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DPChallenge Forums >> Challenge Results >> LETS CALL OUT PPL VOTING 1's & 2's ON GREAT PHOTOS
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Showing posts 26 - 50 of 73, (reverse)
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07/01/2018 09:04:31 AM · #26
Originally posted by Phocal:

Threads that tell people how to vote always make me giggle like a little school girl. I have given 1's to images that made the front page and I have given 10's to images that were on the last page. I also find it very offensive to suggest that me giving a 1 to an image that made the front page was because, and I quote "doing it just to be dick heads".

Lets say we do away with 1's and even 2's, would not 3's and 4's become the new 1's and 2's? Sure the average score received would go up, but the giving of a 3 would imply the same as giving a 1.

I guess you would think I was a "dick head" to learn that I only ever give out one 10 in a challenge. Well, there have been I think 3 challenges where I have given out two 10's because I couldn't decided on the winning photograph. Why do I only give out one 10? Because this is a contest and to me there can only be 1 winner and only what I feel is the top image in challenge gets the 10, the rest that are close get 9's.

Since this is not my first round in this discussion I suspect that in reply someone will bring up my vote average...…………………… FYI, it is 4.9989. Which honestly is about where it should be given that well over 1/2 the images in any given challenge are average at best in my opinion.


apologies for my dick head comment .. was probably a bit of a dick head thing for me to say .. ;)
07/01/2018 09:04:51 AM · #27
I don’t think it really matters what voting mechanism is used, there are loads of variations around the Internet, all with different relative merits, but in the end the most popular images will always float to the top and the least popular stay at the bottom.
07/01/2018 09:20:07 AM · #28
100% true Sarah, but I think Roz was just trying to find a system that doesn’t discourage people as much.

Message edited by author 2018-07-01 09:20:37.
07/01/2018 09:35:26 AM · #29
I solved the problem. I just don't vote much any more. And if I do, it's a 5 or a 6 on everything. The motives attributed to low votes horrify me. Name-calling looks to me like an attempt to shame or bully people into voting higher.

I assume the people who vote (still) are thinking about it as they go & their thoughts are about voting (not revenge). I assume people who give low votes also give high ones.

Props to those who still vote.

Message edited by author 2018-07-01 09:45:21.
07/01/2018 10:06:30 AM · #30
If a photograph deserves a 1 "some do" give it a 1, you don't get points for effort if it deserves a ten give it a 10 and anything in between as long as that is what it deserves in your opinion. I think my scoring on a percentage scale is lower than most but consistent. There are some very poor photos that in my opinion that do well and other photos that I like that don't do so well, that's the way the ball bounces. Vote and be honest with how you feel about the picture and not whether you are going to hurt someone's feelings.
07/01/2018 10:45:42 AM · #31
Originally posted by pixelpig:

I solved the problem. I just don't vote much any more. And if I do, it's a 5 or a 6 on everything. The motives attributed to low votes horrify me. Name-calling looks to me like an attempt to shame or bully people into voting higher.

I assume the people who vote (still) are thinking about it as they go & their thoughts are about voting (not revenge). I assume people who give low votes also give high ones.

Props to those who still vote.


I still vote. 100%. Almost every challenge. And my system has only changed as my taste has.
My taste does not always agree with the front page but at least I’ve cast my opinion.
I wish everyone would vote. Please. Nobody can tell you who to vote for but please cast your votes.

Edit to add: I’m not picking on any individual here. Just stressing the importance of voting at all Vs how to distribute them.

Message edited by author 2018-07-01 10:50:03.
07/01/2018 11:05:00 AM · #32
Originally posted by Phocal:

Threads that tell people how to vote always make me giggle like a little school girl. I have given 1's to images that made the front page and I have given 10's to images that were on the last page. I also find it very offensive to suggest that me giving a 1 to an image that made the front page was because, and I quote "doing it just to be dick heads".

Lets say we do away with 1's and even 2's, would not 3's and 4's become the new 1's and 2's? Sure the average score received would go up, but the giving of a 3 would imply the same as giving a 1.

I guess you would think I was a "dick head" to learn that I only ever give out one 10 in a challenge. Well, there have been I think 3 challenges where I have given out two 10's because I couldn't decided on the winning photograph. Why do I only give out one 10? Because this is a contest and to me there can only be 1 winner and only what I feel is the top image in challenge gets the 10, the rest that are close get 9's.

Since this is not my first round in this discussion I suspect that in reply someone will bring up my vote average...…………………… FYI, it is 4.9989. Which honestly is about where it should be given that well over 1/2 the images in any given challenge are average at best in my opinion.


My average is 4.8581 and I have been chastised about it being so low - I didn't think about my overall average when I voted, I just voted the way I thought any particular photo deserved.
07/01/2018 11:14:36 AM · #33
I can’t find any excuse for the 2s, but I think the 1s on the excellent photos may be mistakes by someone trying to vote 10 with a keyboard. I brought this to the attention of the SC, and they put up the announcement “Voting Scale” to remind people that they must use “0” to register a vote of “10”, because only one digit will register.
07/01/2018 11:23:35 AM · #34
Originally posted by JuliBoc:

I can’t find any excuse for the 2s, but I think the 1s on the excellent photos may be mistakes by someone trying to vote 10 with a keyboard. I brought this to the attention of the SC, and they put up the announcement “Voting Scale” to remind people that they must use “0” to register a vote of “10”, because only one digit will register.


Maybe the excuse for the 2's is that the voter intended it to be a 2 because that is what it deserved in their opinion.
07/01/2018 11:39:26 AM · #35
1. You can't change others. You can only change yourself.
2. IMO, people attribute way too much power to numbers.
3. It is scientifically proven that if you tell people how they must do something, they just stop doing it altogether.
4. There will be no pop-up windows that demand an explanation of your vote.

Message edited by Bear_Music - typo.
07/01/2018 12:21:55 PM · #36
To those who feel a vote of 1 on an excellent or absolutely wonderful photo is wrong, please tell us how to recognize these photos while voting.
07/01/2018 12:25:57 PM · #37
I agree with not having pop up messages demanding an explanation of my vote. On the other hand, an "are you sure?" message popping up for votes at the "1" level could be useful given the issue with keyboard voting registering a "1" vote (first key pressed) even when the voter finishes typing an intended "10" vote.

I suppose shifting the voting scale to be zero (lowest score) through nine (highest score) could be a way to fix the keyboard voting issue. It would also make "5" the actual middle of the scale (instead of 5.5 as is currently the case). But the uproar over shifting the scale downward after all this time would be a problem. And our cultural attachment to the idea of "perfect 10" based on certain Olympic game scores and the movie "10" should not be underestimated. Forget I even mentioned the idea.

Edited to add: I would be opposed to "calling out" people based on their voting. No basis for doing that well, and excessive use of personal confrontation is unfortunately contributing to fraying of the social fabric generally. DPC can do better.

Message edited by author 2018-07-01 12:30:49.
07/01/2018 01:38:59 PM · #38
For me lowest vote is a 5 (anything less (rarely happens) is pretty bad or very offensive)...

I try to vote as much as I can (travel interferes with this) because without the votes we wouldn’t have a contest....and I truly believe in “Pay It Forward” attitude...be kind, it took effort to enter...reward them...what does it cost you...

And unfortunately, there will always be votes of 1/2’s...can’t change that...sadly.
07/01/2018 02:25:53 PM · #39
You all realize that free will and choice don’t exist right? It’s now a scientifically proven thing so just apparently press that button on the number you apparently feel is right and relax.
07/01/2018 02:36:51 PM · #40
Originally posted by MichaelC:

100% true Sarah, but I think Roz was just trying to find a system that doesn’t discourage people as much.
....... exactly . :)

well i've certainly opened a can of worms .. !! ..
there are a couple of things i want to say ..
firstly an apology for saying ppl who vote 1's and 2's are dickheads ..
i never for one minute meant the ppl who believe the photo is worth that score ..
i was more referring to ppl who give a vote of 1 when they feel it is worth a lot more ..

and calling them dickheads was very wrong of me .. i'd edit out my comment but then a lot of the following comments wouldnt make sense ..

one very good thing however has come out of this thread ..
and that is the new thread about the voting scale alert ..
to quote the thread .."Just a reminder for new members and those just returning who may have forgotten how to use the score buttons: if you'd like to give an image a "10", you must type or click on "0". If you try to click 1 and 0, it will only count the first digit and score the image a "1". "

another quote from the thread ..
Originally posted by JuliBoc:

Originally posted by PennyStreet:

I don't see 0 but I do see 10. Clearly if you vote 10 it will show on the top of the images voted on when you're thru. So if you're favorite image is not at the top, go back and review!!

Penny, good point about checking the order of the images when you’re finished voting. But clearly someone is making mistakes.

The problem occurs when voting with the keyboard rather than the mouse. With the mouse you can click on the number scale below the photo, and you get what you expect. But if you try to enter “10” with the keyboard you will actually give the photo a “1”, since only one digit is recorded. Some of the top scoring photos, have been receiving a “1” vote, effecting the overall average. Rather than assuming there is a troll, it seems more reasonable to assume some voter(s) is voting “1” by accidentally using the keyboard wrong.


a pop up window would be great to warn ppl they are voting a 1 just in case they are intending to vote 10 .. :)

Message edited by author 2018-07-01 15:04:24.
07/01/2018 02:41:13 PM · #41
Originally posted by Ja-9:

For me lowest vote is a 5 (anything less (rarely happens) is pretty bad or very offensive)...

I try to vote as much as I can (travel interferes with this) because without the votes we wouldn’t have a contest....and I truly believe in “Pay It Forward” attitude...be kind, it took effort to enter...reward them...what does it cost you...

And unfortunately, there will always be votes of 1/2’s...can’t change that...sadly.


TOTALLY JANINE .. but this is such a divided issue ..
and ppl will say it is a contest after all ... but i'm with you .. xx
07/01/2018 02:42:21 PM · #42
Originally posted by tanguera:

1. You can't change others. You can only change yourself.
2. IMO, people attribute way too much power to numbers.
3. It is scientifically proven that if you tell people how they must do something, they just stop doing it altogether.
4. There will be no pop-up windows that demand an explanation of your vote.


can we have a pop up warning that the person has voted a 1 just in case they want to vote 10 .. :)
07/01/2018 04:03:41 PM · #43
Originally posted by roz:



can we have a pop up warning that the person has voted a 1 just in case they want to vote 10 .. :)


YES! This is a wonderful idea, Roz!
07/01/2018 04:28:28 PM · #44
I see it like this:

We have a scale from 1 to 10. It's relative to each other.

Roughly, the way I approach voting is: The worst (in my eyes) of a challenge compared to the others in the challenge gets a 1, the best (in my eyes) gets a 10. All the others are in between. (There can be more than one 1 and more than one 10, though.)

If I'd start my personal scale at 5 (instead of 1), I would simply have reduced the scale I can use - the 5 would be the worst, the 10 the best. Still there would be shots I would vote lowest. It doesn't make a difference, really, except that I would limit my ability to differentiate.

What counts at the end is the overall sum - the one with the most points divided by votes wins.

As an extreme, hypothetical example, in a challenge with 10 gorgeous images, there could be one 10, one 9, etc, and one 1. The one with a one would still be a gorgeous image, but related to the others it would still be on the last place.

If you look at the distribution of votes, it's usually pretty close to a bell curve, which is okay. The bell curve includes values at the fringes, that's just how it is in statistics.

Don't put so much significance into the 1 and 2 votes or the people passing them out. It's just numbers. Get a life.

And the more people vote, the less is the effect of the occasional 1 votes anyway.

My moral of the story: Vote, and do it as you feel it should be done. More people voting reduces the effect of the outliers.
07/01/2018 04:32:04 PM · #45
Originally posted by bjoern:

I see it like this:

More people voting reduces the effect of the outliers.


Touché.
07/01/2018 04:49:35 PM · #46
Originally posted by bjoern:

Roughly, the way I approach voting is: The worst (in my eyes) of a challenge compared to the others in the challenge gets a 1, the best (in my eyes) gets a 10. All the others are in between. (There can be more than one 1 and more than one 10, though.)

Everyone's entitled to their own approach, of course; that goes without saying.

Nevertheless, what you've just described perplexes me. As I read it, you're saying "Show me a challenge full of crappy mediocre images and I will distribute my votes exactly the same way as I would for a challenge full of really excellent, scintillating images." You are rating all the images against each other on a linear scale, where there has to be a "winner" and a "loser".

Myself, I don't see it that way. I look forward to the challenge that's so damned superior I can happily give every image in it an 8 or higher, and there are no losers...
07/01/2018 04:54:02 PM · #47
Originally posted by bjoern:



And the more people vote, the less is the effect of the occasional 1 votes anyway.

My moral of the story: Vote, and do it as you feel it should be done. More people voting reduces the effect of the outliers.

Yep
07/01/2018 05:46:29 PM · #48
Originally posted by bjoern:

.... Don't put so much significance into the 1 and 2 votes or the people passing them out. It's just numbers. Get a life.......


The issue is that with votes in the hundreds this didn’t matter but now with the low amount of voter turnout people voting at extreme ends influence the result. Whether it is because of troll behaviour or not I do not wish to see a situation where one person has that power....especially when there is an easy fix.
07/01/2018 05:47:41 PM · #49
Originally posted by Bear_Music:

....
Myself, I don't see it that way. I look forward to the challenge that's so damned superior I can happily give every image in it an 8 or higher, and there are no losers...

I agree with you, Bear. The scale clearly says “Bad” under the “1”. I would never rate a photo “bad”, unless I thought there was no redeeming feature, or if it clearly had nothing to do with the topic of the challenge.
07/01/2018 07:01:48 PM · #50
Originally posted by roz:

Originally posted by Paul:

I find a 10 point scale is sometimes insufficient to differentiate between images. By the time you’ve sorted the images into clusters where the fives are ‘better’ than the fours and the tens ‘better’ than the nines, the twos are necessarily ‘better’ than the ones; and sometimes finer granularity would be easier for me.

Having said that, I don’t think I’d ever give a ‘good-but-dull’ shot a 1.

The trouble is - what does ‘good’ mean - I think you need to do more than just expose properly and have it in focus...


it always comes down to personal preference like ' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_F.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21_F.gif', '/') + 1) . ' salmiakki said ..
its just that i have never felt justified in giving anyone less than a vote of three .. just entering a challenge gets that from me no matter how 'bad' the photo is ..
and i truly believe that we all need encouragement .. so its not just about being 'right' or seeing a photo as 'good' .. its also about seeing the positives in an image and voting on them ..


Everyone has to figure out their own methodology for giving votes on DPC, and everyone has their own opinion about why their methodology is better. I found it more useful to be consistent with my voting and if I give anyone a low vote I leave a comment about why it got a low vote. That is my personal way and it works for me. Years ago I got over the inconsistent voting patterns... yes they are frustrating but over time mostly consistent. There will always be someone giving a low score to a fabulous photo, oh well, it is more useful to get more members and hence more voters to drown out the trolls. I also choose to focus on growing my photography skill set and not obsess over the end score.
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