #13
Always someone to complain.
It's a challenge. In general, you get scored on how you met the challenge, and produced a likeable photo. It's in the name:dpCHALLENGE.

Sorry I'm a bit of a black and white guy.
03/13/2019 12:36:56 PM · #14
I didn't vote but I'll answer your questions hypothetically...

Maybe déjà vue? Yes

PP was bad? No.

Bad composition? No.

Einstein is dead so hence it is not him? No.

Boring subject? No.

DNMC because you could see the face in the mirror? No (but this was probably a big reason for others)

An image of an image because you cannot see me in the mirror? No.

Suspected digital manipulation? No.

You left out my biggest reason. You took a photo of a museum display, so somebody else did most of the work. It's the same way I feel about photos of paintings and sculptures.
03/13/2019 12:46:50 PM · #15
Originally posted by posthumous:

You left out my biggest reason. You took a photo of a museum display, so somebody else did most of the work.

Isn't that true of anything you don't make in your own studio or kitchen? I haven't built any bridges or skyscrapers or planted any mature trees lately ...
03/13/2019 12:52:31 PM · #16
Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Challenge: Headshot from Behind
Description: Show us the back of somebody's head. No profile, nothing but the back, the view you'd see if walking or standing behind them.

************************

"Headshot" has a specific meaning in the photography world. Every model has headshots in their portfolio, in addition to other sorts of shots. "Nothing but the back" means just that: no face, no profile.

IMO, both images being discussed here are DNMC, despite that both show the backs of heads and are otherwise very well done. I gave them both a 5 for this reason. Also, for what it's worth, I think the Blue Ribbon, lovely though it may be, is not a head shot either, and it got a 5 from me as well.


Funny, I read the description this way : “Show us the back of somebody’s head. No profile. Nothing but the back, the view you’d see if walking or standing behind them..” And I took THEM to mean there could be more than one head.
So I voted the blue ribbon well. And the others of just a closeup of a head from the back on how interesting they felt to me.
The shot from Charlie’s World did not get a high mark from me because it’s a picture of someone else’s exhibit with nothing added to make it the photographer’s “own” and I knew it because we’ve seen it before.
03/13/2019 01:13:21 PM · #17
So should I toss my annual pass to Chaplin's World into the bin? ;)
No, it is a great museum :)
03/13/2019 01:22:33 PM · #18
Originally posted by marnet:

So should I toss my annual pass to Chaplin's World into the bin? ;)
No, it is a great museum :)

I'll have to see what you've shot -- my mom knew Charlie Chaplin when he was living in Los Angeles.
03/13/2019 01:40:15 PM · #19
Originally posted by marnet:

So should I toss my annual pass to Chaplin's World into the bin? ;)
No, it is a great museum :)


Of course not!
03/13/2019 01:57:24 PM · #20
Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by posthumous:

You left out my biggest reason. You took a photo of a museum display, so somebody else did most of the work.

Isn't that true of anything you don't make in your own studio or kitchen? I haven't built any bridges or skyscrapers or planted any mature trees lately ...


I agree with this. If we had to make our own Textiles for the Textiles Challenge, it would really have been awful to view. At least mine would have been. Ha!

03/13/2019 01:59:42 PM · #21
Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by posthumous:

You left out my biggest reason. You took a photo of a museum display, so somebody else did most of the work.

Isn't that true of anything you don't make in your own studio or kitchen? I haven't built any bridges or skyscrapers or planted any mature trees lately ...


a bridge was built to get cars over a river. a museum exhibit was built to be looked at.

imagine if you will a bridge museum, containing an exhibit that provides a great viewing angle to a model bridge, with marvelous raking light set up by the museum director and staff.

Is there really no difference between taking a picture of a bridge and a picture of that exhibit?
03/13/2019 02:02:53 PM · #22
Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by marnet:

So should I toss my annual pass to Chaplin's World into the bin? ;)
No, it is a great museum :)

I'll have to see what you've shot -- my mom knew Charlie Chaplin when he was living in Los Angeles.

Really!! WOW! Come over and see the museum, it is amazing! And some of his children still live in the area. He was and is a legend, incredible talent that came at exactly right time :)
03/13/2019 02:08:38 PM · #23
Originally posted by posthumous:

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by posthumous:

You left out my biggest reason. You took a photo of a museum display, so somebody else did most of the work.

Isn't that true of anything you don't make in your own studio or kitchen? I haven't built any bridges or skyscrapers or planted any mature trees lately ...


a bridge was built to get cars over a river. a museum exhibit was built to be looked at.

imagine if you will a bridge museum, containing an exhibit that provides a great viewing angle to a model bridge, with marvelous raking light set up by the museum director and staff.

Is there really no difference between taking a picture of a bridge and a picture of that exhibit?

All depends on the lighting, angle, composition etc. And this museum has to be experienced, it is not a static exposition at all, have you visited it, Don?
03/13/2019 02:31:42 PM · #24
Originally posted by marnet:

All depends on the lighting, angle, composition etc. And this museum has to be experienced, it is not a static exposition at all, have you visited it, Don?


No I haven't. I certainly will if I'm in the neighborhood.
03/13/2019 02:37:53 PM · #25
Originally posted by posthumous:

Originally posted by marnet:

All depends on the lighting, angle, composition etc. And this museum has to be experienced, it is not a static exposition at all, have you visited it, Don?


No I haven't. I certainly will if I'm in the neighborhood.

Let me know when you do, I am very curious to meet you in person :)
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