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Showing posts 101 - 118 of 118, (reverse)
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 10/06/2017 12:14:34 PM · #101
Let's do what we can to get more people THEN worry if we get too many.

This isn't an issue right now, remember???
 10/06/2017 12:28:38 PM · #102
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
ETA - Go back to 2006/2007 ish time... You'll see an average of nearly 300-400... And it seemed to be the "prime time" for DPC...

Yes, and you'll see that we had to start having two "exclusive" challenges (you could only enter one or the other) to get the number of entries back down to a "manageable" level.

We want people to look at pictures for more than the five seconds it takes to push a voting button, maybe even leave some thoughtful feedback -- when you get up over 2-300 entries it can become frustrating or even impossible for a lot of people.
 10/06/2017 12:55:15 PM · #103
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
Originally posted by salmiakki:
If you continue to push the mobile phone voting agenda you also run the risk of pushing some of the few long standing DPCers who do already pay away.


I'm going to actually disagree. Here's why... The members don't pay for the voting ability... They pay for the ability to enter the member challenges as well as portfolio space.


There you are making assumptions again. You really cannot possibly know what motivates people to pay to be a member here. There are lots of reasons and I'm a good example of someone who votes and rarely enters.

I think you are missing the point that people in this thread at least, do not want to have their images voted on from a mobile device. A poll would be a good idea to see how many people would actually be happy to have their images voted on from a phone.

Message edited by author 2017-10-06 12:59:12.
 10/06/2017 01:19:35 PM · #104
Originally posted by salmiakki:
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
Originally posted by salmiakki:
If you continue to push the mobile phone voting agenda you also run the risk of pushing some of the few long standing DPCers who do already pay away.


I'm going to actually disagree. Here's why... The members don't pay for the voting ability... They pay for the ability to enter the member challenges as well as portfolio space.


There you are making assumptions again. You really cannot possibly know what motivates people to pay to be a member here. There are lots of reasons and I'm a good example of someone who votes and rarely enters.

I think you are missing the point that people in this thread at least, do not want to have their images voted on from a mobile device. A poll would be a good idea to see how many people would actually be happy to have their images voted on from a phone.


You're right... It is an assumption. I'll be the first to admit that I'm only speculating and would love to see the data to back up whatever the reason people pay to be a member here.

But even if we did a poll for mobile voting, I think it would be very skewed towards the individuals who don't want mobile voting. Reason - The majority of people who are here aren't part of the instagram/facebook/twitter era where everything is done via mobile for photography. (again, an assumption but I think we can agree on this one at least).

My guess, if we polled everyone here one DPC the question it'd come back nearly 90% or more that voting via mobile is NOT what they want... But if we asked the same amount of people who are outsiders who know nothing about the site, then I'd guess it'd be DRASTICALLY different.

Again, you're right it's an assumption... But something I think we can probably agree on.
 10/06/2017 01:20:04 PM · #105
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
ETA - Go back to 2006/2007 ish time... You'll see an average of nearly 300-400... And it seemed to be the "prime time" for DPC...

Yes, and you'll see that we had to start having two "exclusive" challenges (you could only enter one or the other) to get the number of entries back down to a "manageable" level.

We want people to look at pictures for more than the five seconds it takes to push a voting button, maybe even leave some thoughtful feedback -- when you get up over 2-300 entries it can become frustrating or even impossible for a lot of people.


Okay, fair... But why can't we go back to this if we have too many entries?
 10/06/2017 01:39:49 PM · #106
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
My guess, if we polled everyone here one DPC the question it'd come back nearly 90% or more that voting via mobile is NOT what they want... But if we asked the same amount of people who are outsiders who know nothing about the site, then I'd guess it'd be DRASTICALLY different.

So you think the site should structured according to how you guess people who AREN'T a part of it and don't know how it works might like, as opposed to how people who are actually participants here want? How can someone who has never used the site possibly say what would be "better"? Your logic escapes me ...
 10/06/2017 01:40:18 PM · #107
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
But even if we did a poll for mobile voting, I think it would be very skewed towards the individuals who don't want mobile voting. Reason - The majority of people who are here aren't part of the instagram/facebook/twitter era where everything is done via mobile for photography. (again, an assumption but I think we can agree on this one at least).


Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
My guess, if we polled everyone here one DPC the question it'd come back nearly 90% or more that voting via mobile is NOT what they want... But if we asked the same amount of people who are outsiders who know nothing about the site, then I'd guess it'd be DRASTICALLY different.

I think you're making an assumption here that is skewing your whole reasoning.

I don't do Twitter or Instagram because my brain, even though I am ADD, can hold it together for longer than 30 seconds.

I do dink around on FB, more that I want, but I do it to stay connected to certain aspects of what's going on around me.

HOWEVER.....

This is a photography site. FB, Twitter, & Instagram are social networking sites. Pretty pictures are not their collective main interest, much less the equipment and techniques getting them.

I think that by and large anyone you would specifically ask what we're looking for in members would tell you that they would like to see people who are interested in photography, not the millennial who is glued to his phone and occasionally snaps a pic.

Someone said something about broadcasting propaganda information about an elite, invitation only photography site. I don't care for the elite part, but the idea has merit. Make the site desirable to people who are/aspire to serious photography.

Let the IG folks play on their 15 seconds of.......whatever on the social sites.
 10/06/2017 02:10:45 PM · #108
The reason I'm saying this (especially the poll assumptions) is not how I want the site to function in its entirety. Far from it, I just feel as though the website would grow again if we gave a new look to the site on mobile devices as well as a function to vote on images. Again, it doesn't have to be all or even a lot of challenges open to mobile voting. 2 per month with mobile voting enabled while all others are required to have a computer to vote is fine. I'm just saying to drive traffic here, "the outsiders" need a desirable site to work with and currently, with today's technology, a lot of these people are searching the web 80% of the time on their phone and 20% on their computers. (these numbers I'm sure are wrong but it's just a guess given the number of smartphones in the world).

I don't want to scare away the people who want computer voting only... I'm only saying to drive traffic again, mobile is the way of the future.

I can see that I am outnumbered on this voting idea and that's fine... But there's no way you can't see what I'm trying to say here. I don't want to kill the voting integrity, I'm trying to bring more people here. I don't give a crap how it happens, I just want it to happen and in my opinion... This is one way of making it happen.
 10/06/2017 02:20:17 PM · #109
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
My guess, if we polled everyone here one DPC the question it'd come back nearly 90% or more that voting via mobile is NOT what they want... But if we asked the same amount of people who are outsiders who know nothing about the site, then I'd guess it'd be DRASTICALLY different.

So you think the site should structured according to how you guess people who AREN'T a part of it and don't know how it works might like, as opposed to how people who are actually participants here want? How can someone who has never used the site possibly say what would be "better"? Your logic escapes me ...


I'm not saying "better" I'm saying desirable. Sure you've given me FANTASTIC reasons why we shouldn't vote via mobile... And I've continuously agreed with those reasons... But not once have you given a reason why this wouldn't drive traffic to the site. As I've said many times (in different ways)... This isn't to destroy the voting integrity for the entire site... It's to drive traffic and bring activity back to the way it was or maybe more.

And if your reason why we shouldn't go into the mobile platform is that you don't want the "instant gratification" crowd showing up... Then I hate to say it but, this is rapidly becoming the norm with my generation as sad as it is to admit that... And that's why the site will slowly come to a crawling halt.
 10/06/2017 03:17:22 PM · #110
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:

And if your reason why we shouldn't go into the mobile platform is that you don't want the "instant gratification" crowd showing up... Then I hate to say it but, this is rapidly becoming the norm with my generation as sad as it is to admit that... And that's why the site will slowly come to a crawling halt.

If that's the case, then let it die.

The objective of DPC is as a teaching/learning/challenging PHOTOGRAPHY site.

It is *NOT* a social networking site.

If people simply don't give a shit any more about photography, oh well, but seriously, I don't see that happening.

There's more activity here in my area of late, and I see more photography based FB pages every day.

But it's all IG stuff......people post a photo, everyone goes "Ooooh!" and you move onto the next shot.

That's not what this place is about. You can actually get help, spend time on a thread over an indefinite amount of time trying to sort out an issue, i.e. Wendy's latest quest to move into the mirrorless she's now using. You won't get that kind of comprehensive back and forth on a FB page. Just won't happen.

It's not just your generation, either. There are plenty of people around like me, who were kids when dinosaurs roamed the earth that may have only gotten serious since the advent of digital. We need to reach those people as well. These people need a site like DPC, whether they're even aware of it.\

Working some level of mobile ease into the site is on no level a bad thing.....even some of us dinosaurs will appreciate that in different degrees. I simply don't feel that making a concerted effort to try to convert the smartphone masses into the type of earnest photographer is a sensible idea. We need people who already know they want to work on their photography and wouldn't necessarily be more interested simply because of mobile capability.

Truly we need quality more than quantity. Sure, we need all the people we can to a certain extent, but maybe it would make more sense to formulate a target market and head in that direction, i.e. get the word out to local camera clubs, talk about it and shamelessly promote us on the FB photography sites, and even try and work up some kind of "Press Kit" or virtual pamphlet that we can instantaneously pass along.

Maybe even put together a tutorial on promoting DPC.
 10/09/2017 01:08:11 PM · #111
Originally posted by NikonJeb:

If that's the case, then let it die.

The objective of DPC is as a teaching/learning/challenging PHOTOGRAPHY site.

It is *NOT* a social networking site.

If people simply don't give a shit any more about photography, oh well, but seriously, I don't see that happening.

There's more activity here in my area of late, and I see more photography based FB pages every day.

But it's all IG stuff......people post a photo, everyone goes "Ooooh!" and you move onto the next shot.

That's not what this place is about. You can actually get help, spend time on a thread over an indefinite amount of time trying to sort out an issue, i.e. Wendy's latest quest to move into the mirrorless she's now using. You won't get that kind of comprehensive back and forth on a FB page. Just won't happen.

It's not just your generation, either. There are plenty of people around like me, who were kids when dinosaurs roamed the earth that may have only gotten serious since the advent of digital. We need to reach those people as well. These people need a site like DPC, whether they're even aware of it.\

Working some level of mobile ease into the site is on no level a bad thing.....even some of us dinosaurs will appreciate that in different degrees. I simply don't feel that making a concerted effort to try to convert the smartphone masses into the type of earnest photographer is a sensible idea. We need people who already know they want to work on their photography and wouldn't necessarily be more interested simply because of mobile capability.

Truly we need quality more than quantity. Sure, we need all the people we can to a certain extent, but maybe it would make more sense to formulate a target market and head in that direction, i.e. get the word out to local camera clubs, talk about it and shamelessly promote us on the FB photography sites, and even try and work up some kind of "Press Kit" or virtual pamphlet that we can instantaneously pass along.

Maybe even put together a tutorial on promoting DPC.


A couple of things about this post... I don't want this to be facebook... I want this site to be the information driven site that I know and love. But we can't without members... I want the site to last... That's all.

As for the rest of your post... I am all for marketing too. But that's not what we are talking about here. I can have another thread opened up for marketing tactics and we can discuss that. I know that they go hand in hand here but without a site that is mobile friendly marketing to people will almost be null-and-void.
 10/10/2017 05:53:36 PM · #112
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
I don't want this to be facebook... I want this site to be the information driven site that I know and love. But we can't without members... I want the site to last... That's all.

We are in agreement there.
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
I am all for marketing too. But that's not what we are talking about here. I can have another thread opened up for marketing tactics and we can discuss that.

I hate that term......but I can see how it could apply. I'd like to think of it more as a community effort to bring in people that they know, spend some time on making likely possibilities more aware of us and what we have to offer..... you wanna call it marketing, okay, but I think my point is to raise our visibility in and among photography related areas.
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
I know that they go hand in hand here but without a site that is mobile friendly marketing to people will almost be null-and-void.

I think that your premise is flawed. I'm sorry but I just plain flat disagree with it. It's about photography, not convenience or a mobile platform. The nuts and bolts of serious photography, the back and forth amongst members and people they're helping, the critiques and helpful hints and techniques..... I just don't think that the kind of interaction of the DPC experience is going to be a make or break thing because of mobile phone access. Do I use my phone all the time for various things? Of course! But I use my desktop a lot more. I'm a mechanic, I work on cars. I use my mobile as a flight recorder for doing computer diagnostics. I use Google, Google maps, have my website always available, text, and oh yeah.......it's a PHONE, too! I don't dispute that it's something that may be nice additionally, but to say that DPC is going to die off without it is to me just not the case.
 10/11/2017 12:39:10 AM · #113
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
I am all for marketing too. But that's not what we are talking about here. I can have another thread opened up for marketing tactics and we can discuss that.

I hate that term......but I can see how it could apply. I'd like to think of it more as a community effort to bring in people that they know, spend some time on making likely possibilities more aware of us and what we have to offer..... you wanna call it marketing, okay, but I think my point is to raise our visibility in and among photography related areas.

Recruiting is probably the term you're looking for.
 10/21/2017 11:51:57 AM · #114
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
I can imagine the site growing at a fairly high rate once we grasp the "instant gratification" crowd.


The one thing that I've always appreciated about this site is that you don't get pats on the back for showing up and shooting. You get intelligent, honest, generally articulate and insightful feedback.

You will *NOT* get that from the "IG" crowd. That's what FaceBook, Instagram, and Twitter are all about.

I'll work at something, put something I feel is pretty decent together, post it here asking for CC, and I get it. Brutal, honest, and intelligent. I never want to lose that.

It's about photography, not convenience or a mobile platform. The nuts and bolts of serious photography, the back and forth amongst members and people they're helping, the critiques and helpful hints and techniques.


I totally agree. I'm happy for this site to stay exactly how it is. A place where long-lasting relationships have been built.

Message edited by author 2017-10-21 12:11:25.
 10/21/2017 12:51:29 PM · #115
So....

What *can* we do to raise awareness of DPC at a grass roots level?

And can this mobile app be refined and at least adopted for folks who want to use it if not annexed/sanctioned by DPC proper?
 09/15/2023 03:31:26 AM · #116
Just happened to come across this post now and even though it's a very old post I couldn't agree with Jeb more...it's exactly how I feel about it too.

Originally posted by the_rkp:
Originally posted by Lydia:
Thank you, Riccardo!

You are welcome Lydia :)

Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
I don't see this site lasting much longer if it doesn't change in one shape of form... Mobile platform or whatever... Something needs to change.

Doom & gloom because it doesn't change to your expectations???

This always saddens me to see/hear this kind of thing. The site has remained a good and decent thing and hopefully there will be enough of us who see that and appreciate it to keep the doors open for a while yet.

I check my scores occasionally on my phone, and I actually have an entry in voting shot with it, but for the most part, my DPC activity is done on a desktop. I have three I use regularly.

It truly is not reasonable to view entries in voting on a cell phone. I remember the constant bitching, that went on for a number of years about the 700px limit because it just was *NOT* big enough to represent the impact necessary for viewing quality images.

Now you wanna look at 'em on a four inch screen? What a crock!

Personally, I think not being allowed to vote from cell phones is an absolute must. If someone is too lazy to get to a desktop and properly view entries, then they really shouldn't be doing this DPC thing. And I sure as Hell don't want bored lazy millennials voting my entries while sitting in a coffee shop. If that's what the answer is to keeping DPC alive, let it die. It's a photography site. If you can't be bothered to make some effort, then take your phone and go do something else.

This is a good place to learn and practice photography. It's got a multitude of ways that you can utilize it to keep you sharp, improve your skills, share techniques and info with other photogs the world over, and you don't have to do anything but practice and develop your skillsets. Why the constant whining and trying to change this or that? Use the plethora of what's here to improve.

Actually, despite I understand your skepticism about the voting from a mobile device (even if there are some tablets with much better screen than an old PC), I found the mobile version of the site useful for a lot of other functions like
- Look at open contests
- Check contests results
- Check votes of your submissions
- Interact with forum (not jet developed :-p)
- ...

Of course you can do it also with the standard version of the site, but why to use standard version if there could be a mobile version that make it better?
09/15/2023 09:19:40 AM · #117
While we are at it, the very notion of these threads is outdated.
I can't even give these posts a THUMB'S-UP!? =)
 09/22/2023 10:15:42 AM · #118
I read through this whole thread before I realized it had been resurrected from 2017. I have a lot of mixed feelings about it, but it also made me laugh: back in '06/'07 when I was at university, I used to be active on the site - and vote - from a Dell PocketPC, because smartphones hadn't been invented yet. It worked surprisingly well, but given the strong feelings about phone voting, I fear this information might give some folks a stroke ;-)
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