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DPChallenge Forums >> General Discussion >> should concept be copyright?
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02/10/2015 09:20:37 PM · #1
Here the question is, should concept be copyrighted? In this photograph, left one is taken by our own ' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', '/') + 1) . ' spiritualspatula and right one is one of the blockbuster indian movie named PK movie poster. It is not a true copy but concept of a person is similar.

This movie made hell lot of money and wondering if there is a way Derek can take some money out from them and throw us a party ;)

By the way Derek took this shot in 2011 and movie came in late 2014!

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/60000-64999/60581/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1141677.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/60000-64999/60581/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1141677.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
02/10/2015 09:23:48 PM · #2
I don't know if a naked dude holding something over his junk is really a copyrightable "concept". It seems like something that's been around as long as I can remember.
02/10/2015 09:24:50 PM · #3
I really don't see any conceptual similarities at all.
02/10/2015 09:44:37 PM · #4
you should aim to copyright the concept you feel might be copied - before you post the result of that concept online or elsewhere.

02/10/2015 10:33:34 PM · #5
I hate to say it, but if the royalties/lawsuit would be funding the party, it won't be much of a monetary party. I don't see much similarities.

Who's gonna be there?
02/10/2015 10:50:00 PM · #6
As long as you can get a keg and a pack of red solo cups from the royalties then I'm in.

To be serious though I don't see the exact similarities in these 2 images. I think we really push the limits of copyright sometimes when we want to make some "free" money off something. I think the rule of thumb should be, "if you gotta ask if others think it's a copyright issue then it's probably not." Meaning if you really have any case on a copyright I would prefer it to be glaringly obvious.

Message edited by author 2015-02-10 22:51:53.
02/11/2015 07:27:23 AM · #7
I took a picture of the beach the other day.
02/11/2015 07:42:48 AM · #8
No, its not.

an idea can't be copyrighted, now if Derek had created this character and likeness and the movie knowingly copied and used that likeness, it would be a different situation.


Copyright infringement occurs when someone other than the copyright holder copies the “expression” of a work. This means that the idea or information behind the work is not protected, but how the idea is expressed is protected. For example, there have been many movies about Pirates, but only one Jack Sparrow.


from:

//www.clickandcopyright.com/copyright-resources/copyright-infringement.aspx

Message edited by author 2015-02-11 07:43:03.
02/11/2015 10:54:27 AM · #9
If ideas could be copyrighted, it would cut the production of romance novels by about 90%. :)

There's nothing new under the sun.
02/11/2015 04:03:23 PM · #10
Well someone has copyrighted the image of a double decker bus crossing tower bridge in London, so no one can take a similar shot, go figure that out then
02/11/2015 04:20:53 PM · #11
Originally posted by kiwinick:

Well someone has copyrighted the image of a double decker bus crossing tower bridge in London, so no one can take a similar shot, go figure that out then

I think you are free to TAKE as many similar shots as you want, but (for example) you can't distribute them as a stock image, as that trafficks on and undermines the commercial value created by the original. You can certainly print such an image for your family photo album, and you can probably even sell individual "fine art prints" but not postcards or coffee mugs ...
02/11/2015 05:48:50 PM · #12
.

Message edited by author 2015-02-11 17:50:05.
02/11/2015 10:05:02 PM · #13
When I started this thread the question that I had in my mind was, an idea that became an execution and that became a fine art product. Once a fine art product is ready, now we say that a fine art product can be copy righted but why not idea or concept when it was taking shape?

The reason is simple say Apple got an idea and they copy right it and then final product came out and copy right that too so that if anyone try to mimic it they get permission. Why the same cannot be applied when it comes to a concept in photography. Meaning that as soon as I have an idea I copy right it and then copy right final product too.

In photograph that I attached, I know they are different they have different item in the photograph, different angle, different perspective, env, lighting etc but when I look at the core of an image it is a person is naked and holding something to cover.

Again I am not trying to say that Derek should go and get the money (that was just to make some light weight discussion point :) ) but what I am trying to understand that if I take a shot today and few years down the road someone is using the core concept should I get some credit for the concept? Meaning should a person get credit for the originality.

02/12/2015 12:09:00 AM · #14
If people copyrighted photographic concepts there wouldn't be anything left to take photos of. (Well, that might be a bit like saying there's nothing left to invent, but it sure would put some heavy restrictions on everyone.)
02/12/2015 04:56:19 AM · #15
Sorry, but the fig leaf idea is old........ VERY old........

Aside from that, is there really, truly ANYTHING left that hasn't been done before by someone, in some form?
02/12/2015 07:11:05 AM · #16
Originally posted by pgirish007:

When I started this thread the question that I had in my mind was, an idea that became an execution and that became a fine art product. Once a fine art product is ready, now we say that a fine art product can be copy righted but why not idea or concept when it was taking shape?

The reason is simple say Apple got an idea and they copy right it and then final product came out and copy right that too so that if anyone try to mimic it they get permission. Why the same cannot be applied when it comes to a concept in photography. Meaning that as soon as I have an idea I copy right it and then copy right final product too.

In photograph that I attached, I know they are different they have different item in the photograph, different angle, different perspective, env, lighting etc but when I look at the core of an image it is a person is naked and holding something to cover.

Again I am not trying to say that Derek should go and get the money (that was just to make some light weight discussion point :) ) but what I am trying to understand that if I take a shot today and few years down the road someone is using the core concept should I get some credit for the concept? Meaning should a person get credit for the originality.


You patent ideas -- Ipad, Ipod, etc. You trademark other stuff. As I mentioned before, if you could copyright ideas, the majority of books couldn't be written. Haven't you noticed the same plot lines over and over again? Once someone has the idea to take a picture of a sunset from a certain spot, no one can ever work with it again? How many pictures have you seen of the Golden Gate bridge that look pretty much the same?

Again, there's really nothing new under the sun...

Message edited by author 2015-02-12 07:11:50.
02/12/2015 09:02:09 AM · #17
Originally posted by pgirish007:



Again I am not trying to say that Derek should go and get the money (that was just to make some light weight discussion point :) ) but what I am trying to understand that if I take a shot today and few years down the road someone is using the core concept should I get some credit for the concept? Meaning should a person get credit for the originality.


you could try, but you'd have to prove you they knowingly took the concept from you and used it for their own (usually monetary gain). good luck. i think there is lawsuit right now between Pharrell Williams/Robin Thicke and the Marvin Gaye estate over whether "Blurred lines" too closely resembles one of gaye's songs.

in the case of apple and the tech giants, a lot of it is horseshit and just a way to attempt stymy their competition, see the apple/samsung fight over rounded edges on phones for example. Could you imagine McDonald's and burger king fighting over the idea to sell hamburgers and french fires or the fact that the hamburgers resemble each other to much?

02/13/2015 05:43:34 PM · #18
Just wanted to add this link to the discussion...
Photographer claims Nike's Jordan Brand ripped off his iconic image of Michael Jordan
//www.oregonlive.com/playbooks-profits/index.ssf/2015/01/photographer_claims_nikes_jord.html

I was once PMed via the site asking if a photo could be used for a book cover. The project was supposedly non profit. I couldn't tell whether that was for sure or not but even then I wasn't sure if the particular project suited my involvement but I did issue a quote from an online stock calculator to start off. The offer was declined and it was mentioned that this particular person had a friend who was a budding photographer and could try to copy my image. Not sure what happened after but if that was to be the case, I could imagine I could've had a good case to build on if that indeed happen. On another side note, I also have seen stock images which looked way too similar to my own with similar text, that were posted way after I had posted mine online. Just felt somewhat upset at myself that I had not posted them to stock first ;) Some ideas are too vague whilst others are clearly copies. Do think the patent wars between phone manufactures are nuts. Certain models of Genesis' cars have an uncanny resemblance to Mercedes'. Haven't heard of a lawsuit yet.

Message edited by author 2015-02-13 17:44:38.
02/18/2015 06:42:10 PM · #19
This article has a pretty extensive discussion about the difference between copyrighting an idea and the expression of that idea.
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