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DPChallenge Forums >> Challenge Suggestions >> Non-Ribboner Free Study
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01/26/2015 10:09:22 PM · #1
A free study, open only to users who have not finished in the top 3 of any challenge in the past.

Advanced Editing.
01/26/2015 10:44:04 PM · #2
I like the idea!
01/26/2015 11:23:37 PM · #3
Sounds like a good idea. Maybe with a concurrent FS only for those that have won a ribbon?
01/26/2015 11:29:11 PM · #4
Originally posted by markwiley:

Sounds like a good idea. Maybe with a concurrent FS only for those that have won a ribbon?


That'd work but the reasoning behind it is that I was hoping to give those photographers whose work isn't usually rewarded with high scores a chance in the limelight, without necessarily competing against those who are in tune with what the voters like.

I don't think this should take the place of a monthly free study, but I think it'd be perfect for a Tuesday night challenge (registered users).
01/27/2015 12:31:13 AM · #5
Actually, we've discussed this kind of challenge before...and had one too.

One twist I think would be great...make it a Mentors Challenge. Everyone who enters can pick a ribboning mentor to help them make decisions on their entry. Make it a learning experience.

The mentors should be given some credit in the photo comments.
01/27/2015 01:02:54 AM · #6
Originally posted by Neil:

Actually, we've discussed this kind of challenge before...and had one too.

One twist I think would be great...make it a Mentors Challenge. Everyone who enters can pick a ribboning mentor to help them make decisions on their entry. Make it a learning experience.

The mentors should be given some credit in the photo comments.

That's a fabulous idea! It'll be just as interesting to see the mentors chosen. Good twist!
01/27/2015 06:08:26 AM · #7
Bad idea! Sort of like creating a minor league.
01/27/2015 06:31:35 AM · #8
I don't know about others, but I wouldn't expect it to alter scores, just who finishes at the top. I personally don't grade on a curve, so if you got a five it's because it's what I thought the image deserved - just like the person with the ribbon that I gave an 8, 9 or 10 to.

That said, I'm not saying it's a bad idea, though I don't know that I would have appreciated my ribbon as much had it come with 1/2 the field out sick.
01/27/2015 06:47:33 AM · #9
Originally posted by hahn23:

Bad idea! Sort of like creating a minor league.

... and when DPC ran the "Masters' Free Study (I, II, III)" ... that was the Major League?

I like the idea of running both actually like 21.gif markwiley suggested.
01/27/2015 07:29:08 AM · #10
Originally posted by backdoorhippie:

I don't know about others, but I wouldn't expect it to alter scores, just who finishes at the top. I personally don't grade on a curve, so if you got a five it's because it's what I thought the image deserved - just like the person with the ribbon that I gave an 8, 9 or 10 to.

That said, I'm not saying it's a bad idea, though I don't know that I would have appreciated my ribbon as much had it come with 1/2 the field out sick.


I was thinking the same thing.

The funny thing about this idea though, is that the winners would be eliminated from competing in the next one (if there is one) because they have now won a ribbon, but in a contest with all the best competition removed.

Mind blown.

Message edited by author 2015-01-27 07:29:28.
01/27/2015 07:38:23 AM · #11
I guess we could suggest two open challenges next week with the same topic description. One might be for "ribbon winners", one for "non ribbon winners". This could be enforced by extra rules, or perhaps people could enter the ones they'd like.

Message edited by author 2015-01-27 07:38:58.
01/27/2015 08:47:14 AM · #12
Personally, not being a ribbon winner, there is a reason I have not been on the tops or even in the top 20.

When I was in the top 20 for maybe three times now, there was a reason and it was because I was on the TPL getting feedback from my teammates and doing tons of re-takes of my shot or re-editing something like 500 times(Exaggeration).

A great idea though for those who deserve to be on top, but for me as a newbie still learning, the mentor thing is faboulous!

It was those times that I had day to day feedback on a shot is when those pics thrived.

Just on my own, it is going to take more than that and a lot of experience or eye candy photos to learn to edit and take properly.

+1 for the mentor thinggy that way they still are somewhat involved somehow. Kinda set it up like a TPL for a week or two, perhaps doing this as a side challenge like TPL might work better too then do it as a team, but I also know doing something like this takes a lot of hard work, energy and time for all involved.

Just a thought

Message edited by author 2015-01-27 09:03:06.
01/27/2015 09:00:40 AM · #13
Interesting concept.
Why does it has to be a free study? We have had several of those already in January:
- The regular 01.2014 free study
- Square Crop
- Guess Your Score
- Best of 2014

01/27/2015 09:09:53 AM · #14
Originally posted by damjanev:

Interesting concept.
Why does it has to be a free study? We have had several of those already in January:
- The regular 01.2014 free study
- Square Crop
- Guess Your Score
- Best of 2014


That's a very good point. If anything it should probably be done down the road when we aren't so free-studied out.

I like the mentor challenge idea, though.
01/27/2015 09:41:52 AM · #15
Interesting concept. Especially the "mentor" part.

I have a small group of friends that help me with my photography behind the scenes. They're honest and direct (blunt). Ribbons be damned, I'd still consider them excellent mentors.

Let's not restrict it to "ribboning mentor".

01/27/2015 09:46:32 AM · #16
Originally posted by Neil:

Actually, we've discussed this kind of challenge before...and had one too.

One twist I think would be great...make it a Mentors Challenge. Everyone who enters can pick a ribboning mentor to help them make decisions on their entry. Make it a learning experience.

The mentors should be given some credit in the photo comments.


This is a great idea! We should have it. And of course it must be a FS so it can gather more participants.
01/27/2015 01:05:29 PM · #17
Suggestion: call it a mentoring challenge. Make it available to non-members. All the mentors get ribbons as participating mentors, which could be posted on your profile page as an indication that you are interested in mentoring. It would be interesting if it was also a juried challenge--& the jury was picked from the pool of mentors. That would be interesting.

I like the idea of mentoring--everyone has something to impart to someone else. I like the idea of a challenge for mentoring. But I don't like the assumption that anyone who doesn't yet have a ribbon wants one. Or even the suggestion that those who don't have a ribbon just need a little mentoring to be better photographers. Or the very idea that those with ribbons are better photographers than those without.
01/27/2015 01:26:08 PM · #18
Like the pixelated pig, I'd be cautious about assuming that all non-ribboners, if only they "had help", might become ribboners themselves, and that this is their goal. I have done extensive mentoring over the years, and some respond very well to it and others make no "progress" whatever, at least if the metric defining "progress" is scores in DPC challenges. But we all know (or I hope we do) that's not a particularly viable metric by which to judge a photographer, or at least it's only one of many. There are plenty of folks here who quietly go about pursuing their own vision, and they are to be admired.

At the same time, I'm all for a Mentoring Challenge, with entrants choosing mentors from amongst the community. It probably SHOULD be a free study-type challenge. I'd be happy to help organize it and participate in it. The Jury part, I'm not so sure about, I'm open, though. Exactly what does a jury bring to the party in this case?
01/27/2015 01:35:28 PM · #19
Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Exactly what does a jury bring to the party in this case?

What a jury brings to any rating "party" -- the chance for the "voters" to discuss the entries among themselves, often with the point of pointing out some positive feature about a picture which has been under-appreciated by the others.

In the past, how have jury results correlated with those of the voters? If they agree across the board, then there's no point in wasting time with juries. But if they don't, I think that itself answers the question.
01/27/2015 02:22:51 PM · #20
Originally posted by pixelpig:

But I don't like the assumption that anyone who doesn't yet have a ribbon wants one. Or even the suggestion that those who don't have a ribbon just need a little mentoring to be better photographers. Or the very idea that those with ribbons are better photographers than those without.


Oh, I agree with you - Just the fact that someone gets high scores or places in the top 3 doesn't make them or their photos necessarily 'better', that was not my intention to imply at all.

Of course it would be optional to participate, like every other challenge - those who didn't want to chance ruining their no-ribbon record could steer clear.

The jury idea is interesting, but I think it could be done with a different challenge; one new thing at a time maybe?
01/27/2015 02:24:10 PM · #21
A jury brings more comments, more in-depth comments, which I enjoy reading. For those getting the comments, it's a chance to find out a little bit about what the other mentors thought about your comp.

Message edited by author 2015-01-27 15:02:05.
01/27/2015 02:24:11 PM · #22
oops

Message edited by author 2015-01-27 14:24:29.
01/27/2015 02:45:23 PM · #23
How about mano e mano no mentors?
Let the people with ribbons sit one out.

Message edited by author 2015-01-27 14:45:53.
01/27/2015 03:44:56 PM · #24
If you're going to have a challenge for those currently not holding a DPC ribbon I think it should be voted by the community rather than a jury. That's how the majority of ribbons are won ... should be the same process for someone getting their first ribbon. Ribbon by fire I say!
01/27/2015 04:32:39 PM · #25
Sure! That is how TPL is done, why not the same?
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