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09/21/2004 01:21:17 PM · #1
I just finished voting on all the submissions and one thing I thought going into this challenge was whether or not there will be people trying to copy the winning shots of the first Stopped Motion challenge. Well guess what??? It happened, and I personally vote low on anything that looks as though its a copy of a previously winning photo. In fact there was so much of it going on that it was getting very irritating.

What is everyone elses opinion on this mater? Am I being too harsh?
09/21/2004 01:26:00 PM · #2
I vote on the individual photo, wether it's inspired by a previous winning photo or not. It is only natural to imitate the successful, IMHO.

June
09/21/2004 01:31:34 PM · #3
Originally posted by chiqui74:

I vote on the individual photo, wether it's inspired by a previous winning photo or not. It is only natural to imitate the successful, IMHO.

June


But don't you think some of the wow factor is gone from these photo's.
09/21/2004 01:32:06 PM · #4
Unfortunately for me that seems to be happening. I never looked at the original Stopped Motion challenge and ended up choosing a shot similar <removed>. It in no way was copied or even inspired by that challenge. It just so happens that it was the best shot I had from the time I had to shot. I was actually looking to shot a <removed> but was not successful at getting a clear shot. In any case, Iím getting hammered. Oh well, there is always the next challenge and Iím learning.

J.B.

Message edited by Konador - Please don't make references to your entry.
09/21/2004 01:33:00 PM · #5
it is the photo that matters, not where they got the inspiration. Besides, there is no way you could possibly know the photographer had ever looked at the previous challenge.

Just because an idea is not unique, does not mean it is not original.

David
09/21/2004 01:47:55 PM · #6
I'm over the WOW factor when it comes to all the drops. I know it's challenging to take a good water drop photo, but there are like 15 of them in this challenge!
So, while your trying to decide which of the 15 drop photos is best, vote on these ones also!

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/25150/thumb/99380.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/25150/thumb/99380.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/46/thumb/9482.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/46/thumb/9482.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/103/thumb/23666.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/103/thumb/23666.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/44/thumb/9029.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/44/thumb/9029.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/237/thumb/92450.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/237/thumb/92450.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/63/thumb/11865.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/63/thumb/11865.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

and these are just a FEW that I found in 2 minutes!!!

Message edited by author 2004-09-21 13:49:39.
09/21/2004 02:30:22 PM · #7
Originally posted by ericlimon:

I'm over the WOW factor when it comes to all the drops. I know it's challenging to take a good water drop photo, but there are like 15 of them in this challenge!
So, while your trying to decide which of the 15 drop photos is best, vote on these ones also!

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/25150/thumb/99380.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/25150/thumb/99380.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/46/thumb/9482.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/46/thumb/9482.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/103/thumb/23666.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/103/thumb/23666.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/44/thumb/9029.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/44/thumb/9029.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/237/thumb/92450.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/237/thumb/92450.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/63/thumb/11865.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/63/thumb/11865.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

and these are just a FEW that I found in 2 minutes!!!


Its overkill in my opinion
09/21/2004 02:36:30 PM · #8
I can guarentee you that there are more flowers on this site that water drops (including one by you ws6_ta!).

Each of the water drop photos mentioned in this thread has a different background, different colours, different shape splashes, different objects, different feel, and they are completely different photos. Saying they are all the same is just like saying all photos of people are the same.

Are these 2 photos the same?
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/51/thumb/10133.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/51/thumb/10133.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/8522/thumb/106473.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/8522/thumb/106473.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

They are just as similar, if not more similar, than all 6 water drop shots posted.

Why are you (and others) so negative about water drop shots, which both are hard to do, and unique. You will never be able to get the same shot twice, unlike with flower photos or portraits.

Message edited by author 2004-09-21 14:37:06.
09/21/2004 02:37:20 PM · #9
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/63/thumb/11865.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/63/thumb/11865.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
you cant count that one, it was part of the Clichés challenge.
09/21/2004 02:39:09 PM · #10
what about the birds?
(joking, not trying to pick on the bird shots, just think this is silly.)
Hi ben

Message edited by author 2004-09-21 14:41:01.
09/21/2004 02:58:21 PM · #11
disqualifying a picture because of the subject does a diservice to the artist and their work, whether the topic at hand is overdone or not. We all here pull from other artists as a way to learn and make our work better. Marking something lower because your TIRED of the subject, regardless of how well it's executed and how well it fits the challenge, is just wrong.

JMHO
09/21/2004 03:13:44 PM · #12
Originally posted by ws6_ta:

I just finished voting on all the submissions and one thing I thought going into this challenge was whether or not there will be people trying to copy the winning shots of the first Stopped Motion challenge. Well guess what??? It happened, and I personally vote low on anything that looks as though its a copy of a previously winning photo. In fact there was so much of it going on that it was getting very irritating.

What is everyone elses opinion on this mater? Am I being too harsh?


OK, I'm going out on a limb and I will actually disagree with someone for a change - I know, that's shocking to you guys. Yes ws6_ta, I feel you're being too harsh... it's really sad that you have become so jaded to think that any photo of a water drop or splash is worthy of a low vote simply due to the idea being a "copy." Surely you aren't naive enough to believe that (and I mean this in the most respectful way possible) outstanding master photographers like Jacko and crabappl3 (and the others whose work was shown) are the copyright or patent owners of water drop photo ideas... these kinds of shots have been done for years and will continue to be done for many more. They are cool, they are difficult to set up, and they are DAMN difficult to capture. I tried and I suck at it. I would have entered one myself if I had the skills to pull it off. To punish photographers who are trying to learn how to do something new, different, beautiful, and creative (YES, creative...even if it's been done before it still can be creative) is just asinine. I noticed that you have a bee shot and a flower shot in your portfolio...those have been done to death, so to speak, by EVERYONE. Does that make your images any less beautiful or worthy of comments or critiques? Not at all. :o)
09/21/2004 03:23:16 PM · #13
I would agree with Laurie. While it is sometimes very difficult to judge something you have seen many times over in a fresh new way, I also find myself constantly in awe of (for instance) the pure beauty to be found in a flower and other forms of nature. I have seen so many of them, yet each is still such a piece of beauty. I also know that there are many new members each week who may have never seen many examples of what can be done with photography - so don't even know they aren't "being original". And last, sometimes I can get equally tired of the constant attempt to go over the top and be "new" or "original" JUST for the sake of new. I hope as you stay here for a while, you will be able to see the give and take required to make DPC work as well as it does. I think you will enjoy it more and more.
09/21/2004 03:43:54 PM · #14
I totally agree with Laurie and Kylie here.
I think everything has been "done before" to a certain degree. By that rationale, we should all just pack it in and stop shooting because hey, someone else has already covered that subject before! :)
It's easy to become jaded when you see the same concept over and over again, but I try not to let that get in the way of judging the artistic and technical merit of any photograph.
To be marking a photograph low simply because you have seen it done before, is vindictive.

Message edited by author 2004-09-21 15:45:10.
09/21/2004 03:47:41 PM · #15
Is it just me or do some of you just get so tickled with a new shot you've taken sometimes - that first glimpse when it uploads, and only later does it sink in that "it's just another (whatever) shot"? I think many of us just so enjoy photogrpahy and "beauty" even when it is "gritty", that it hard for us folks to sometimes not enter "another whatever".
09/21/2004 03:54:56 PM · #16
OMG! Newsflash...Laurie disagrees with someone! (just teasin' ;-) )
Actually, I agree also. Much in life is imitated, inspired etc. by other things. Especially in the arts. Take music for example, todays guitarists are influenced by the likes of Eddie VanHalen, or Eric Johnson, who were influenced by Stevie Ray Vaughn, who was influenced by Muddy Waters, or Buddy Guy, etc. etc. Or painting, is any impression or abstract piece flawed because it emulates the greats that came before?

I think you have to look at the individual piece, and you'll find that people add their own little twist or flavor to it. Who knows, today someone may take a "drop" shot, or a flower shot, or a bug shot or whatever that may be one of the most awesome photos ever. Or, it could wreak of mediocrity, or it may actually suck. That is up to the artist.

The question we need to ask I feel, is was IT done well? Is IT good? Do I like IT? Judge IT by it's own merits, not the roots from whence it came.

Maybe, and I know it happens, if a certain topic/subject seems to be getting redundant, it's time to take a short break, focus on subjectivity and come back to it later.

09/21/2004 03:57:24 PM · #17
This thread makes me sick! I quit! actually /ignore
09/21/2004 04:02:07 PM · #18
Originally posted by ws6_ta:

I just finished voting on all the submissions and one thing I thought going into this challenge was whether or not there will be people trying to copy the winning shots of the first Stopped Motion challenge. Well guess what??? It happened, and I personally vote low on anything that looks as though its a copy of a previously winning photo. In fact there was so much of it going on that it was getting very irritating.

What is everyone elses opinion on this mater? Am I being too harsh?


Oh.. I my opinion you're not only being harsh, you are being totaly un-proffessional!
The thing is this: you're suppose to vote for each photograph as if it was the only one in the challenge. Right? This is coming from the way the voting goes: you can give the same vote to more then just one entry.
So how can you vote lower for someone who had copied another photo that doesn't actually exist in the same context?

Since ericlimon has already given us the water example, let me show you another very obvoius example to the matter:
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/234/thumb/90452.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/234/thumb/90452.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' by Heida, vs. ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/248/thumb/99257.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/248/thumb/99257.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' by Siggi

Don't you think they look very much alike? But can you really even start to compare them?
Each one has it's own genious qualities!
Each one (at least in my opinion) is absolutely perfect for it's own !
Would you vote lowere for one, after seing the other just cause one was inspired by the other?
If you would, I think you would do wrong to both just as well...

Message edited by author 2004-09-21 16:03:46.
09/21/2004 04:05:50 PM · #19
While I am the first to admit tht I get "sick" of seeing certain things repeated, in a way, it also takes a lot of condfidence. Like this example from Jinjit -- Siggi had to believe in his version enough to know what a wonderful image he would be "competing" with in peoples' minds (this is assuming he did that knowlingly.
09/21/2004 04:13:12 PM · #20
Originally posted by Kylie:

While I am the first to admit tht I get "sick" of seeing certain things repeated, in a way, it also takes a lot of condfidence. Like this example from Jinjit -- Siggi had to believe in his version enough to know what a wonderful image he would be "competing" with in peoples' minds (this is assuming he did that knowlingly.


He said Heida was his inspiration on this take, so I guess this means "knowingly" :-)
Anyway, I find it as a perfect way to learn! the thing is not to "copy kat". Is just "to be inspired by".
And I think the sooner people would get that, the more they will be able to learn.

Unless... of course... they know it all by now... ;-)

Please don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to hint anything personally about anybody! I just believe that some of you just don't do justice with those wonderful shots of motion stopped 2


09/21/2004 05:18:29 PM · #21
Compare this shot: ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/256/thumb/103484.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/256/thumb/103484.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' with this shot ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/163/thumb/52988.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/163/thumb/52988.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
Don't you think they look the same?

I wanted to leave a comment on the first one after I voted on it.
Liked the "Original" by Kiwiness better, but didn't

Now compare the photographers of these 2 photo's....

Understand what I am trying to say?

Don't vote low because you have seen them before, vote on the quality of the photo!
09/21/2004 05:22:25 PM · #22
Originally posted by Philos31:

Compare this shot: ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/256/thumb/103484.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/256/thumb/103484.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' with this shot ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/163/thumb/52988.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/163/thumb/52988.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
Don't you think they look the same?

I wanted to leave a comment on the first one after I voted on it.
Liked the "Original" by Kiwiness better, but didn't

Now compare the photographers of these 2 photo's....

Understand what I am trying to say?

Don't vote low because you have seen them before, vote on the quality of the photo!


A couple months ago a photographer here conducted his own "experiment" and entered challenges with versions of his own ribbon winner and watched the voting reactions. It was quite interesting. Maybe someone else can confirm for me - I think it was Konador. I know that people also use similar shots of their own for two challenges going on at a time.
09/21/2004 05:49:46 PM · #23
Originally posted by Kylie:



A couple months ago a photographer here conducted his own "experiment" and entered challenges with versions of his own ribbon winner and watched the voting reactions. It was quite interesting. Maybe someone else can confirm for me - I think it was Konador. I know that people also use similar shots of their own for two challenges going on at a time.


Yeah, that was Ben:
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/152/thumb/43950.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/152/thumb/43950.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' and ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/219/thumb/77936.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/219/thumb/77936.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
But this was not a literal reproduction, more like a variation on a theme. You could argue that this is also the case with the various waterdrop shots, but in Ben's case, the actual technique of creating the picture was different because of the multiple light sources. To me, that's of a different order then changing the background in a waterdrop shot. I do think, however, that a well-executed waterdrop shots deserves a high score, although I have to admit the WOW-factor is significantly diminished compared to the first time I saw such a shot.

Message edited by author 2004-09-21 17:51:48.
09/21/2004 05:51:38 PM · #24
Originally posted by nicoledb:

Originally posted by Kylie:



A couple months ago a photographer here conducted his own "experiment" and entered challenges with versions of his own ribbon winner and watched the voting reactions. It was quite interesting. Maybe someone else can confirm for me - I think it was Konador. I know that people also use similar shots of their own for two challenges going on at a time.


Yeah, that was Ben:
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/152/thumb/43950.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/152/thumb/43950.jpg', '/') + 1) . ' and ' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/219/thumb/77936.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/219/thumb/77936.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
But this was not a literal reproduction, more like a variation on a theme. You could argue that this is also the case with the various waterdrop shots, but in Ben's case, the actual technique of creating the picture was different because of the multiple light sources.


Yes, that first shot was it. But I am pretty sure he actually "re-did" it and commented later about the experience. Or maybe I am just crazy!
09/21/2004 05:53:29 PM · #25
You mean this:

//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.php?action=read&FORUM_THREAD_ID=96631
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