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 04/13/2011 11:59:13 AM · #1
This is another "why did I get disqualified..." post.

I was recently disqualified in Fine Art II for my submission "Water Nymph" (advanced editing)
The rules state that I "may not use ANY editing tool to create new image area, objects or features (such as lens flare or motion) that didn't already exist in your original capture."
I believe I haven't broken this rule. This rule states nothing about hue/saturation or selection.

In fact, "use ANY editing tool to move, remove or duplicate any element of your photograph that would change a typical viewer’s description of the photograph (aside from color or crop), even if the tool is otherwise legal, and regardless of whether you intended the change when the photograph was taken."



Message edited by author 2011-04-13 12:11:13.
 04/13/2011 12:05:48 PM · #2
You may want to remove the photo until after the challenge is over then you can ask.
 04/13/2011 12:06:56 PM · #3
Now post the original shot. Also when you use a black border around a photo that is mostly black in the background it comes across as adding image area. For all anyone knows...you could have extended the background and then put that blue border on top. Post the original so we can see how it originally looked. That would be more helpful.
 04/13/2011 12:12:03 PM · #4
that might be it.
I did create a larger, plain black field and posted my image onto it to get the space outside of the border.
would this qualify me for disqualification?
 04/13/2011 12:19:55 PM · #5
Originally posted by stantheman1313:
that might be it.
I did create a larger, plain black field and posted my image onto it to get the space outside of the border.
would this qualify me for disqualification?


Yes it would.
 04/13/2011 12:22:36 PM · #6
well there it is then

thanks and sorry to waste your time
 04/13/2011 12:31:15 PM · #7
Next time, first draw a very thin (1 pixel) white (or any contrasting color) border, then surround THAT with the black border. This is legal, because the contrasting hairline clearly delineates the boundary of the actual image.

R.
 04/13/2011 12:34:13 PM · #8
Originally posted by stantheman1313:
well there it is then

thanks and sorry to waste your time


NEVER a waste of time...it is often confusing to figure out "WHY" you get a Dq, it is always better to ask so you understand, that way you don't repeat the "UNintended" offense. I know that I have learned valuable lessons from my goof ups and some were quite obvious to SC/members here but I still didn't understand until I asked...
 04/13/2011 01:13:40 PM · #9
As Ja-9 said, you haven't wasted our time - it is always a good reminder to everyone else. And sorry about the DQ :(
 04/13/2011 01:15:50 PM · #10
Originally posted by stantheman1313:
well there it is then

thanks and sorry to waste your time


Not a waste of anyone's time. Just chalk it up to being another learning experience. :)
 04/13/2011 01:44:51 PM · #11
Pleases post your shot in this thread after the challenge ends, I'm not clear on what you did wrong. It sounds like it was just on the edge of whatever rule you violated.
 04/13/2011 01:47:59 PM · #12
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Next time, first draw a very thin (1 pixel) white (or any contrasting color) border, then surround THAT with the black border. This is legal, because the contrasting hairline clearly delineates the boundary of the actual image.
R.

Is it for sure? I don't mean to argue with you, but I thought that even with a border it still created the illusion of more background and therefore might be illegal. Do you recall an example of where this was deemed legal?
 04/13/2011 01:55:46 PM · #13
Originally posted by citymars:
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Next time, first draw a very thin (1 pixel) white (or any contrasting color) border, then surround THAT with the black border. This is legal, because the contrasting hairline clearly delineates the boundary of the actual image.
R.

Is it for sure? I don't mean to argue with you, but I thought that even with a border it still created the illusion of more background and therefore might be illegal. Do you recall an example of where this was deemed legal?


I don't ever recall a validation review where a border with color matching image area was questioned if there was a line of any type between the image and border. IMO, the position that such a border violates any rule is not supportable.
 04/13/2011 01:58:32 PM · #14
Originally posted by citymars:
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Next time, first draw a very thin (1 pixel) white (or any contrasting color) border, then surround THAT with the black border. This is legal, because the contrasting hairline clearly delineates the boundary of the actual image.
R.

Is it for sure? I don't mean to argue with you, but I thought that even with a border it still created the illusion of more background and therefore might be illegal. Do you recall an example of where this was deemed legal?


I saw the photo...it's black on black. In that case it would still get a DQ because there has to be an obvious difference that it's a border and not an enlargement of the image area with a "piping" type border. Had the border been a distinct color in this case it would not have been DQ'ed...at least not for that reason. That is what Bear is saying. So yes citymars...in this case you would be correct in your assumption since the border and background colors are the same and there is no distinction between the two.
 04/13/2011 04:10:18 PM · #15
Thanks for the explanation guys

imo it's kind of unfair that the color of the border would be reason enough for a dq.
i usually do my borders with overlapping "strokes", but in this one i simply did not have enough space around the subject.
also, the border in itself was silly in this challenge, it was a last minute thoughtless decision to be honest. i regretted it the next day.

i'll post both new and original the moment the challenge ends.

for learning purposes though, i've been a little confused lately on how to make a proper border in cs5.
can anyone quickly go through the steps?
 04/13/2011 04:34:46 PM · #16
Basic approach to border making with CS5 (or any photoshop):

Image>Canvas Size> is your command. Set units to pixels. Choose twice the desired size of the border (if you want a 10-pixel border enter 20, it will give you 10 on each side) for both width and height. Be sure the center box is checked, and be sure "relative" is checked, then choose your color and click OK.

It is best to do this after resizing. Reason: if you have a very thin border that is an odd pixel size, it will be split unevenly. So if you decide you want, say, 20 pixels all around for a border, you will resize to 760 pixels and add 40 back with the border.

Want a double border? Often I'll use a 2-pixel black then a 38-pixel white to get my 40 pixels, that'll float my image on white with a nice, thin 1-pixel black line separating image tones from white. Or use a white hairline and a black border, whatever.

If you want to "letterbox", then your "height" dimension entered will be much larger than your width dimension; in fact, typically you won't add anything on the sides when letterboxing. And, normally, letterboxing is set off with the hairline, as described above.

R.
 04/13/2011 04:36:28 PM · #17
Originally posted by kirbic:
Originally posted by citymars:
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Next time, first draw a very thin (1 pixel) white (or any contrasting color) border, then surround THAT with the black border. This is legal, because the contrasting hairline clearly delineates the boundary of the actual image.
R.

Is it for sure? I don't mean to argue with you, but I thought that even with a border it still created the illusion of more background and therefore might be illegal. Do you recall an example of where this was deemed legal?


I don't ever recall a validation review where a border with color matching image area was questioned if there was a line of any type between the image and border. IMO, the position that such a border violates any rule is not supportable.


That's from the horse's mouth: former SC...
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