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07/25/2012 03:19:17 PM · #1
We have all gotten a too dark or too light comment. One possible reason is because all monitors are not calibrated the same.

What the photographer captured and created could look good on their screen, but not necessarily the voters screens.

I suggest to move the calibration bar ( that long line that goes from white to black) up to sit between the image title and the voting scale. Currently it sits all the way at the bottom of each voting screen and I am sure it gets ignored because it is basically not noticed.

I would have put this in the Get Satisfaction site but the activity is far, far less than here...
07/25/2012 05:22:03 PM · #2
+1
07/27/2012 09:52:14 AM · #3
Bump for the morning crowd.

Wouldn't it be absolutely wonderful if all monitors were in a fixed position and all were calibrated the same?

I realize that that will never be the case BUT perhaps my suggestion above will help the viewing experience of the site.

O.K. here is an example and some 'data points' of what I have found.

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/1000-1999/1605/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1025730.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/1000-1999/1605/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1025730.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

When I looked at this image on my PC and my laptop all the image details were visible. It looked better on my laptop where the screen is bright (I think about a 0.15 difference from the PC which has the contrasts between shadow and highlights a bit darker)

However, my husband and I went out with friends on the weekend and I asked if we could look at the image on his IPad - hmmm, details were lost on the bottom half of the image and the strawberries were indeed a bit dark.

Fiddling with the laptop I found that my image looked fine if I had the screen sitting at a 110 angle and I was sitting up straight. All square bars on the calibration bar at the very bottom of voting screen were visible.

However, if I tilted the screen to a full upright position of 90 degrees - 3 bars on the white squares to the left disappeared.

Tilt the screen 140 degrees and 3 bars on the black squares to the right disappear.

Message edited by author 2012-07-27 10:02:04.
07/27/2012 11:23:57 AM · #4
Yes, that is yet another aspect of viewing images over which we have no control - angle of monitor. The average monitor has a very narrow viewing angle - any deviation to the left, right, up, or down, flattens the image. Add to that the aforementioned brightness and contrast, and you have a really wide range of situations which are unfavorable to viewing imagery. Additionally, each of us has slight variations in our own settings. Photogs (such as myself) who favor dark images will be disadvantaged because the average viewer will see an underexposed image, and for those who prefer brighter images, their pictures may appear blown out.

Until there is wide use of a standardized monitor (which is never), this will always be a problem.
07/27/2012 11:47:51 AM · #5
what about color blind people, can we have a test for that too, i dont want colorblind people voting on an image that isn't black and white. if you cant see the full gamut of the colorspace i work with then don't vote.

07/27/2012 12:39:50 PM · #6
Originally posted by tanguera:

Yes, that is yet another aspect of viewing images over which we have no control - angle of monitor. The average monitor has a very narrow viewing angle - any deviation to the left, right, up, or down, flattens the image. Add to that the aforementioned brightness and contrast, and you have a really wide range of situations which are unfavorable to viewing imagery. Additionally, each of us has slight variations in our own settings. Photogs (such as myself) who favor dark images will be disadvantaged because the average viewer will see an underexposed image, and for those who prefer brighter images, their pictures may appear blown out.

Until there is wide use of a standardized monitor (which is never), this will always be a problem.


Agreed it *WILL* always be a problem, but it doesn't mean the site can't 'heighten wareness' of the issue - at least in a small way.

Again, the suggestion is to:

I suggest to move the calibration bar ( that long line that goes from white to black) up to sit between the image title and the voting scale.
Currently it sits all the way at the bottom of each voting screen and I am sure it gets ignored because it is basically not noticed.

***an additional thing that I just thought of to moving the position is if the mouse hovers over the bar it gives a little box that identifies it as 'calibration bar'. Clicking on it will take you to a website that explains what and how to calibration.....but then *that* is getting more complex so for the groundwork I will stand by the suggestion to move the calibration bar.
07/27/2012 12:52:22 PM · #7
Originally posted by mike_311:

what about color blind people, can we have a test for that too, i dont want colorblind people voting on an image that isn't black and white. if you cant see the full gamut of the colorspace i work with then don't vote.


Sarcastic humor aside (that is how I am going to read your post) I have two questions for you Mike,

My questions are:

1. How many notice the calibration bar at the very bottom of the voting page? (I personally did not notice it until being here on the site for 2 years)

2. Would it perhaps help if that calibration bar's position moved to sit between the image title and the numbered voting scale?

Given it is a small change suggestion - however if a handful of people in any given challenge notice and take calibration into account (by going so far as to adjust the monitors so 95% to 100% of the bars are seen)then that is a big plus because now he/she gets to see it as close as the photographer wants it to be seen.

Yes, some people will ignore it no matter where it is but some will not and that it what I hope the change will help with making the 'viewing' of an image better (both for the audience and the photographer)

07/27/2012 12:58:42 PM · #8
Originally posted by mike_311:

what about color blind people, can we have a test for that too, i dont want colorblind people voting on an image that isn't black and white. if you cant see the full gamut of the colorspace i work with then don't vote.


Joel Grimes is colour blind!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So I am pretty sure being colour blind is OKAY!

Message edited by author 2012-07-27 12:59:14.
07/27/2012 03:41:07 PM · #9
Originally posted by mike_311:

what about color blind people, can we have a test for that too, i dont want colorblind people voting on an image that isn't black and white. if you cant see the full gamut of the colorspace i work with then don't vote.


I seem to recall ' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/31.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/31.gif', '/') + 1) . ' CorySmith being color blind. Hasn't slowed his photography down.

Anyway, sensitivity to different wavelengths of light is going to vary to one degree or another among different people. People who are classified as "color blind" are simply at an extreme. Others may be nearly at the same extreme. Maybe we should come up with a color sensitivity test and only those who match the photographer's own response to various wavelengths across the gamut of colors used should be allowed to vote on that photographer's work.
07/27/2012 03:47:01 PM · #10
Originally posted by Spork99:

I seem to recall ' . substr('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/31.gif', strrpos('//www.dpchallenge.com/images/user_icon/31.gif', '/') + 1) . ' CorySmith being color blind. Hasn't slowed his photography down.

I know of another color blind member with nearly 20 ribbons, and there's a whole lot of B&W in that portfolio. ;-)
07/27/2012 04:29:20 PM · #11
Ok -- so this one bothered me a bit, because I thought it was too dark, as well. But I really thought my monitor was calibrated pretty well.

So I looked at it again.

It's not that your darks are too dark. I see all the detail. In fact, it's your lights that are too dark. If you click on any point in your whipped cream, it's grey, not white, and when I looked at levels, it looked like this:

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027360.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027360.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

So your high end was off.

If you brought the high end to a better place, you'd have this

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027359.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027359.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

instead of this

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/1000-1999/1605/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1025730.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/1000-1999/1605/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1025730.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

which feels much more natural.


07/27/2012 05:29:26 PM · #12
agree about the whites and fwiw i would have also raised the midtones a notch - the bready stuff is dark reddish brown and not a nice inviting tan.... and my monitor tends to be too bright.
07/30/2012 09:21:13 AM · #13
Originally posted by vawendy:

Ok -- so this one bothered me a bit, because I thought it was too dark, as well. But I really thought my monitor was calibrated pretty well.

So I looked at it again.

It's not that your darks are too dark. I see all the detail. In fact, it's your lights that are too dark. If you click on any point in your whipped cream, it's grey, not white, and when I looked at levels, it looked like this:

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027360.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027360.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

So your high end was off.

If you brought the high end to a better place, you'd have this

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027359.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_portfolio/100000-104999/103142/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1027359.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

instead of this

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/1000-1999/1605/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1025730.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/1000-1999/1605/120/Copyrighted_Image_Reuse_Prohibited_1025730.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

which feels much more natural.


Wendy, you know that you just gave me a kick in the rear prompting me to now add looking at curves consistently as part of my routine:-):-) The whites do pop more when compared to the original that looks dull.
07/30/2012 10:44:41 AM · #14
the high-key soft blur challenge is going to be particularly difficult as i am submitting feedback on another forum and everyone is telling me my image is too blown out, where its looks just fine on my screen.

07/30/2012 01:23:01 PM · #15
Originally posted by CNovack:


Wendy, you know that you just gave me a kick in the rear prompting me to now add looking at curves consistently as part of my routine:-):-) The whites do pop more when compared to the original that looks dull.


I should think that would be a natural part of everybody's work flow..
07/30/2012 02:08:25 PM · #16
Originally posted by CNovack:

Yes, some people will ignore it no matter where it is but some will not and that it what I hope the change will help with making the 'viewing' of an image better (both for the audience and the photographer)


And some people had no idea what that was for until seeing a thread like this. :P Is that explained somewhere prominent for newbies like me? I don't recall seeing that explained anywhere when I was exploring the site to learn about how things work around here when I first signed up...although it is quite possible I just saw it, and skipped reading that section too.

Message edited by author 2012-07-30 14:09:09.
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