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01/23/2003 03:30:34 PM · #76
Once again, the point missed. *sigh*
Please reread the thread before adding to it so that you understand the gist of it.
I/We are not whining. I/We are also not whining about low ending/total/averaged scores. I/We are discussing the unfortunate low individual votes given to otherwise good/great/exceptional photos, and wondered about the reason behind it, and felt it was more than "difference of opinion", "subjectivity", or "conformity".
*sigh again*
Whatever.
01/23/2003 03:31:30 PM · #77
what a shame this thread can't just be moved to "rants"...
01/23/2003 03:33:03 PM · #78
i think lisae is saying that most of the pics that win, she would give a 1 to?

because she is not conforming?

is that accurate?


01/23/2003 03:33:49 PM · #79
What a shame everyone is taking it as a rant. It was supposed to be a discussion.
I am done for real now.
goodbye.
01/23/2003 03:36:42 PM · #80
Originally posted by magnetic9999:

i think lisae is saying that most of the pics that win, she would give a 1 to?

because she is not conforming?

is that accurate?


Um?

It's 4:30am here, and I should be asleep, but I just caught this before logging off. Mag, are you serious? I think I gave out a 1 in maybe the 2nd challenge I scored, but not since then. My average score given is nearly 7!

I was pointing out that I score freakishly high, and give out 10s to lots of photos that don't rank very well, which is the way in which I'm non-conformist here. I was trying to say that I'm kind of the opposite of the freak low scorers, but I'm like them in that I'm just a bit different.
01/23/2003 03:40:38 PM · #81
lol. ok. i wasnt sure where this was going.

:-D


01/23/2003 03:57:32 PM · #82
Originally posted by Karen Bryan:

We are discussing the unfortunate low individual votes given to otherwise good/great/exceptional photos, and wondered about the reason behind it, and felt it was more than "difference of opinion", "subjectivity", or "conformity".
*sigh again*
Whatever.


i personally see it as the "difference of opinion" - at least that's how i choose to see it --- i trust the DPC sniffers that detect nefarious voting patterns to do their job; and if there's what appears to be "skewed" voting, then there was nothing malicious intended

bottom line = i would hate to see DPC get a rep for tossing people out because somebody complained about getting a low vote --- that's when i'd look elsewhere
01/23/2003 04:42:10 PM · #83
Originally posted by lisae:

Everyone has their own sense of what the voting scale means. The system is in place to average out all the various interpretations and tell us who was most popular. And it works! That's exactly the information we get, even with those few people who disagree entirely with the majority.


Lisae, could not agree with you more. Everyone will have their own take on how to score. Just like the bell curves of our scoring, our individual voting styles will also adhere to a bell curve. Most will vote in a similar fashion, some will vote like Lisae and the trolls. Hey, thats life. Let's not regulate too much how this should all work. It is suposed to be fun, after all. If you want to give my impeccable piece of art a 1 just because you dont agree with my political stament, or you just plain out dont like the sugject in my photo, well then go for it. If you want to give it a 10 just 'cause, and you're not even sure why, be my guest. Even if I never finish in the top 10, I will still sleep at night, and still come back here the next morning.

Karen, love your photos. Followed this thread closely. Have to say, I think you're taking this a bit personally. I think this has been a discussion with limited ranting. At least, it has followed the same pattern of the many many discussions about this topic which have preceded this dialogue. We're all just talkin.

As someone else mentioned, if you look at where all the photo's fall at the end of the day, generally speaking the best ar at or near the top, the worst are near the bottom. And I guarantee every single week each of us has at least one photo where they say "Wow, I cant believe that didn't do better" And "Wow, how in the hell did THAT one do so good!?!" So what. Mark the ones you really like as a favorite, and move on.

Ahhh, democracy....
01/23/2003 04:46:24 PM · #84
Originally posted by Moondoggie:

Originally posted by lisae:

Everyone has their own sense of what the voting scale means. The system is in place to average out all the various interpretations and tell us who was most popular. And it works! That's exactly the information we get, even with those few people who disagree entirely with the majority.


Lisae, could not agree with you more. Everyone will have their own take on how to score. Just like the bell curves of our scoring, our individual voting styles will also adhere to a bell curve. Most will vote in a similar fashion, some will vote like Lisae and the trolls. Hey, thats life.


Was it intentional to put Lisae and the trolls in the same breath? Lisae is farthest from being a troll as is possible. Lisae appreciates art, and the attempts for people to be more artistic. She has often told me what the meaning of a photograph is when I can't see it.
I dunno... if you didn't mean it that way though, I forgive you.
01/23/2003 04:47:33 PM · #85
Originally posted by Karen Bryan:

Once again, the point missed. *sigh*
Please reread the thread before adding to it so that you understand the gist of it.
I/We are not whining. I/We are also not whining about low ending/total/averaged scores. I/We are discussing the unfortunate low individual votes given to otherwise good/great/exceptional photos, and wondered about the reason behind it, and felt it was more than "difference of opinion", "subjectivity", or "conformity".
*sigh again*
Whatever.

Karen, not everyone reading this has missed your point.
The only real "answer" would be if people who gave a vote of 1 gave a detailed explanation of their rationale, but they don't seem to be volunteering, and it can't be coerced.
01/23/2003 04:49:56 PM · #86
When I started this thread I had no idea it would turn into four pages worth of sometimes funny.....
(General, you made me crease up this morning with your "Go back to sleep, Mark, it's all just a bad dream" comment. That was so funny! And Bamaster's coffee gag made me chuckle too)

Sometimes nasty.....
(Martin, you don't really hate photographers, do you? Or is it just me that should be watching my back? LOL)

.....But always differing opinions, so so many different opinions and ideas. I agree with whoever said that these low scorers are not really affecting the votes as such, so lets just let it lie and get on with it, but the point I was trying to put across was that unless a picture is so blurred you can't see it, or so black you can't make out what the picture is of, a 1 or 2 vote is a bit of a kick in the balls for the photographer.

Above all, let's all try and get on. Christ, there's enough shit going on with the world at the moment without bring a scaled down version of world war 3 to DPC.

One final thought (this could create another 4 pages): What's with the "dog" picture someones posted in this weeks roadsign challenge?
01/23/2003 04:51:22 PM · #87
Originally posted by Annida:


Was it intentional to put Lisae and the trolls in the same breath? Lisae is farthest from being a troll as is possible. Lisae appreciates art, and the attempts for people to be more artistic. She has often told me what the meaning of a photograph is when I can't see it.
I dunno... if you didn't mean it that way though, I forgive you.

I took it to be, as she described it, that she has a similar (but opposite) effect on the voting.
LisaE & the Trolls might work as a band name though...
01/23/2003 04:57:53 PM · #88
Originally posted by Marklane:

...but the point I was trying to put across was that unless a picture is so blurred you can't see it, or so black you can't make out what the picture is of, a 1 or 2 vote is a bit of a kick in the balls for the photographer.

This photo finished 120/127 with a score of about 3.6.
01/23/2003 04:59:58 PM · #89
..........(speechless). Perhaps this IS all just a bad dream.

Message edited by author 2003-01-23 17:01:53.
01/23/2003 05:09:21 PM · #90
Originally posted by GeneralE:

This photo finished 120/127 with a score of about 3.6.


... and got 17 votes for "10"

Message edited by author 2003-01-23 17:11:12.
01/23/2003 05:21:07 PM · #91
I gave it a 7 -- it's about as creative and accurate a way to photograph that particular superstition as I can think of, I just thought maybe it was a bit oversharpened...
Hmm...maybe I'll try a variation on that one now that it's come up...
01/23/2003 05:27:51 PM · #92
[quote=Annida]
Was it intentional to put Lisae and the trolls in the same breath? quote]

No no, I meant Lisea at one ond of the spectrum, trolls at another, but as she pointed out they are all outside the "little bunch" in the middle. And thats just fine. Angels and Trolls... And the rest of us in between.

Message edited by author 2003-01-23 17:30:39.
01/23/2003 05:30:52 PM · #93
Originally posted by Marklane:

What's with the "dog" picture someones posted in this weeks roadsign challenge?


from the title, i'd say it was mistakenly entered in the SIGNS - a "puppy nose" belongs in the GOT MILK challenge :)
01/23/2003 05:32:02 PM · #94
Originally posted by spiderman:

Originally posted by GeneralE:

This photo finished 120/127 with a score of about 3.6.


... and got 17 votes for "10"


And two favorites. Uhhh, make that three. ;?)
01/23/2003 05:33:58 PM · #95
Once again, I bet this all would be a moot point if everyone knew how everyone else voted.

I haven't really seen anyone address this point yet other than maybe Karen and John.
01/23/2003 05:46:07 PM · #96
Originally posted by hokie:

Once again, I bet this all would be a moot point if everyone knew how everyone else voted.

I haven't really seen anyone address this point yet other than maybe Karen and John.


But for me, and I know I speak only for myself, I dont really care. Sure, I'd wouldn't mind knowing why somone would give <sarcasm> such unearthly beautiful photographic art as mine</> a mere 1 or 2, but again, it's not that big of a deal. As Marklane said, so many other more important things to worry about in the world today. But then I guess it's a little hypocritical for me to say it's not important, and yet this is something like my 5th post to this thread. Actually though, this whole discussion is an enjoyable diversion from petty little people pestering me at work with their annoying little issues and questions. Sometimes it's fun just to kibitz a little about trivial things in life, whilst ignoring the more important things. Like work. And war.

Message edited by author 2003-01-23 17:46:47.
01/23/2003 05:50:07 PM · #97
Originally posted by hokie:

Once again, I bet this all would be a moot point if everyone knew how everyone else voted.

I haven't really seen anyone address this point yet other than maybe Karen and John.

Freedom to dissent is meaningless if it can't be exercised with security from harrasment and persecution. The secret ballot is a time-honored American tradition, and I think it's a reasonable measure here. Maybe if we were wanting to start a war or something I'd want a show of hands, but I think people have the right to vote on these photos in private.

Your point is that you want to know whether to give weight to that 1 based on what you know about the voter. For me, the voter will just have to consider that I must assume them uninformed, unesthetic, or having a REALLY bad day, just by virtue of their vote. I don't give those 1s ANY weight unless someone wants to take the time to explain it to me.

Message edited by author 2003-01-23 17:52:06.
01/23/2003 05:51:46 PM · #98
Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by hokie:

Once again, I bet this all would be a moot point if everyone knew how everyone else voted.

I haven't really seen anyone address this point yet other than maybe Karen and John.

Freedom to dissent is meaningless if it can't be exercised with security from harrasment and persecution. The secret ballot is a time-honored American tradition, and I think it's a reasonable measure here. Maybe if we were wanting to start a war or something I'd want a show of hands, but I think people have the right to vote on these photos in private.

Your point is that you want to know whether to give weight to that 1 based on what you know about the voter. For me, the voter will just have to consider that I must assume them uninformed, unesthetic, or having a REALLY bad day, just by virtue of their vote.


The secret ballot was greek!!! (that's how democracy started :))
01/23/2003 05:53:21 PM · #99
Originally posted by Annida:


The secret ballot was greek!!! (that's how democracy started :))

Now you're going to get all picky about 3000 years!
01/23/2003 05:58:12 PM · #100
Well...I think assumptions of harrassment if we knew who voted what is the weakest argument.

I highly doubt that Drew, Langdon or any other member of the site council would tolerate one member harrassing another over their vote.

Whay may be more plausible is that someone might feel the publics eyes upon them and their opinions and that makes them uncomfortable enough not speak their mind or vote as they feel whimmed..I mean inclined to :-). But then I don't suffer from fear of scrutiny or ..really of any interaction so I can't relate :-/

Message edited by author 2003-01-23 17:59:34.
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