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DPChallenge Forums >> Business of Photography >> How to negotiate a usage/advertising request
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02/28/2013 01:29:55 PM · #1
Hi all,
I'd like to pick your brains and experience if I may.

I have been approached by a very large lens and camera manufacturer who wish to use my images for a national advertising campaign. The meeting is next week.
So far they wish to use my wildlife images inside brick and mortar shops on their AV advertising, LCD's and foto-frames. The estimated number of local "resellers" of the brand is in the region of 4500.
So far they will accredit each image used with my name and web address as per my watermark. No doubt they will add their logo to the image too. There is no talk of financial compensation at this stage. Of course the exposure is great but I can't eat or wear exposure. I have never gained any paying business from cross linking, web links, referrals, exposure, free advertising etc. I would like to pitch some form of payment for my work.

How would you approach them? How did you approach a similar client? How long was the agreement for? Did you sign paperwork? Did you involve a lawyer? Can you help me with a worded document/memorandum or paste a URL resource please?

Thank you for your time! Harvey.
02/28/2013 01:33:35 PM · #2
First, congratulations, that's fantastic. I would ask Skip, as he is an incredible resource here.

ETA, advertising campaigns all have budgets. They must have an amount set aside for it. I'd find out what that budget is and price your imagery accordingly. This would likely be a licensing situation, so you would have to determine what uses specifically they will use the images for, and for how long.

Message edited by author 2013-02-28 13:34:52.
02/28/2013 01:40:52 PM · #3
' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', '/') + 1) . ' Skip will probably check in, but he often refers people to this Stock Price Calculator as a first step ... my guess is that a non-exclusive license should be in the high hundreds or even thousands, and exclusive license should probably be ten times as much.

Make sure that your (written) agreement specifies that it is a license (not "sale") and that you retain the copyright, and that it lists the exact usages and time limits.
02/28/2013 07:14:36 PM · #4
Originally posted by GeneralE:

' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/21.gif', '/') + 1) . ' Skip will probably check in, but he often refers people to this Stock Price Calculator as a first step

not this time, paul ;-)

first, congrats! it's awesome just to be considered for something like this. and, as you know, you're not the first one they've used. in this case, i'd track down some of the other photographers they've used and get feedback/guidance from them. some companies are mickey mouse about this and are ready to pass on to the next image as soon as someone requests compensation. i say screw them. other companies completely understand the business and treat all parties fairly. hopefully, this company is one of the latter and not the former.

my gut tells me this should be in the 10-20k range, maybe more. i know apple pays close to $5k, just to license images to include in their wallpaper package...looking at the usage described here, and thinking about how costly it is to roll out all those printed items, i can't imagine them needing it for less than a couple years exclusively.

good luck!
03/01/2013 08:52:10 AM · #5
Thanks so far!

Johanna, agreed, my thoughts too, just not sure how to ask them. Will have to word it carefully.

GeneralE, I've been using that one for some time and there is a similar one by the PPSA in my neck of the woods. I'm not sure that it is pitched right however for this type of exposure.

Skip, thanks for that. I've dropped mails to those Pro's already being used by them that I can track down. Hope to get a response before Tuesday next week! 10-20k? in US Dollars? That would depend on whether I can get an answer out of them re budget...I have read many of your other posts regarding licensing and will continue to apply your lessons learned. I need this work and exposure but also need some $$$ for the years of hard work and gear.

Keep those ideas coming please!
03/01/2013 09:04:29 AM · #6
Wow, this is awesome, congrats! How did they find your photos?

IMO, this is up there with National Geographic, validation-wise.
03/01/2013 09:18:39 AM · #7
Originally posted by Strikeslip:

Wow, this is awesome, congrats! How did they find your photos?
IMO, this is up there with National Geographic, validation-wise.


Thanks Slippy, hard work and more hard work, and then a little more hard work on my wildlife and constant posting on my website and social media since 2009. I sent the local authorised distributor a request to source (order) a lens hood for a client who had lost his as none of the shops had one in stock. They must have clicked the link in my signature and liked what they saw on my website. The discussion moved to product evangelism and marketing from their side. I am rather nervous!
03/01/2013 01:40:27 PM · #8
Sorry Harvey, no advice from me but I'm holding thumbs and wishing you all the best!
Good luck
03/01/2013 02:27:50 PM · #9
Originally posted by HarveyG:

Originally posted by Strikeslip:

Wow, this is awesome, congrats! How did they find your photos?
IMO, this is up there with National Geographic, validation-wise.

Thanks Slippy, hard work and more hard work, and then a little more hard work on my wildlife and constant posting on my website and social media since 2009. I sent the local authorised distributor a request to source (order) a lens hood for a client who had lost his as none of the shops had one in stock. They must have clicked the link in my signature and liked what they saw on my website. The discussion moved to product evangelism and marketing from their side. I am rather nervous!

Sweet, well done!
03/06/2013 12:50:32 PM · #10
So the next saga is the Marketing manager was off sick and the meeting was cancelled 60 minutes prior the meeting time. Aaaaaargh. Good thing I read my email 2 minutes before I hopped in the car...postponed same time next week.

On a positive note I am receiving 2 Professional lenses from them tomorrow to play with for 2 weeks. I will write reviews on the lenses. One is an f/1.4 and the other is an f/2.8 :)

Message edited by author 2013-03-06 13:40:27.
03/13/2013 02:10:31 PM · #11
So had the meeting with the brand manager and it was very positive. They are asking me to do workshops and lectures for the brand and trade shows as well as in the field with tours and groups... theres more but I'll save it for another day. As far as payment is concerned there’s income from tours and workshops and direct leads when clients are looking for a wildlife photographer. I'll keep you posted.

Thanks for all your encouragement and help.

H
03/13/2013 11:40:47 PM · #12
sounds like all those long, lonely hours are gonna pay off...WAY COOL!!!
03/25/2013 10:05:52 AM · #13
Next meeting tomorrow morning. This one to start planning workshops, trade fairs and so on. They have about 40 images so far that will be used for the national ad campaign.
03/25/2013 10:58:47 AM · #14
Holding thumbs Harvey. Keep up the good work and I hope it pays off for you down the line!
03/25/2013 12:27:18 PM · #15
What a great break! Go Harvey!
03/25/2013 07:21:07 PM · #16
And to think....I knew Harvey when he was just a little pup, getting wet shooting birds out in the bush, and dealing with African power outages. Now he's a big shot touring the world, taking pictures of tow hooks, with his own groupies and booth babes.
03/25/2013 08:16:09 PM · #17
Dang! Another DPCer going big-time!
Seriously, congratulations on having your hard work and wonderful photography recognized
both with appreciation and with currency of the realm.
THANKS for the postings and updates.
I can hardly wait for the next one.
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