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08/10/2004 02:52:23 PM · #1
Post your comments, questions, and reviews for...

'Using Photoshop to Prepare Photos for DPC Challenges'
by EddyG

View this tutorial here.
08/11/2004 12:29:16 AM · #2
bump! :)
08/11/2004 01:43:43 AM · #3
great tutorial, Eddy...thanks!


08/11/2004 02:13:04 AM · #4
Thanks for the great tutorial. I sure needed that. I am printing out all the tutorials I can find to learn how to do things that seem to come naturally to others on this site. This tutorial is going to be a big help to me.
08/11/2004 03:55:49 AM · #5
Very good tutorial. Great job, Eddy!
08/11/2004 04:28:23 AM · #6
Very thorough and comprehensive, and clearly explained. I'm a little concerned that it's so directed towards not only Photoshop, but the latest version; I wish some of the explanations were more generic.

While I have no trouble translating the instructions -- I've been using Photoshop in all it's incarnations since 2.0, but mostly use 5.x -- the "newbies" to whom this is purportedly directed are the least capable of making the translation of a command in PS CS to one of the other editors.

Maybe if it were made more modular -- a section on resampling/resizing, one on sharpening, one on JPEG (not everyone has a "save for web" option!) strategies, etc., alternative methods using other software could also be demonstrated.

Also, one minor "dispute." There are definitely times when 640 pixels is not the best choice. For example, I'll often save a picture at about 600-620 pixels, so that I can save it at JPEG level 8 (148k), instead of 640 pixels wide, but at JPEG level 7 (108k). I'd most often rather trade 20-40 pixels for the improved quality. This especially true if you are using a square image!

Overall a great job, and something that's been often asked-for! Thanks!

Message edited by author 2004-08-11 04:29:24.
08/11/2004 04:56:35 AM · #7
Excellent!
I think it's ok for it to be geared to PS as it's TITLE is about using PS (not other tools) to prepare photos.
Perhaps others can create similar tutorials based on other commonly used post processing software?
08/11/2004 06:47:35 AM · #8
Shouldn't this be "Using Adobe® Photoshop® to Prepare Photos for DPC Challenges?" ;-)

Seriously... thanks for doing this Eddy!

-Terry
08/11/2004 07:28:45 AM · #9
Useful, thx.
08/11/2004 10:21:50 AM · #10
Thanks for the comments. Let me try to address some of the concerns:

Originally posted by GeneralE:

I'm a little concerned that it's so directed towards not only Photoshop, but the latest version; I wish some of the explanations were more generic.

I'm pretty sure that the majority of the tutorial -- the only exception being the alternate resampling algorithms -- is applicable to Photoshop going back at least a couple versions?

Originally posted by GeneralE:

...alternative methods using other software could also be demonstrated.

If folks thought this tutorial was helpful, I was going to do something similar using something like the freely-available IrfanView to demonstrate how to resize in that software. I could also install Photoshop Elements or the demo version of PaintShop Pro and do similar tutorials for those packages. I just thought one giant tutorial for a bunch of software packages would get confusing fast.

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Also, one minor "dispute." There are definitely times when 640 pixels is not the best choice. For example, I'll often save a picture at about 600-620 pixels, so that I can save it at JPEG level 8 (148k), instead of 640 pixels wide, but at JPEG level 7 (108k). I'd most often rather trade 20-40 pixels for the improved quality.

Point taken. This tutorial specifically deals with using the "Save For Web" option, which has a lot more granularity in adjusting file sizes than the regular "Save As" dialog, plus the benefit of not embedding unnecessary sections in the JPEG that increase the size of the file but do nothing for image quality. By specifically pointing out how to use the "Optimize to file size" option, you maximize the amount of image data you can pack into 150K. That being said, I probably should have mentioned that going back and reducing the size to 620 or 600 was an option if, when comparing the left and right sides of the "Save for Web" dialog, the compression artifacts were too obvious and or distracting.

Originally posted by ClubJuggle:

Shouldn't this be "Using Adobe® Photoshop® to Prepare Photos for DPC Challenges?" ;-)

D'oh! You're right! I bet Adobe's lawyers will be contacting D & L soon...

Message edited by author 2004-08-11 10:22:48.
08/11/2004 10:36:24 AM · #11
Excellent tutorial Eddy.

I just wanted to point out that, in general, "Relative colorimetric" is almost always a better choice for rendering intent than "Perceptual" or "Saturation". "Perceptual" is probably better suited for images with saturated reds/magentas/blues. Although you might get some interesting results with "Saturation" as a choice, it's not generally recommended for photographic images.
08/11/2004 10:46:10 AM · #12
Originally posted by dwoolridge:

Excellent tutorial Eddy.

I just wanted to point out that, in general, "Relative colorimetric" is almost always a better choice for rendering intent than "Perceptual" or "Saturation". "Perceptual" is probably better suited for images with saturated reds/magentas/blues. Although you might get some interesting results with "Saturation" as a choice, it's not generally recommended for photographic images.


Yup, saturation rendering intent is designed mainly for business graphics, powerpoint presentations etc. It keeps everything as bold as possible and ignores relative colour relationships - probably not what you want to do.

You might want to talk about black point compensation too, if you are going to go over the profile translation options. Good tutorial though - can't wait for when you address the image preparation part of it though :)

I've written and am currently writing 'workflow' descriptions for classes that I teach - it is a big job - this is a great start.

Message edited by author 2004-08-11 11:12:09.
08/11/2004 10:50:41 AM · #13
Excellent. I'm always at a loss regarding the values for USM ... thanks for addressing this issue.
08/11/2004 11:04:56 AM · #14
That is an admirable donation of time and effort Eddy.
08/11/2004 01:27:44 PM · #15
a belated thanks! now, if you can just get heida to do the one on dodging and burning...
08/11/2004 02:05:55 PM · #16
Thanks again for the feedback in this thread and via PM. I've updated the tutorial to reflect this feedback.
08/11/2004 02:40:30 PM · #17
One thing I noticed: No need to set the "Optimize" size to 147, 150 gives you the full value, and it will not exceed that number, so you can post it. No real reason to drop the number any lower, the program will do it for you.

Great Job with this tutorial, learned a few things I didn't know (Bicubic sharper, for one !)
08/11/2004 02:58:02 PM · #18
Originally posted by airatic:

One thing I noticed: No need to set the "Optimize" size to 147, 150 gives you the full value, and it will not exceed that number, so you can post it. No real reason to drop the number any lower, the program will do it for you.

Great Job with this tutorial, learned a few things I didn't know (Bicubic sharper, for one !)


I used to use 147Kb, when I would then re-apply the EXIF info to the JPEG. The EXIF is never more than 3k
08/12/2004 11:38:56 PM · #19
Well done tutorial. Most of it applies to Photoshop Elements as well. Just skip the steps dealing with color spaces and ignore the other options that don't exist in Elements. The most significant difference is that there isn't an "Optimize to File Size" option in the Elements Save For Web. You have to fiddle with the Quality slider to make the size as high as possible but less than 150K.
09/10/2004 07:34:16 PM · #20
Fantastic tutorial Eddy.

I never thought I would need to look at this until I got into trouble with a file that only wanted to come out at about 32kb with a lot of lost detail! Worked throught your tutorial and discovered how much I didn't know!

Thanks again! Bob
09/10/2004 08:12:13 PM · #21
The only real differences when using PSP are that it has a 'smart size' feature for re-sizing, which chooses the cleanest of all the techniques (always bicubic, don't know why they bothered) for you; and that there's a file size optimiser which appears from file | save as ... | options ... | run optimiser commands. Very useful feature, and allows colour information compression too.

Oh - and good tutorial Eddy, even for someone to whom that process has become second nature now :-)

E
09/10/2004 08:45:28 PM · #22
I've been told to save the JPG as a Tiff or Photoshop File before working on it at all...I noticed you worked on the JPG and then saved it as a Photoshop file. That still avoids saving from JPG to JPG, so may accomplish the same thing. I'm very new at all this. I do thank you so much for the tutorial. I can tell it took a good deal of time to put together and I learned a lot from it.

Message edited by author 2004-09-10 20:45:55.
09/13/2004 04:38:39 PM · #23
I've just submitted my first photo. As a complete novice I had no idea how to achieve the submittable size without losing quality. Having read this my future submissions should improve greatly. A huge thank you Eddy from a stressed beginner

Message edited by author 2004-09-13 17:01:31.
09/13/2004 06:41:18 PM · #24
I have written a resize action for photoshop if anyone is interested. It resizes your photo to the requirements of DPC. I will send it to a site council member to have it's use validated first and then maybe it can be used to give newbies a hand. If there is a SC member out there that wants to have a look at it drop me a PM. I can get it to you tonight when I get home.
Cheers Ross.

Message edited by author 2004-09-14 06:29:40.
09/13/2004 11:17:47 PM · #25
Bump. looks like no body is interested.
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