| Author | Thread |
|
|
12/04/2012 08:35:11 PM · #26 |
How do I push myself?
This stupid place!!!
I went and shot something I wouldn't normally shoot, for a challenge I don't even particularly understand. I'm pushing the limits of my editing skills on a shot that desperately needs saving, because if I shoot for a challenge, I enter the thing, whether the shot sucks or not. So I'm trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. I'm tired, my head hurts, and I need a break so I'm here answer this question!!!
Seriously though... That's pretty much how it is. About 3 years ago, I found that I had been shooting pretty much the same thing for quite a long time -- and was getting pretty good -- at those few things that I'd been shooting. But I wanted to challenge myself. So I started creating a list of things to shoot. Then I figured someone must have already created a list, so I went on the net, searched for photo and challenge and here I am.
The push is shooting for each challenge -- especially the ones for which I have absolutely no interest whatsoever. It's easy to do the ones that interest you. It's ones like today where you really learn. I shot for the challenge. My shots had some interesting problems. 97% of the time if I bother shooting for a challenge, then I enter -- even if I didn't get much. This means if I didn't get a good shot, I either need to get creative in my cropping (it's amazing, but you'd be surprised how many times there's really a gem there that you just didn't realize because you didn't look small enough), or you need to get creative in the processing (high contrast b&w maybe?).
So the challenges here will push you in areas where you never expected to go. But I can't type anymore here, because my husband is saying "You're supposed to be finishing up a picture and getting some sleep." He knows that there's a lot of fixing to do on this one. Not because of photography errors, but because of photography conditions this time around. Don't think there's that much hope for this one. (But there's one other one to look at too.) :)
|
|
|
|
12/04/2012 09:21:13 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by vawendy:
.... wall of text .... |
I find it interesting the dichotomy which exists amongst people. I have zero motivation to push myself because of the challenges here. To be frank, I find the challenges here a stagnation in my photography. I have a fairly good idea of what will do well in voting and don't want to travel that path. I mainly lost interest after my DQ and the plethora of expert editing challenges.
I find it interesting how much stock people put into this website like it's the ultimate bastion of learning and drive. Don't get me wrong, I've learnt some things since being here, but going out and doing things, reading books, and surfing other sites have provided more knowledge and insight than this place has. The logical question is why am I still around? Active forums and boredom. Once plastic.com (political/social junky website) went under, I needed another venue. |
|
|
|
12/04/2012 09:50:13 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by Venser:
Originally posted by vawendy:
.... wall of text .... |
I find it interesting the dichotomy which exists amongst people. I have zero motivation to push myself because of the challenges here. To be frank, I find the challenges here a stagnation in my photography. I have a fairly good idea of what will do well in voting and don't want to travel that path. I mainly lost interest after my DQ and the plethora of expert editing challenges.
I find it interesting how much stock people put into this website like it's the ultimate bastion of learning and drive. Don't get me wrong, I've learnt some things since being here, but going out and doing things, reading books, and surfing other sites have provided more knowledge and insight than this place has. The logical question is why am I still around? Active forums and boredom. Once plastic.com (political/social junky website) went under, I needed another venue. |
I went through the book phase 18 years ago. Been there done that. Have the library. I just needed something to motivate me to do something different.
|
|
|
|
12/05/2012 04:25:43 AM · #29 |
Shoot, check and delete the crap ones. Then shoot again.
... and sometimes take a break from DPC
|
|
|
|
12/05/2012 06:28:06 AM · #30 |
Originally posted by Venser:
I find it interesting the dichotomy which exists amongst people. I have zero motivation to push myself because of the challenges here. To be frank, I find the challenges here a stagnation in my photography. I have a fairly good idea of what will do well in voting and don't want to travel that path. I mainly lost interest after my DQ and the plethora of expert editing challenges. |
What a crock. Pushing yourself for challenges is about your photography, not about scores. It's a vehicle. Did you read Wendy's post???? Don't want to travel the path of excelling in this environment? Sounds like a cop out. Prove to yourself and the community you actually can do that, then maybe this won't sound so ridiculous.
Originally posted by Venser:
I find it interesting how much stock people put into this website like it's the ultimate bastion of learning and drive. Don't get me wrong, I've learnt some things since being here, but going out and doing things, reading books, and surfing other sites have provided more knowledge and insight than this place has. The logical question is why am I still around? Active forums and boredom. Once plastic.com (political/social junky website) went under, I needed another venue. |
Yah, why are you still here if you feel the way you do? Doesn't seem like you have much interest in putting forth any effort to get anything out of it.
If you want to understand why some of us think so highly of the place, then go look. If you can't understand why many of us feel that this place is wonderful then it's because you're not paying attention. Just pick any one of us who are vocal about it, and go look at our profiles. Look at the early stuff, look at what we do well with, look at how our equipment selections reflect the paths that we've selected, and how our work has improved in those areas. Look at the relationship between our preferred work and the scoring, steadily improving over the years.
You make these broad sweeping statements that really make no sense if you look at the site for what it is.......a place to learn and grow.
But YOU have to do the work.
|
|
|
|
12/05/2012 06:45:21 AM · #31 |
Originally posted by Tiberius:
Shoot, check and delete the crap ones. Then shoot again.
... and sometimes take a break from DPC |
+1 |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 07:15:39 AM · #32 |
Originally posted by Denielle:
first off, I'd like to say that if you're "pushing yourself" it's probably time to give up. if you don't enjoy doing it, then set the camera down and walk away from it for a while. days. weeks. months. however long it takes. |
First off, I completely disagree with this. I rarely enjoy any part of my photography that results in a worthwhile photograph. It is the feeling of having overcome the initial feelings and have been rewarded with a photograph which you would not of taken had you given in to "I don't feel comfortable taking this kind of picture, I'll just enjoy other photographers results"
Most things in life are moments of pleasure and a lifetime of embarrassment; photography is a moment of embarrassment and a lifetime of pleasure. - Tony Benn
For example over the past few months I've started taking my camera onto the street and with permission creating portraits of strangers.
It took me weeks of sleepless nights to finally go out and ask the first person and once I did I asked a further 15 that day. Since then I've done it a couple of times a week, sometimes the first person I asked would refuse and I wouldn't feel like carrying on but a couple of days later I would force myself to try again. The feeling of having not went out to create the opportunities to make these photographs is to me a much worse of a feeling than that of asking a complete stranger to allow me to take their portrait.
There have been many, many photographs I have taken over the past year which I have dreaded doing for days before and often not enjoyed a single minute of the taking of the photograph. It when I return home and see the results that I enjoy it.
Eventually the anxieties will fade and I'll be left able to enjoy all the photographs I take but until then I wont let how I feel about taking the photograph dictate what photographs I take. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 07:16:37 AM · #33 |
| well i dont know about anyone else but i push myself every time i go out with my camera... but i can only speak for myself.. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 08:38:45 AM · #34 |
Well let's see...I enter challenges, enjoy using the *wrong* lenses for certain subjects (wide-angle action shots, anyone? Maybe portraits shot at 420mm?)
Doing or trying to do more studio work but need to up my wattage a bit to be able to do so. I know someone with a couple of 1000-watt Fresnels but those just might be overkill.
Also reading and planning on making a concerted effort to do as many of the lighting exercises in Light: Science and Magic as possible. And trying to learn my flash. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 08:59:09 AM · #35 |
For me I am constantly reading photo magazines and books (Now it seems I need to grab Light: Science and Magic).
Like  snaffles I try to do exercises (aka tutorials) as much as I can. I take online photo courses through betterphoto.com. I recently took a flash course that has made me more comfortable with using my flash that I have been experimenting more. Basically I am constantly learning and trying new things. I also look at other photographers whose work I admire. And I do a photo blog with a couple of my close friends which makes sure I get out once a week taking photos of anything and everything. I think that sums it up. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 09:13:18 AM · #36 |
Originally posted by JamesA:
Originally posted by Denielle:
first off, I'd like to say that if you're "pushing yourself" it's probably time to give up. if you don't enjoy doing it, then set the camera down and walk away from it for a while. days. weeks. months. however long it takes. |
First off, I completely disagree with this. I rarely enjoy any part of my photography that results in a worthwhile photograph. It is the feeling of having overcome the initial feelings and have been rewarded with a photograph which you would not of taken had you given in to "I don't feel comfortable taking this kind of picture, I'll just enjoy other photographers results"
Most things in life are moments of pleasure and a lifetime of embarrassment; photography is a moment of embarrassment and a lifetime of pleasure. - Tony Benn
For example over the past few months I've started taking my camera onto the street and with permission creating portraits of strangers.
It took me weeks of sleepless nights to finally go out and ask the first person and once I did I asked a further 15 that day. Since then I've done it a couple of times a week, sometimes the first person I asked would refuse and I wouldn't feel like carrying on but a couple of days later I would force myself to try again. The feeling of having not went out to create the opportunities to make these photographs is to me a much worse of a feeling than that of asking a complete stranger to allow me to take their portrait.
There have been many, many photographs I have taken over the past year which I have dreaded doing for days before and often not enjoyed a single minute of the taking of the photograph. It when I return home and see the results that I enjoy it.
Eventually the anxieties will fade and I'll be left able to enjoy all the photographs I take but until then I wont let how I feel about taking the photograph dictate what photographs I take. |
let me explain what I meant (perhaps it was a bad choice of words).
when I hear someone "pushing themselves" I think of them trying to make themselves enjoy something that they don't.
if that makes sense.
why do something you don't enjoy?
that's something I will NEVER UNDERSTAND.
I don't enjoy playing volleyball... so I don't. I will never "push" myself to do so.
I don't enjoy grilling. so I don't. and will never "push" myself to do so.
many other things I don't enjoy, but I'll stop at those examples.
that's all I meant by that initial statement.
and when you said you rarely enjoy any part of your photography that results in a worthwhile photograph... that's a strange concept to me.
if I don't enjoy doing a particular shot, I'm not going to do it. I don't want my passion to begin to feel like a chore. if that's the case, I'll lose all interest in photography.
that doesn't mean I won't try new things and go outside my comfort zone... but it does mean I'm not going to continue shooting in a way I don't enjoy. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 09:14:59 AM · #37 |
@ BeckyT...yep, that book will definitely help you learn a few things about lighting! It's comprehensive and very well-written, I suspect it's used as a textbook. Clear examples of what they're talking about, they don't make you feel like their dumbing-down. Very much worth it imho.
Meanwhile I'm still fumbling along trying to master my SB-910 on my own. I have some of it figured out but need to have more guidance, so have requested a book on flash photography from Sandy Claws. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 09:48:06 AM · #38 |
Originally posted by Denielle:
[quote=JamesA] [quote=Denielle]
why do something you don't enjoy?
that's something I will NEVER UNDERSTAND.
I don't enjoy playing volleyball... so I don't. I will never "push" myself to do so.
I don't enjoy grilling. so I don't. |
A lot of people don't enjoy exercise but do it anyway to reap the rewards from it.
It's probably just me. I love architecture and landscape photography, I enjoy taking them pictures but once they are taken I don't really care anymore, they aren't something I enjoy the results of.
Portraits are often the other way around for me, of strangers at least. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 09:56:26 AM · #39 |
| One of my favorite exercises is to photograph the same subject over & over. It's an idea that has been around for a long time, used by a variety of artists. Take a simple subject, like a white egg on a white BG. At first it seems that only one photo is possible. But with such a simple subject (simple, but not easy), the only element that can vary is the photographer. With persistence & patience, the photographer finds ways to vary. New ways. This exercise creates techniques that carry over into other subjects, & the photographer finds new ways, previously untried ways, to approach the subject. For me, my favorite long-term subject to photograph over & over is flowers. Seemingly easy, but not really. I'm still trying, still using my favorite exercise. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 10:02:27 AM · #40 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
What a crock. Pushing yourself for challenges is about your photography, not about scores. |
That's a gross generalization. Refer to the last point.
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Don't want to travel the path of excelling in this environment? Sounds like a cop out. |
How so? If I don't believe DPC is going to help me progress to where I want to go, why should I spend time trying to excel here?
Believe me, a while back if I could have got a prorated refund, I would have left. Since I paid, I stick around. I'll probably re-up just so I can vote. It gives me something to do when I'm bored.
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Prove to yourself and the community you actually can do that, then maybe this won't sound so ridiculous. |
Should I post photos of my work being sold? Bank statements? I don't see an obvious way to show sales through the forums.
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by Venser:
I find it interesting how much stock people put into this website like it's the ultimate bastion of learning and drive. Don't get me wrong, I've learnt some things since being here, but going out and doing things, reading books, and surfing other sites have provided more knowledge and insight than this place has. The logical question is why am I still around? Active forums and boredom. Once plastic.com (political/social junky website) went under, I needed another venue. |
Yah, why are you still here if you feel the way you do? Doesn't seem like you have much interest in putting forth any effort to get anything out of it. |
I explicitly wrote why I'm still around. Reading comprehension must not be your forte. I slapped it in bold for you.
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
If you want to understand why some of us think so highly of the place, then go look. If you can't understand why many of us feel that this place is wonderful then it's because you're not paying attention. Just pick any one of us who are vocal about it, and go look at our profiles. Look at the early stuff, look at what we do well with, look at how our equipment selections reflect the paths that we've selected, and how our work has improved in those areas. Look at the relationship between our preferred work and the scoring, steadily improving over the years. |
What I'm positing is some members put too much stock in this place alone. I'm sure many of these same photographers would have excelled and pushed themselves regardless of DPC or not. If you want to learn, you do. You don't require a website to do so.
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
You make these broad sweeping statements that really make no sense if you look at the site for what it is.......a place to learn and grow. |
Pot, meet kettle. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 10:09:48 AM · #41 |
Originally posted by JamesA:
Originally posted by Denielle:
[quote=JamesA] [quote=Denielle]
why do something you don't enjoy?
that's something I will NEVER UNDERSTAND.
I don't enjoy playing volleyball... so I don't. I will never "push" myself to do so.
I don't enjoy grilling. so I don't. |
A lot of people don't enjoy exercise but do it anyway to reap the rewards from it.
It's probably just me. I love architecture and landscape photography, I enjoy taking them pictures but once they are taken I don't really care anymore, they aren't something I enjoy the results of.
Portraits are often the other way around for me, of strangers at least. |
I figured that would be the example used... exercise.
I don't like exercising. in fact, if it's something I don't enjoy, I will lose interest, no matter what the benefits.
example... I did Insanity a while back. lost over 30lbs, and was in the best shape I had been in in a LONG time. but, even with the benefits reaped, I lost interest. I hated doing it, and just couldn't push myself any further. so I stopped. gained back almost 20lbs. but I don't care. I didn't enjoy it, so I'm not doing it.
but that's just me. I know some people would rather bask in the result, no matter what obstacles they had to overcome.
me... I'd rather enjoy myself in the mean time
I'm not saying I'm right or wrong... nor are you or anyone else. we each have our own way of doing things.
to each their own. :) |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 10:27:14 AM · #42 |
| as this is what i do for a living, i have to constantly push myself. i do it by spending a fair amount of time each week researching what is published in print (mainly newspapers and magazines), as well as looking through photography books (both collections and instructional), looking for examples to emulate and/or surpass. i am an extremely harsh critic of my work. regardless of whom i'm shooting for, whether it's me or a client, i want to produce the best imagery i can at that given moment. that's the challenge, and that's what motivates me. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 10:31:23 AM · #43 |
Originally posted by pixelpig:
One of my favorite exercises is to photograph the same subject over & over. It's an idea that has been around for a long time, used by a variety of artists. Take a simple subject, like a white egg on a white BG. At first it seems that only one photo is possible. But with such a simple subject (simple, but not easy), the only element that can vary is the photographer. With persistence & patience, the photographer finds ways to vary. New ways. This exercise creates techniques that carry over into other subjects, & the photographer finds new ways, previously untried ways, to approach the subject. . |
Splendid idea! |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 10:33:02 AM · #44 |
Originally posted by GAP2012:
well i dont know about anyone else but i push myself every time i go out with my camera... but i can only speak for myself.. |
An examples to share on how you push yourself. The thought process or some other story? |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 10:33:23 AM · #45 |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 11:00:46 AM · #46 |
Originally posted by JamesA:
Originally posted by Denielle:
[quote=JamesA] [quote=Denielle]
why do something you don't enjoy?
that's something I will NEVER UNDERSTAND.
I don't enjoy playing volleyball... so I don't. I will never "push" myself to do so.
I don't enjoy grilling. so I don't. |
A lot of people don't enjoy exercise but do it anyway to reap the rewards from it.
|
+1
Extremely good point. I'm not the setup shot type of person. It's not my type of photography. Yet it a large number of challenges seem to require setup shots. It frustrated me when I first started, but I did them anyway. You'd be amazed at what you learn and what you can apply to your own choice of photography. Knowledge is power. The more you experience, the more you'll be prepared for any eventuality.
When I took piano lessons, I avoided practicing the scales and exercises. Didn't enjoy them, didn't see much of a purpose. I wanted to play what I wanted to play. When I got older, I realized just how much they helped train the fingers, and they did so much more than just practicing the songs I enjoyed.
|
|
|
|
12/05/2012 11:09:48 AM · #47 |
I no longer study the images at DPC, because they are "a class different" from the images I admired so much, and learned so much from, in my first few years at DPC. 2006-2011. It's not that today's ribbon winners aren't very good, they are just not as photographically inspirational as previous superstars here.
There are alternative sources of inspiration. But, one doesn't find them here so much, anymore. Here's one which caused me to want me to grab my camera and capture an image of what I see every day.
//youtu.be/nj2ofrX7jAk |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 12:41:05 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by pixelpig:
One of my favorite exercises is to photograph the same subject over & over. It's an idea that has been around for a long time, used by a variety of artists. Take a simple subject, like a white egg on a white BG. At first it seems that only one photo is possible. But with such a simple subject (simple, but not easy), the only element that can vary is the photographer. With persistence & patience, the photographer finds ways to vary. New ways. This exercise creates techniques that carry over into other subjects, & the photographer finds new ways, previously untried ways, to approach the subject. For me, my favorite long-term subject to photograph over & over is flowers. Seemingly easy, but not really. I'm still trying, still using my favorite exercise. |
Terrific example.
I do that in a slightly different manner as well. I return to some of the places I've been months and years before looking for new ways to see the same things, and also to see if they're still there. I've found with some of my subjects, especially with my propensity for derelict and abandoned things, that I now have glimpses of history, never to be seen again.
I like that....
|
|
|
|
12/05/2012 01:50:50 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by hahn23:
I no longer study the images at DPC, because they are "a class different" from the images I admired so much, and learned so much from, in my first few years at DPC. 2006-2011. It's not that today's ribbon winners aren't very good, they are just not as photographically inspirational as previous superstars here.
There are alternative sources of inspiration. But, one doesn't find them here so much, anymore. Here's one which caused me to want me to grab my camera and capture an image of what I see every day.
//youtu.be/nj2ofrX7jAk |
Very nice Richard. Thanks. |
|
|
|
12/05/2012 06:44:30 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by jaysonmc:
Originally posted by GAP2012:
well i dont know about anyone else but i push myself every time i go out with my camera... but i can only speak for myself.. |
An examples to share on how you push yourself. The thought process or some other story? |
i try to produce the images i want to and do things differently for my benefit and i get a kick out of others reactions, but its for me and i try not to stick to one genre of photography and interplay with my artistic side and come up with new ways of seeing my world through my camera and therefore push myself, i am constantly re-learning and reviewing photos and the world around me in pictures and in life to see if there is another way to do the same thing or subject and produce the best images i can and improve my knowledge and skills and not limit myslef and in that way i am pushing myself so that i can produce the photos i want and want to see and if others get it or get something from them then i have achieved it and continue to push.. but its not like work or excercise for me, i dont hate doing it...so its a positive pushing the boundaries not pushing myself to do something i dont want to do... thoughts, and technique and creatively pushing for excellence despite my inner critic or any other critic for that matter... DPC can be very conservative and stagnant sometimes and i dont use it alone to measure my photos against if i did i would probably stop now because its not the be all and end all of photography nor the wisest where photography is concerned, but some of the peoples work on here i really like and as a result i like to see what theyre producing and others too..
i hope that helps....
Message edited by author 2012-12-05 18:45:40. |
|
