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05/31/2018 09:46:04 PM · #51
Originally posted by digifotojo:

I don't know if waving the annual fee would encourage more participants in DPC but it would mean bringing more advertisers on board to offset the cost of maintaining the site.

Every registered user can enter (at least) one challenge/week. The site started out free with one challenge, and when the decision was made to add a paid-member level with more challenges and Portfolio space Langdon made a commitment to always have that one free challenge every week.
05/31/2018 09:57:33 PM · #52
Yes, but wouldn't it make the site more popular if there was no fee involved at all? I know of several former members who don't bother to pay the fee anymore just to enter a challenge. If there was some way to waive the membership fee it would encourage more people to enter challenges. These days people are reluctant to put out money without getting something tangible in return. Even Angie's List is free now and probably doing a lot more business.
05/31/2018 10:23:04 PM · #53
This is probably going to be a wild ramble, but what the heck ...

I joined in 2004. I remember how exciting it was to take photos with a digital camera and get instant results. No waiting on film to be developed. Then I accidentally found this place. If this place existed prior to digital it wouldn't have been the same. Maybe it was the rise of the internet, etc... but to share photos from a film camera would have taken substantially more effort. Digital was awesome! The whole thing was fun. All of us shared that interest I think, and to have a contest with weekly windows to shoot for the subject - that was pretty awesome too.

It's been a while since the digital age came about. Plus you now have phones with cameras that beat the heck out of what many of us shot with 14+ years ago. We're bombarded with images from every angle in society today.

I guess what I'm getting at is the clamor and excitement for photography could be settling back into a tighter group of people that enjoy photography for the art that it is. Personally, I still enjoy that moment when it all comes together and I get that keeper image. I enjoyed it with film too, for 20 years before finding this place.

Is there something that meets that level of excitement and enthusiasm in photography today? Not sure that there is.

I think the idea of getting some exposure via social media will help. I also believe that DPC should stay true to it's original format and uniqueness of having to meet a challenge of capturing a contest photo in the designated period of time (I like one week better than two - but it's still unique either way).

Also - I don't mind paying $25 a year to play here without having to see all of the advertising.

Told you it would be a ramble. :-)
05/31/2018 10:28:32 PM · #54
Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by digifotojo:

I don't know if waving the annual fee would encourage more participants in DPC but it would mean bringing more advertisers on board to offset the cost of maintaining the site.

Every registered user can enter (at least) one challenge/week. The site started out free with one challenge, and when the decision was made to add a paid-member level with more challenges and Portfolio space Langdon made a commitment to always have that one free challenge every week.


I think getting back to the roots might be the way to go. Fewer challenges and open to all (no more member fee). If the site owner is not updating the site anyway, why not wave the fee. The hosting can't cost that much (and if it does, you should find another website host). A few donations should cover it.
06/01/2018 06:58:40 AM · #55
Originally posted by SaraR:


So, what can we do to drive up entries amongst those of us who have stuck with DPC?


Having started this thread, and really pleased to see so many people contributing, I thought I ought to make more of an effort myself to enter. So, an entry in for the FS and for homophones - a little last minute, but I have learned (or re-learned) new skills. Voted on the Homophones challenge, and am going to try and comment on most of the entries.
06/01/2018 08:14:25 AM · #56
i'm back too after a more than 2 months break... i'll try to enter as much as I can

... and vote
06/01/2018 10:22:30 AM · #57
This old argument again?

This dead horse has been flogged to bits, eaten by worms, which fertilized the grass, which was eaten by the offspring of the first horse and turned into horse puckey.

Damn, DPC is what it is.
06/01/2018 10:52:02 AM · #58
Originally posted by gipper11:

You are one of the reasons the site is failing,

Really??? And here I thought that as someone who loves and appreciates the site maybe my meager commitment to paying my membership helps a tiny bit. I also thought that perhaps the efforts I've put forth over the years engaging with the community both on and off the site as far as GTGs, helping out community members with contributions of cash, equipment, moral support, and all that goes along with the sometimes magical thing that an Internet community can bring might have something to do with the staying power it has enjoyed. And the joy of being around so many members who have done and felt the same over the years.
Originally posted by gipper11:

there are no longer thousands of photographers using the site.

Okay..... That's kind of obvious, and is what this thread's all about. Trying to rekindle some of what we had. Taking potshots at the site owner doesn't do that, however.
Originally posted by gipper11:

I talk with my money.

No, not really. You have the opportunity, for a meager fee, to take advantage of an incredible resource if you choose to take advantage of what's available.
Originally posted by gipper11:

The cost is not the point,

Yet you keep harping on this money thing......so?
Originally posted by gipper11:

the point is if you are going to charge a user fee then you are obligated to keep it up to and running and make improvements where needed,

Um, no, that's not how it works. If you charge a fee and offer services, you're obliged to provide the services offered at the point of service for fee agreement. Just because YOU think the site should meet your expectations and demands doesn't mean it has *any* obligation to do so. If you like what's offered and feel that it's a value, great, if not, then don't join. But don't pay your money and then ask for more than was offered because it doesn't meet your idea of what the site is supposed to be.
Originally posted by gipper11:

if what you’re charging is not enough to cover the cost of maintaining the site then increase it.

Actually, other than a statement of the obvious, this doesn't concern you in the slightest....nor I either, since neither of us are site owners. I'm just grateful that after more than a decade, the price has NOT increased, yet there have been many improvements that I've seen since being here. Because I like the site. Because I'm grateful and appreciative for any improvements, especially with zero increase in membership. But you've not seen that. That doesn't mean it hasn't happened.
Originally posted by gipper11:

I don’t begrudge the owner of making a few bucks and he owes me nothing,

Then let it alone. It's simple....you don't have to pay for membership and you can still enter some challenges as a registered user. So do that. I know I spend more on beer in a couple days than I spend on my DPC membership. And I get one Hell of a lot more for my money with DPC. It's perspective and perception as well. You want to look for the negative, sure, you can find it. But I look at what this site has brought me in the way of life enrichment and I cannot even begin to imagine where I would have gotten what I have from anywhere else much less at $25 a year.
Originally posted by gipper11:

he owes you nothing either.

Got that right! And I'm eternally grateful for what he has given me. His vision changed my life irrevocably forever. And in the most incredibly positive way. You will *NEVER* hear me piss and moan about the stupid shit I see/hear constantly. That goes with the territory on the 'Net, but that also means I get to open my big mouth, too.
Originally posted by gipper11:

Your positive input doesn’t seem to be doing the trick.

Yeah, whatever..... I can pretty much tell ya one thing though. Even if the site tanks, there are those of us who will remember it fondly, and the impact that it has had on so many photographers around the world cannot be expressed thoroughly enough.

Like most things in life, you reap what you sow, yadda yadda, but I know that the reason that many of us have gotten to where we are as accomplished, award winning, comfortable, competent, visionary photographers can be directly attributed to their commitment to, and the value realized from, DP Challenge.
06/01/2018 11:38:58 AM · #59
Originally posted by Spork99:

This old argument again?

This dead horse has been flogged to bits, eaten by worms, which fertilized the grass, which was eaten by the offspring of the first horse and turned into horse puckey.

Damn, DPC is what it is.


Spork wins
06/01/2018 03:28:03 PM · #60
Originally posted by NikonJeb:

Originally posted by gipper11:

You are one of the reasons the site is failing,

Really??? And here I thought that as someone who loves and appreciates the site maybe my meager commitment to paying my membership helps a tiny bit. I also thought that perhaps the efforts I've put forth over the years engaging with the community both on and off the site as far as GTGs, helping out community members with contributions of cash, equipment, moral support, and all that goes along with the sometimes magical thing that an Internet community can bring might have something to do with the staying power it has enjoyed. And the joy of being around so many members who have done and felt the same over the years.
Originally posted by gipper11:

there are no longer thousands of photographers using the site.

Okay..... That's kind of obvious, and is what this thread's all about. Trying to rekindle some of what we had. Taking potshots at the site owner doesn't do that, however.
Originally posted by gipper11:

I talk with my money.

No, not really. You have the opportunity, for a meager fee, to take advantage of an incredible resource if you choose to take advantage of what's available.
Originally posted by gipper11:

The cost is not the point,

Yet you keep harping on this money thing......so?
Originally posted by gipper11:

the point is if you are going to charge a user fee then you are obligated to keep it up to and running and make improvements where needed,

Um, no, that's not how it works. If you charge a fee and offer services, you're obliged to provide the services offered at the point of service for fee agreement. Just because YOU think the site should meet your expectations and demands doesn't mean it has *any* obligation to do so. If you like what's offered and feel that it's a value, great, if not, then don't join. But don't pay your money and then ask for more than was offered because it doesn't meet your idea of what the site is supposed to be.
Originally posted by gipper11:

if what you’re charging is not enough to cover the cost of maintaining the site then increase it.

Actually, other than a statement of the obvious, this doesn't concern you in the slightest....nor I either, since neither of us are site owners. I'm just grateful that after more than a decade, the price has NOT increased, yet there have been many improvements that I've seen since being here. Because I like the site. Because I'm grateful and appreciative for any improvements, especially with zero increase in membership. But you've not seen that. That doesn't mean it hasn't happened.
Originally posted by gipper11:

I don’t begrudge the owner of making a few bucks and he owes me nothing,

Then let it alone. It's simple....you don't have to pay for membership and you can still enter some challenges as a registered user. So do that. I know I spend more on beer in a couple days than I spend on my DPC membership. And I get one Hell of a lot more for my money with DPC. It's perspective and perception as well. You want to look for the negative, sure, you can find it. But I look at what this site has brought me in the way of life enrichment and I cannot even begin to imagine where I would have gotten what I have from anywhere else much less at $25 a year.
Originally posted by gipper11:

he owes you nothing either.

Got that right! And I'm eternally grateful for what he has given me. His vision changed my life irrevocably forever. And in the most incredibly positive way. You will *NEVER* hear me piss and moan about the stupid shit I see/hear constantly. That goes with the territory on the 'Net, but that also means I get to open my big mouth, too.
Originally posted by gipper11:

Your positive input doesn’t seem to be doing the trick.

Yeah, whatever..... I can pretty much tell ya one thing though. Even if the site tanks, there are those of us who will remember it fondly, and the impact that it has had on so many photographers around the world cannot be expressed thoroughly enough.

Like most things in life, you reap what you sow, yadda yadda, but I know that the reason that many of us have gotten to where we are as accomplished, award winning, comfortable, competent, visionary photographers can be directly attributed to their commitment to, and the value realized from, DP Challenge.


Very well said, I can’t argue with a word you said. I took some time and looked at you material on your website and read your introduction, I can see you are passionate about your photography and artwork.
06/01/2018 05:14:53 PM · #61
Originally posted by gipper11:

Very well said, I can’t argue with a word you said. I took some time and looked at you material on your website and read your introduction, I can see you are passionate about your photography and artwork.

And therein lies an incredible level of frustration. For you, you haven't gotten to a point where you have seen what the place can do for you. It's often a lot of hard work simply to make something pay off. I have to admit that I was extraordinarily lucky in meeting a couple of my mentors here early on who were there for me exactly when I needed them.

I know this may come as a shock to you, but I'm kind of large and noisy, so possibly my mere presence made it easy for them to offer a helping hand.....but regardless of why, they were there and an enormous help.

Got an idea....

Why don't you and I, as it seems like neither of us are terribly shy see if we can't work something that would help the site.

You could talk specifics, and generalities as to what you'd like to see from the site and the community, and I'll see if I can't either guide you somewhere, or answer "I don't know" where that happens.

It looks like you've been here about 30 months and have averaged about two challenges a month, though you did say that it'd been a while, but for sake of discussion.....you're not a lurker, but something has happened that the bloom is off the rose.

So if you could take a look at where you are as a photog, and tell us where you would like to go next, maybe something here at DPC will help.

BTW.... Thanks so much for your kind words. I do feel that I've come a long way since I first got here and am a fairly good photographer.

One of the reasons I stay here though is because *NOBODY* blows smoke up my skirt. I get hammered in voting and have it pointed out where I missed the mark in a challenge. The difference for me now is that it used to hurt and it was a struggle to keep up my spirits and work harder.

Now it just hurts and it reminds me that no matter how good I feel, how much I've accomplished, and how many sales I make, that I can always get the truth, the hard criticism, no matter how well stated, and the scores to remind me that I *can* still learn and grow.

I often wonder if this site's attrition rate has anything to do with people who simply can not, or do not want, to take the unvarnished opinions of others in voting. I know the single biggest gripe is to not have comments for low scores left, but even just the number speaks volumes. I know that sometimes it's skewed as well. I've won awards and had good sales on images that didn't do so well here.

But I can tell you this. I've never had an image do well here that didn't do excellently everywhere else.


06/02/2018 02:46:28 PM · #62
If there is one constant in life it’s that everything changes, nothing absolutely nothing stays the same, if we only know one thing with certitude it’s that fact, what else can we know for sure? We can either embrace change or suffer the consequences of its effects. If DPC dies that’s perfection, if DPC gets a new lease of life that’s also perfection. Facebook is now being frowned upon by the young and in a few years there will be an even more popular thing to divert the mind with. Free will and choice are not something this believes in but if they were the best thing that could happen to the people clinging to this site would be the acceptance of its decline and end, then maybe in that decontraction the site could actually find a new lease of life.
06/03/2018 04:05:38 AM · #63
Oh heck, you lost me at If
06/03/2018 12:36:10 PM · #64
Originally posted by jagar:

If there is one constant in life it’s that everything changes, nothing absolutely nothing stays the same, if we only know one thing with certitude it’s that fact, what else can we know for sure? We can either embrace change or suffer the consequences of its effects. If DPC dies that’s perfection, if DPC gets a new lease of life that’s also perfection. Facebook is now being frowned upon by the young and in a few years there will be an even more popular thing to divert the mind with. Free will and choice are not something this believes in but if they were the best thing that could happen to the people clinging to this site would be the acceptance of its decline and end, then maybe in that decontraction the site could actually find a new lease of life.

I don't think there's anything wrong, or desperate in trying to figure out some balance point to keep the site open. I don't dispute for a second that very real likelihood that the site will never achieve what it was in its heyday. But to my knowledge, and for the few of us "clinging to it", it's more of a case of there not being anything quite like it out there. This site still offers the resources to self-develop with the assistance of people who have gone that route in the past and are interested in keeping the concept up and running. As long as anyone finds this place, and can appreciate and utilize its unique offerings, then that's a good thing.

Fromn where I sit, I'd like to see the core group, such as it is, kind of collectively raise a hand and state whether or not they're willing to hang in there so that at least Langdon knows that he's covered from the standpoint of costs for the site. There may actually be some future in organising the resources for referral to help newbies find out who they might approach to further their particular needs and interests as they develop. I'm not sure how we would best go about that, but we're still talking. We'd need to find out from Langdon the number that is required for paid members to keep the site open from that membership fee.

How about you, John? You willing to stick around and give newcomers advice and guidance? I can't imagine that would be anything but a huge benefit for a newcomer. And if so, where do we start to accumulate the info necessary to do this?

Message edited by author 2018-06-03 12:39:15.
06/03/2018 03:09:03 PM · #65
I don't enter much, but I just can't let my membership lapse. I'm sure I will be one of the last ones here if the lights go out.

I have not found another site that has as much to offer as DPC. I tried Fred Miranda a few years ago, and recently looked at them again. Their challenges only have five to ten entries. It's hard to enter (at least I have a hard time, but I'm not a paying member) and entries are not anonymous. ViewBug has quite a few challenges that are free, but none require new photos. This is the only photography challenge site I pay for.
06/03/2018 05:48:25 PM · #66
I have accounts at DPC, Instagram, SmugMug, & Flickr. SmugMug & Flickr have just merged.
06/04/2018 10:22:52 AM · #67
Originally posted by Elaine:

This is the only photography challenge site I pay for.

Ditto
06/06/2018 06:36:44 PM · #68
SO...

First, I love DPC... it's where I started learning. TONS of advice I use today, was gleaned from this website, and USUALLY without actually posting about it, cause someone else already asked the question. I'm shooting entirely differently than I did when I first joined, and I disappeared for oh... 7 years, but divorce, job changes, lifestyle changes, blah blah blah...

But when I came back, it's the same place... yah, it's smaller, but in a way, that's better. I DQ'd my last entry, cause I mislabeled a directory on my computer, and haven't entered since because of timing, but my critique of the one before, was spot on.

I'll maintain my membership.

If I could put in a wishlist???

1. I want a DPC android\iphone app. I want a widget, that literally reads the current challenges, and displays them on a page on my phone. I'm out of the habit of reading the forums because of my hectic schedule, and I've missed shooting for a challenge when I could, because I didn't know. Sure, the widget could open up a browser window, but that's all I want. OOOH... a calendar that could sync with ical/google/outlook would fit this too. But might be more manual labor.

2. I'd LOVE to have future challenges on a schedule, so I could plan further in advance. Juggling my other hobbies, photography, and my day job, the more lead time the better. Not sure how feasible this is, but there it is.

Beyond that... wouldn't change a thing, and honestly, would feel weird if it changed too much.

06/06/2018 07:29:42 PM · #69
Originally posted by eckoe:

I'd LOVE to have future challenges on a schedule, so I could plan further in advance. Juggling my other hobbies, photography, and my day job, the more lead time the better. Not sure how feasible this is, but there it is.

One problem with that is, if folks knew ahead of time which challenges would run when then the temptation to reset the camera's time/date stamp might prove irresistible to some individuals, and it would be a nightmare to police. Also, there's a qualitative difference between having a week (or two) to conceptualize and execute and having an indefinite amount of time to plan and conceptualize, even if execution occurs within the window of the challenge.
06/06/2018 07:43:40 PM · #70
Several things I would like to respond to in this thread.

From NikonJeb: "I've won awards and had good sales on images that didn't do so well here. But I can tell you this. I've never had an image do well here that didn't do excellently everywhere else."
++

From TinyP "Oh heck, you lost me at If"
LOLOL and me too!

From Elaine: "I don't enter much, but I just can't let my membership lapse. I'm sure I will be one of the last ones here if the lights go out."
++

Message edited by author 2018-06-06 19:44:03.
06/06/2018 08:12:34 PM · #71
I can tell you that I left for the simple fact that it seemed like nothing ever got updated or changed. I think it's time to lower the price of emission and or update the site to a more current style theme.... Layout can stay the same but the site says 1990 all over it. IMO
06/06/2018 08:44:49 PM · #72
I'm curious. With some comments saying that this site is old and outdated ... what current photography contest sites would be a good example of what DPChallenge should emulate, design-wise?

Google "photography contests" and the list is fairly substantial. Do any of these match what DPChallenge currently offers but are more contemporary?

Viewbug
Photocrowd
Photo Contest Insider
fredmiranda.com
DPREVIEW
DYXUM.com

I for one, like the design of DPChallenge, as is. Maybe it's because I'm used to it. But really, it works for easy navigation, etc...
06/06/2018 09:13:04 PM · #73
Originally posted by glad2badad:

I'm curious. With some comments saying that this site is old and outdated ... what current photography contest sites would be a good example of what DPChallenge should emulate, design-wise?

Google "photography contests" and the list is fairly substantial. Do any of these match what DPChallenge currently offers but are more contemporary?

Viewbug
Photocrowd
Photo Contest Insider
fredmiranda.com
DPREVIEW
DYXUM.com

I for one, like the design of DPChallenge, as is. Maybe it's because I'm used to it. But really, it works for easy navigation, etc...


I wasn't talking about compairing it to any other photography sites.. I was talking about the web in general...
https://99designs.com/blog/trends/web-design-trends-2018/

Message edited by Bear_Music - parsed link.
06/06/2018 09:43:11 PM · #74
Originally posted by Dirt_Diver:

Originally posted by glad2badad:

I'm curious. With some comments saying that this site is old and outdated ... what current photography contest sites would be a good example of what DPChallenge should emulate, design-wise?

Google "photography contests" and the list is fairly substantial. Do any of these match what DPChallenge currently offers but are more contemporary?

Viewbug
Photocrowd
Photo Contest Insider
fredmiranda.com
DPREVIEW
DYXUM.com

I for one, like the design of DPChallenge, as is. Maybe it's because I'm used to it. But really, it works for easy navigation, etc...


I wasn't talking about compairing it to any other photography sites.. I was talking about the web in general...
https://99designs.com/blog/trends/web-design-trends-2018/

Took a look at 99designs.com - mostly cosmetic updates with the exception of the mobile section (and that doesn't play well when trying to vote on images). Cool site though for ideas overall. May use it myself. :-)
06/06/2018 10:12:15 PM · #75
I've been here on and off since 2004.and count myself lucky to have 2 HM's in all this time, But its not all about winning I am constantly amazed at the quality of images here and the imagination of many of the contributors.

I really believe that for $25 a year you get more than just the challenges its a real family here and I for one will be here until the end ......
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