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01/17/2014 08:49:41 AM · #1
Hello all! I am new and have been going through the forums trying to educate myself to DPC. My first problem I am having is scoring. I want to give everyone a 10 and can't possibly see a reason to give a 1,2,3,4 to anyone for any reason. I don't vote. So what I am hoping for is a Forum Post on voting or tutorial that may help me in knowing features to look for. Maybe some good books on Photography appreciation? I don't know and I deffer to you the DPC Genius Squad for advice.

Thank you for your time and I have enjoyed my short time here so far!
01/17/2014 09:01:04 AM · #2
Courtesy of 21_F.gif LoVi

1 = WTF am I looking at?
2 = I think my unlocked cell-phone in my pocket took a picture like this once
3 = DNMC clearly (rare)
4 = snapshot
5 = meh, meets challenge but no more than that.
6 = somewhat interesting
7 = hey, this is pretty cool
8 = very nice
9 = my goodness, this is wonderful
10 = I'm drooling at the screen and trying not to blink.
01/17/2014 09:35:57 AM · #3
Originally posted by FocusPoint:

Courtesy of 21_F.gif LoVi

1 = WTF am I looking at?
2 = I think my unlocked cell-phone in my pocket took a picture like this once
3 = DNMC clearly (rare)
4 = snapshot
5 = meh, meets challenge but no more than that.
6 = somewhat interesting
7 = hey, this is pretty cool
8 = very nice
9 = my goodness, this is wonderful
10 = I'm drooling at the screen and trying not to blink.


Nailed it I think.
01/17/2014 09:47:03 AM · #4
Hiya Rick!

There's a couple old "tutorials" and other threads hanging around on the site if you dig deep enough. Here's a few places to start.

3 Steps for Voting on Artistic Photographs
"how to vote" site:dpchallenge.com - Google results

And a couple other "newbie" guides.
mk's unofficial frequently answered questions for DPC
Commenting For Beginners (A Non-Analytical Approach)
9 Guidelines for Giving and Receiving Feedback
01/17/2014 10:22:52 AM · #5
Scoring is not science, just vote with your feeling. If they all seem like a 10, then give them a 7-10. Everyone likes the appreciation given by a high score. Just have some variation.
01/17/2014 10:34:54 AM · #6
Originally posted by FocusPoint:

Courtesy of 21_F.gif LoVi

1 = WTF am I looking at?
2 = I think my unlocked cell-phone in my pocket took a picture like this once
3 = DNMC clearly (rare)
4 = snapshot
5 = meh, meets challenge but no more than that.
6 = somewhat interesting
7 = hey, this is pretty cool
8 = very nice
9 = my goodness, this is wonderful
10 = I'm drooling at the screen and trying not to blink.


+1, That's probably the best way of summing it up that I've seen yet.
01/18/2014 01:42:52 AM · #7
Originally posted by Urho:

Scoring is not science, just vote with your feeling. If they all seem like a 10, then give them a 7-10. Everyone likes the appreciation given by a high score. Just have some variation.


This is the best answer so far :)

Don't worry about a calculated process of assigning a number score to a photograph.

Does the photo stir your senses? Capture your imagination? Inspire you? Make you want to look at it longer? If any of those are true, I'd start with a 6 and then go up from there based on how strongly the photo moves you. Let me break down a scale someone else posted here earlier:

1 - WTF am I looking at?

THAT photo will require some thought on your part. It's worth a second look. It might just be a gem that is just below the surface and will take a moment longer to sink in. It also could be crap, but give it a chance.

2 - I think my unlocked cell-phone in my pocket took a picture like this once

Maybe it did. That still doesn't rule it out as a viable piece of artwork. Try to understand what the photographer is trying to show you.

3 - DNMC clearly (rare)

In my humble opinion, why would this get a 3 instead of a 1? Meeting the challenge should hold more weight than that.

4 - snapshot

SNAPSHOT says more about the viewer than the photographer who made it.

5 - meh, meets the challenge but no more than that.

Fair enough on this one. The challenge was met but the photographer did not appeal to the senses of the viewer.

6 - somewhat interesting

7 - hey, this is pretty cool

8 - very nice

These three mean about the same thing to me. These mean that my attention was captured to some degree but I'm left looking for something extraordinary.

9 - my goodness this is wonderful

10 - I'm drooling at the screen and trying not to blink

These two mean about the same thing to me also. I was motivated and inspired by the photo at a level that exceeded visual appeal.

The best things you can do when voting in a challenge:

Be consistent throughout the entries. Apply the same voting method to each and every photo. Break your voting up into small segments. Give each photo in the challenge a fair chance by viewing it for at least 30 seconds. Try to understand the photo. Don't vote with picking the winner in mind. Vote each photo as if it is the only photo in the challenge.

Photographers are traditionally the WORST critics of photography. When 'we' look at photos, we are automatically biased towards our own tendancies, environments, attitudes, and heck... just about every other aspect of life that plays a role in our work. The best reviews of photography come from critics who are not artists in their own rite. IF you can find a way to stand in the shoes of that non-attached person when judging photos, YOU will not only become a better critic, but a better photographer at the same time :)
01/18/2014 02:08:26 AM · #8
Whoa... it's John! I had to check the date on the thread even though I already posted in it. Howdy do!

Message edited by author 2014-01-18 02:08:50.
01/18/2014 11:18:53 PM · #9
Just passing by... :)
01/19/2014 12:02:38 AM · #10
Originally posted by jmsetzler:

Just passing by... :)


I think you mean gas.....
01/19/2014 12:15:50 AM · #11
Just vote however you see fit. If you take the time to search through the forums, you will find philosophies and sciences behind it. Seriously, there's some pretty elaborate graps, charts, and tables on this topic alnoe, one of the many reasons I have always enjoyed DPC.

BTW Good to see ya John! It's nice to see a few people coming out of the woodworks lately. :)
01/19/2014 12:42:57 AM · #12
John! Great to see you!
01/19/2014 01:41:51 AM · #13
Welcome, Rick!

Hi, John!
01/19/2014 01:51:20 AM · #14
Hmmmm, Now I understand Dpchallenge scoring system after UK scoring system!

-------------------UK----- Us

First Class ----7.0-10.0 A

Upper ----------6.4-6.9 A-

second Class ---6.0-6.3 B+

Lower ----------5.5-5.9 B

second Class ---5.0-5.4 B-

Third Class---46-49 C+

Third Class -- 43-45 C

Third class ----38-42 C-

Third Class ----35-37 D

Fourth Class ----0-34 F
01/29/2014 12:36:22 PM · #15
My buddy talked me into entering some challenges here and I enjoy the heck out of seeing the work and hopefully gain some honest critique and comments. I enjoy the site and that it gets my mind moving.

I cannot understand the voting that goes on here. Take the last challenge Album cover. HOW can the top nine out of ten get 1's? Do people really vote others down to raise their score?

For me -

3 DNMC - (careful of interpretation here)
4 Meh/snapshot/no thought/ phoned it in
5 I can see what they went for,needs better execution
6 Executed, but seeing some issues
7 Other than minor nits I like it!
8 I wished that I took the shot
9 I would put this on my wall
10 Wholly crap,where's their website

It turns out that I give a lot of 4's, perhaps because it's the lowest I usually vote.

01/29/2014 01:12:48 PM · #16
don't try to understand the 1's, trolls still exist.

everyone once and a while a thread pops up trying to get them to show their face or figure out who they are
01/29/2014 01:51:57 PM · #17
There are as many "ways" to vote as there are members, Ken. Don't stress about it. The guides others have outlined here are the most generally accepted interpretations of the scoring system. Proceed as you see fit.
01/29/2014 02:02:21 PM · #18
just vote however you want, don't ever feel the need to justify.
01/29/2014 04:03:53 PM · #19
Originally posted by Ken950:



I cannot understand the voting that goes on here. Take the last challenge Album cover. HOW can the top nine out of ten get 1's? Do people really vote others down to raise their score?

For me -

3 DNMC - (careful of interpretation here)
4 Meh/snapshot/no thought/ phoned it in
5 I can see what they went for,needs better execution
6 Executed, but seeing some issues
7 Other than minor nits I like it!
8 I wished that I took the shot
9 I would put this on my wall
10 Wholly crap,where's their website

It turns out that I give a lot of 4's, perhaps because it's the lowest I usually vote.


The operative is bolded.
You are not everybody. There are other opinions and other ways to look at things. To presume that everybody's vote should be inline with yours is not only silly but it's also self centered. Assuming, outright, that anything contrary to your own thoughts is done maliciously is also missing the point of having many voters.
Like Mike and others have said, vote how you want, and let others do the same.
01/29/2014 06:41:12 PM · #20
Originally posted by spiritualspatula:

[quote=Ken950]

The operative is bolded.
You are not everybody. There are other opinions and other ways to look at things. To presume that everybody's vote should be inline with yours is not only silly but it's also self centered. Assuming, outright, that anything contrary to your own thoughts is done maliciously is also missing the point of having many voters.
Like Mike and others have said, vote how you want, and let others do the same.


Where did I presume that everyone's vote should aline with mine? I think that's where I stated FOR ME, which clearly you saw. I would love to hear any explanation of why those images were given a one. Perhaps it would help me understand and become less self centered.

Mike\Tanquera - thank you. Not stressing, just don't understand.


Message edited by author 2014-01-29 18:42:19.
01/29/2014 10:35:13 PM · #21
Originally posted by Ken950:

Originally posted by spiritualspatula:

[quote=Ken950]

The operative is bolded.
You are not everybody. There are other opinions and other ways to look at things. To presume that everybody's vote should be inline with yours is not only silly but it's also self centered. Assuming, outright, that anything contrary to your own thoughts is done maliciously is also missing the point of having many voters.
Like Mike and others have said, vote how you want, and let others do the same.


Where did I presume that everyone's vote should aline with mine? I think that's where I stated FOR ME, which clearly you saw. I would love to hear any explanation of why those images were given a one. Perhaps it would help me understand and become less self centered.

Mike\Tanquera - thank you. Not stressing, just don't understand.


I didn't intend for it to seem as an attack on you, honestly, and I apologize for coming off as flippant.
To clarify and to explain;
These conversations happen all the time, and usually I'm more restrained, and for that, I apologize for not explaining things a bit more fairly. The idea that one vote is wrong or right is extremely contrary to the idea of voting in the first place. If we all felt the same there would be no point in voting (after all, we'd all agree on the winner and thus voting would be a pointless exercise). The fact of the matter is that we all appreciate different things, that we have all had different experiences, that all the things that constitute our concept of beauty and our resonance with a specific photo vary so immensely that there's absolutely no grounds to expect a consensus. Even ignoring general statistics, to presume that one's concept of art, or beauty, or quality (in this sense) is the same as all users is a venture that will leave you hopelessly frustrated. To specifically point out where you noted that everybody's vote should be like your own- it was when you expressed frustration at the fact that there was differentiation in how people voted in comparison to your own and said "I cannot understand the voting that goes on here." You openly stated that it was literally beyond your comprehension that somebody could disagree in such a fashion.

The fact of the matter is that you will never agree with all voters (and, again, thankfully so, as divergence is good here). Everybody's vote is just as valid. Don't fall into the "damn trolls" etc mantra because it's dismissive and frankly insulting to a great number of voters. We all disagree on things. Some prefer technical perfection, some "soul," some abstraction. You're welcome to attempt to quantify one above the other but you'll find failure in that exercise, that much I can guarantee. Being dismissive of one vote is being dismissive of all votes. It robs the voter of the legitimacy of their own vote, and that is why I always defend it. All votes are legitimate, regardless of if they can articulate it, whether you understand it, or whether you even accept it. Their judgement is still valid.

So, my voting advice is to vote how you want, and to do it with full justification that your judgement is your judgement and needn't have any further qualifiers or justification to stand on its own. Vote on what resonates with you, what you appreciate. I don't care what it is, really I don't, just so long as you don't tell me (or others) how we should or shouldn't do something, because we aren't you, we've all had different experiences and different things that move us, so we all have very different appreciations.
01/30/2014 12:01:08 AM · #22
spiritualspatula-

It's all good, and I do understand your points, and quite frankly being a newcomer perhaps I should have chose some different wording in my post, or not said anything at all. Really no need to apologize. I also apologize that I didn't know how many times these discussions have come up, and shame on me for not searching. Heck, I hope to get to a level where my work isn't understood by all.

The fact is that all of those images showed creativity, effort, and talent. Even if I didn't get it, or it wasn't my taste, I can't imagine giving a one to any of those images. Now as you state, I shouldn't dismiss these voters (I didn't use "trolls") however I think that a one vote dismisses the effort. That, at minimum, should be recognized. I would hope that they would at least leave a comment, perhaps then we would know why and folks like myself wouldn't be left here to wonder.

Thanks


01/30/2014 07:09:13 AM · #23
Originally posted by Ken950:



The fact is that all of those images showed creativity, effort, and talent. Even if I didn't get it, or it wasn't my taste, I can't imagine giving a one to any of those images. Now as you state, I shouldn't dismiss these voters (I didn't use "trolls") however I think that a one vote dismisses the effort. That, at minimum, should be recognized. I would hope that they would at least leave a comment, perhaps then we would know why and folks like myself wouldn't be left here to wonder.

Thanks


take a look at some of the lower scoring entries and you will see 10's mixed in with lots of 1's. It goes both ways.

Like Derek said, everyone is moved by something or not.

01/30/2014 07:36:44 AM · #24
I vote 1's when I'm pissed off. Or just pissed, sometimes.
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