| Author | Thread |
|
|
03/04/2010 07:28:07 AM · #1 |
Originally posted by pjotre7:
It is all about the effort and not about the equipment. This shows in the pictures. Great famous shots which we all still love today, were made with the simpelest camera's you can imagine. These photographers would have killed for the options you have today, even in your Nokia or Iphone integrated cameras!
And you have a computer to participate on this website so you are able to crop a picture and do other basic improvements on your "snapshot" with any free software available.
But your uncleaned kitchen as background for your submitted photo has nothing to do with studio or equipment. It has all to do with effort.
Dito with all playmobil and Lego set-ups, rubber ducks and other low life materials.....
I do not think any comments here will influence my personal judgements. I'm 40+ :-) |
I put quite a bit of effort into my Dance entry and actually took around 100 shots with different light and poses. The score ended up low which I knew it would but to me the shot was a sucess. I did not enter it to ribbon or get a top 10 or 20 finish I entered it to bring a smile to a few voters faces that I thought would appreciate it.
Finished sub 5 but the comments and few 7+ votes showed me that this had the impact that I wanted. True it had technical issues, dust and whatnot but in the end I created a shot that had impact on a few voters. So in my opinion this shot was more successful then say a shot that finishes well because it is well done but doesn't invoke a reaction with the voters. |
|
|
|
03/04/2010 06:14:35 AM · #2 |
Originally posted by SaraR:
There have certainly been a number of discussions in the score threads that could be deemed as attempting to manipulate voters - or to be more charitable, attempting to make sure that voters understand what is the 'right' way. |
Having opinions as to the level and quality of the proffered images may be undesirable, but it's much less offensive than the recent display of obvious abuse of the voting scale as demonstrated by a person, or persons, who have been repeatedly changing their scores back and forth.
That, IMNSHO, is grounds for a public flaying......8>)
|
|
|
|
03/04/2010 02:29:43 AM · #3 |
Originally posted by SaraR:
I may be off the mark, but I think what the OP was complaining about was people casting views on photos - either specific or more general - in the current challenge scores threads. I must admit I had noticed that this has been a bit of an upward trend lately. Personally, I have some sympathy with the view of the commenter he was complaining of, but discussions on the quality of individual/groups of photos are, I believe best left til after voting has finished. There have certainly been a number of discussions in the score threads that could be deemed as attempting to manipulate voters - or to be more charitable, attempting to make sure that voters understand what is the 'right' way. |
If it is about 'current challenge' threads, I loath those with a passion because it does effect peoples views if they admit it or not. So if this is the case, a thread about currently voting challenges should not be. At least with my view of it. Though, I don't even think I could pay someone to sway a vote in my favor so pretty much a mute point for me.
|
|
|
|
03/04/2010 02:14:53 AM · #4 |
| I may be off the mark, but I think what the OP was complaining about was people casting views on photos - either specific or more general - in the current challenge scores threads. I must admit I had noticed that this has been a bit of an upward trend lately. Personally, I have some sympathy with the view of the commenter he was complaining of, but discussions on the quality of individual/groups of photos are, I believe best left til after voting has finished. There have certainly been a number of discussions in the score threads that could be deemed as attempting to manipulate voters - or to be more charitable, attempting to make sure that voters understand what is the 'right' way. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 10:08:05 PM · #5 |
Originally posted by tnun:
Originally posted by pjotre7:
Originally posted by tnun:
What is this righteous hype about effort? Photographs come to us in all our modes of being, sweaty or cool, intense or dreamy. The critical moment, as far as evaluation is concerned, is in choosing it. |
Well, there is some proof (valid for most things in life) that putting in effort improves results.... |
And yet effort is not always rewarded nor even well directed. We really have no way of judging how much effort went into a photo, nor is it our job to try. |
In some you can tell the effort. In some.
In some you can tell the button clicker didn't give two bits and in some you can tell the photographer actually took the time to compose the image, gain sharp focus and clarity as well as balance.
|
|
|
|
03/03/2010 10:06:22 PM · #6 |
....
A photo journalistic image may and normally does have some type of mass appeal. Does this magically change it from a snapshot to an artistic image? No. However because of the mass appeal people view it differently.
Typically a snapshot is a 'point and shoot' type of image. No brain thought on composition, balance or anything. Doesn't matter if you have a full frame camera or a barbie camera, if there is no thought in the composition of the image, most likely it is a snapshot. Though for me, the appeal factor also measures into it.
You submit an image of Uncle Albert sneezing, it is only going to appeal to a small number of people. Those who are directly connected to the image, and those who can find a connection.
Now, Jeb said something about his recent shoes entry being a 5 minute shot.... I looked, its a decent shot. Though the elements of 'clutter' behind the subjects actually adds interest as does the reflection underneath. I am assuming he set up the shot and not just walked into the garage and snapped the boots. Also he took the time in post to 'complete' the image. Most snapshots are straight from the camera.
Now, before you say something about straight from the camera images, there is nothing wrong with those and all of them are not snapshots. If someone can compose the image, balance the lights/darks/colours and convey their message with mass appeal, it may not be a snapshot.
But hell, what do I know, have you seen my work its all crud anyway.
|
|
|
|
03/03/2010 09:18:56 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by tnun:
Originally posted by pjotre7:
Originally posted by tnun:
What is this righteous hype about effort? Photographs come to us in all our modes of being, sweaty or cool, intense or dreamy. The critical moment, as far as evaluation is concerned, is in choosing it. |
Well, there is some proof (valid for most things in life) that putting in effort improves results.... |
And yet effort is not always rewarded nor even well directed. We really have no way of judging how much effort went into a photo, nor is it our job to try. |
Agreed. A good photo is a good photo - it is the photographer's and viewer's jobs to decide if they like it but really, it makes no hill of beans difference how it got there.
|
|
|
|
03/03/2010 09:06:32 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by kirbic:
To the OP... you already have the ability to ignore comments during voting... the catch is, you also need to ignore your score. Just uncheck the "My Scores" box on your preferences page.
Frankly, I'm surprised that someone who has been here over half a decade hasn't grown a thick skin. You need to take comments for what they are worth. Some are gold, others are, well, fertilizer. You decide. But be careful which you consider fertilizer. Thinking about them can often lead to much faster learning than dismissing them. |
I have discovered that for the most part, the comments that bother me the most are the ones that hit closest to home.
The ones that we need the most are generally NOT the nice ones......8>)
|
|
|
|
03/03/2010 08:39:26 PM · #9 |
To the OP... you already have the ability to ignore comments during voting... the catch is, you also need to ignore your score. Just uncheck the "My Scores" box on your preferences page.
Frankly, I'm surprised that someone who has been here over half a decade hasn't grown a thick skin. You need to take comments for what they are worth. Some are gold, others are, well, fertilizer. You decide. But be careful which you consider fertilizer. Thinking about them can often lead to much faster learning than dismissing them. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 08:34:28 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by pjotre7:
Originally posted by tnun:
What is this righteous hype about effort? Photographs come to us in all our modes of being, sweaty or cool, intense or dreamy. The critical moment, as far as evaluation is concerned, is in choosing it. |
Well, there is some proof (valid for most things in life) that putting in effort improves results.... |
And yet effort is not always rewarded nor even well directed. We really have no way of judging how much effort went into a photo, nor is it our job to try. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 08:33:32 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by eaglebeck:
I would like to see a rule that a person's opinion of the entered photos in a challenge should be withheld until the voting is over. |
If you don't want people's opinion on your shot, don't post it on the world wide web. Besides, what difference would it make if they kept their opinions to themselves? Their vote would remain the same. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 08:29:26 PM · #12 |
| So, what are you saying? Thumbs up? |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 08:16:35 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by pjotre7:
But your uncleaned kitchen as background for your submitted photo has nothing to do with studio or equipment. It has all to do with effort. |
I have to laugh a little at this thought.....
If you look closely, you can see the junk in my garage behind the boots. That basket looking thing is one of those round chairs with a big cushion for a seat, and I converted it to B&W 'cause taking the colors out lessened the distractions of the stuff on the shelves in the garage.
This was pretty much a five minute, update button withdrawal, half-assed entry. |
But you took this 5 minute effort.... the finger on the hotspot........ (and damned good looking desintegrated shoes...) |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 08:13:28 PM · #14 |
| ...and you did a dang nice job too Jeb. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 08:01:23 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by pjotre7:
But your uncleaned kitchen as background for your submitted photo has nothing to do with studio or equipment. It has all to do with effort. |
I have to laugh a little at this thought.....
If you look closely, you can see the junk in my garage behind the boots. That basket looking thing is one of those round chairs with a big cushion for a seat, and I converted it to B&W 'cause taking the colors out lessened the distractions of the stuff on the shelves in the garage.
This was pretty much a five minute, update button withdrawal, half-assed entry.
|
|
|
|
03/03/2010 07:55:29 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by pjotre7:
Aha, you are right to say you have to adjust your type of picture to the means available. But tt is not said that you can not submit a decent entry with little means. Creative minds are not for sale and a high-end camera is only to improve the outcome of the initial composition. (or shows the microbes on your dirty kitchen background) |
iPhone entry.....some aggressive PP, but still......
|
|
|
|
03/03/2010 07:21:15 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by eaglebeck:
Many times it is about equipment. I could not get some of my wildlife shote if I did not have my long focal length lens. i know you have to set your camera up correctly and have some photo knowledge to get the photo you want. I also do sports and have to use "T" and a high ISO at night football games, shallow and long DOF need to use "A" and composition and backgrounds also come into play.
I have my own standards and do not try to impose them on other photographers or my voting. |
Aha, you are right to say you have to adjust your type of picture to the means available. But tt is not said that you can not submit a decent entry with little means. Creative minds are not for sale and a high-end camera is only to improve the outcome of the initial composition. (or shows the microbes on your dirty kitchen background) |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 07:10:20 PM · #18 |
Many times it is about equipment. I could not get some of my wildlife shote if I did not have my long focal length lens. i know you have to set your camera up correctly and have some photo knowledge to get the photo you want. I also do sports and have to use "T" and a high ISO at night football games, shallow and long DOF need to use "A" and composition and backgrounds also come into play.
I have my own standards and do not try to impose them on other photographers or my voting. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 07:08:29 PM · #19 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by Jac:
hmmm, show me a journalistic photo that isn't a snapshot please? |
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
 |
Umm....that really isn't an accurate example as that image is the second flag raising.....for the camera.... |
Duh. That's my point. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 06:50:29 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by tnun:
What is this righteous hype about effort? Photographs come to us in all our modes of being, sweaty or cool, intense or dreamy. The critical moment, as far as evaluation is concerned, is in choosing it. |
Well, there is some proof (valid for most things in life) that putting in effort improves results.... |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 06:45:24 PM · #21 |
| What is this righteous hype about effort? Photographs come to us in all our modes of being, sweaty or cool, intense or dreamy. The critical moment, as far as evaluation is concerned, is in choosing it. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 06:42:19 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by Nuzzer:
Originally posted by pjotre7:
It is all about the effort and not about the equipment. This shows in the pictures. Great famous shots which we all still love today, were made with the simpelest camera's you can imagine. These photographers would have killed for the options you have today, even in your Nokia or Iphone integrated cameras!
And you have a computer to participate on this website so you are able to crop a picture and do other basic improvements on your "snapshot" with any free software available.
But your uncleaned kitchen as background for your submitted photo has nothing to do with studio or equipment. It has all to do with effort.
Dito with all playmobil and Lego set-ups, rubber ducks and other low life materials.....
I do not think any comments here will influence my personal judgements. I'm 40+ :-) |
Mostly well said. I do however disagree with your wholesale putting down of lego setips, rubber ducks, etc - some of those shots show the photographer has put a lot of effort into the shot, including lighting, dof, etc - sure it makes it harder to connect to the shot but does not show they have not put effort in. |
Well let's keep it on that I personal do not like puppet setups and for me it is a waste of effort...
For those who practise this voodoo photography : there are other websites who specialize in animations.... :o |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 06:31:37 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by Nuzzer:
When I refer to a shot on DPC being a "snapshot" I'm trying to say that it looks like you set the camera to auto, pointed it at the subject, and entered it on DPC. ie: it doesn't look like you've taken any effort to consider comnposition, lighting etc.
It's not a reflection on the need for a studio but on the effort it looks like you've put into making a good DPC image. |
You mean not using any PhotoShop, right?.....8>) |
I agree with Nuzzer. Full auto, point then shoot is just not the same as a snapshot. There's no effort in that, and even if you do get lucky, it's "just not it". And in many cases, people buy a dslr, don't have a clue what M, S, A, P, Av, Tv does, just uses the aoutomatic programs and post it on the web, for instance here. Sure, they can lucky as well, but... still not it... |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 06:26:18 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by pjotre7:
It is all about the effort and not about the equipment. This shows in the pictures. Great famous shots which we all still love today, were made with the simpelest camera's you can imagine. These photographers would have killed for the options you have today, even in your Nokia or Iphone integrated cameras!
And you have a computer to participate on this website so you are able to crop a picture and do other basic improvements on your "snapshot" with any free software available.
But your uncleaned kitchen as background for your submitted photo has nothing to do with studio or equipment. It has all to do with effort.
Dito with all playmobil and Lego set-ups, rubber ducks and other low life materials.....
I do not think any comments here will influence my personal judgements. I'm 40+ :-) |
Mostly well said. I do however disagree with your wholesale putting down of lego setips, rubber ducks, etc - some of those shots show the photographer has put a lot of effort into the shot, including lighting, dof, etc - sure it makes it harder to connect to the shot but does not show they have not put effort in. |
|
|
|
03/03/2010 06:23:13 PM · #25 |
It is all about the effort and not about the equipment. This shows in the pictures. Great famous shots which we all still love today, were made with the simpelest camera's you can imagine. These photographers would have killed for the options you have today, even in your Nokia or Iphone integrated cameras!
And you have a computer to participate on this website so you are able to crop a picture and do other basic improvements on your "snapshot" with any free software available.
But your uncleaned kitchen as background for your submitted photo has nothing to do with studio or equipment. It has all to do with effort.
Dito with all playmobil and Lego set-ups, rubber ducks and other low life materials.....
I do not think any comments here will influence my personal judgements. I'm 40+ :-)
|
|
