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11/13/2008 06:05:09 PM · #1 |
| Anyone who spends less than $50 on her campaign and wins certainly seems fiscally qualified. 6k/annum is not all that great a prize, however, especially when you consider the incumbent will still be paying tuition at a private (Dartmouth is still private?) univerity. |
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11/13/2008 05:53:13 PM · #2 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
I think Ms. Elliot is bitching because she got her ass handed to her by a relative "kid". She should be blaming her own lack of knowledge about new ways to get the word out and my guess is that she didn't take her opponent seriously to really be concerned. HA! HA! HA! on her. I hope the new clerk does a good job. |
I think that this girl, and the rest of the democrats will have to work hard to prove to all that they are worthy of the trust that Americans put in them. I think that there will be many that will be waiting to show even the smallest of falters. |
The Republicans let the Americans down and they were in the highest office for the past 8 years. |
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11/13/2008 05:24:06 PM · #3 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I'm guessing the $51 Facebook ad had little to do with the victory. |
With only a 600 vote margin and particular strength in college towns, that Facebook ad may have had everything to do with Sievers' victory. |
It's possible, but I still doubt it. This cycle young voters were overwhelmingly democrat at least in the presidential contest so the theory that they just voted party lines would explain the 2,400 vote advantage in the college town just as easily. |
Seems to me both the victor and the loser think it was influential ...
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by Katie Zezima:
“I took advantage of new media, and she did not,” Ms. Sievers said |
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Chances are good that the ad provided a spur for the students out for Obama to work their way down the ballot all the way to County Treasurer, a race which for them might otherwise have held little interest.
Message edited by author 2008-11-13 17:24:57. |
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11/13/2008 05:14:32 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I'm guessing the $51 Facebook ad had little to do with the victory. |
With only a 600 vote margin and particular strength in college towns, that Facebook ad may have had everything to do with Sievers' victory. |
It's possible, but I still doubt it. This cycle young voters were overwhelmingly democrat at least in the presidential contest so the theory that they just voted party lines would explain the 2,400 vote advantage in the college town just as easily. |
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11/13/2008 05:09:15 PM · #5 |
Ludicrous. The loser seems to be implying that the winner entered the race for fun and her votes were nothing more than a teen popularity contest, because no 20-year-old could POSSIBLY know anything, or have any interest in politics or her community.
It's been my experience over the past 50 years that the percentage of a student population knowledgable about politics and current events is far higher than that of the general population. The energy and idealism of youth hasn't been ground down yet by the everyday worries about mortgages, childcare, health, etc. Attend any protest and see what the age breakdown is. They young still believe they can change the world, while the middle-aged of us are simply trying to survive it.
Several years ago a small business started up in a local strip mall selling collector cards, comics, role-playing games, etc. It was a well-run, popular and successful business, with the owner involved in all aspects of the business from top to bottom, from inception of the idea on. After a few years he sold the sucessful business for a good price because he decided it was time for university. He was 16 when he opened the store.
We'll be holding our civic elections on Saturday. One of those I plan to vote for on the ballot for city council is the 23-year-old, because I feel the vision and passion of youth is of vital importance to our community.
edit to correct typo
Message edited by author 2008-11-13 17:23:16. |
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11/13/2008 04:45:25 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by JimiRose:
P.S Obama had a huge Facebook campaign... |
Astounding... tap into the almost nearing majority that don't vote, and find yourself in a winning position.... hmmm.....
eta: Amazing whaat happens when you make people feel like they matter again.
Message edited by author 2008-11-13 16:46:58. |
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11/13/2008 04:15:20 PM · #7 |
| P.S Obama had a huge Facebook campaign... |
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11/13/2008 04:13:10 PM · #8 |
 OdysseyF22 is the definition of a legend. It's so true that students are enticed to Universities and Colleges by city councils to help the economy, and then get NOTHING back. In the UK city centre redevelopment in some of the northern ex-industrial cities has been encouraged no end by the influx of students. Cities like Leeds, Manchester, Newcastle and Sheffield would be 10 years from what they look like now if it wasn't for students, and yet there seems to be very little regard for their needs or respect for their contribution to society.
Leeds - a city with over 80,000 students and a population of 440,000 - no student bus fare! But now i'm just being picky... |
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11/13/2008 03:59:20 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I'm guessing the $51 Facebook ad had little to do with the victory. |
With only a 600 vote margin and particular strength in college towns, that Facebook ad may have had everything to do with Sievers' victory. |
The victor seems to think so.
Originally posted by Katie Zezima:
“I took advantage of new media, and she did not,” Ms. Sievers said |
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11/13/2008 03:45:27 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I'm guessing the $51 Facebook ad had little to do with the victory. |
With only a 600 vote margin and particular strength in college towns, that Facebook ad may have had everything to do with Sievers' victory. |
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11/13/2008 03:40:31 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Dartmouth Junior Wins County Election and Starts Town vs. Gown Dispute
By KATIE ZEZIMA
Published: November 12, 2008
Ms. Sievers, now a New Hampshire resident, said she has worked as a bookkeeper and served on the school board in Livingston, Mont., while a student there.
“I have always been interested in finance and involved in politics, which are the reasons why I decided to run,” she said. |
Sounds like she has sufficient prior experience in both finance and civic government to be considered qualified for what must be a pretty part-time job if they're only paying about $500/month. Seems she's no longer a "temporary resident" either ...
As for the incumbent, since "teenybopper" would seem to refer to someone in their teens, and the accused is twenty, let's just say that seems ominous considering the job in dispute involves numbers ...
Message edited by author 2008-11-13 15:41:24. |
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11/13/2008 02:41:15 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
I think Ms. Elliot is bitching because she got her ass handed to her by a relative "kid". She should be blaming her own lack of knowledge about new ways to get the word out and my guess is that she didn't take her opponent seriously to really be concerned. HA! HA! HA! on her. I hope the new clerk does a good job. |
I think that this girl, and the rest of the democrats will have to work hard to prove to all that they are worthy of the trust that Americans put in them. I think that there will be many that will be waiting to show even the smallest of falters.
Message edited by author 2008-11-13 14:41:59. |
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11/13/2008 02:18:27 PM · #13 |
| I think Ms. Elliot is bitching because she got her ass handed to her by a relative "kid". She should be blaming her own lack of knowledge about new ways to get the word out and my guess is that she didn't take her opponent seriously to really be concerned. HA! HA! HA! on her. I hope the new clerk does a good job. |
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11/13/2008 01:53:16 PM · #14 |
The likely true, but much less exciting story is that lots of people, totally uninformed about the candidates voted "democrat" because it's time to vote the bums out. Republicans had an uphill battle across the country this cycle. I'm guessing the $51 Facebook ad had little to do with the victory.
Personally I didn't vote any local positions this year because I know nothing about the candidates other than the signs I see up in the yards. I'm not bashing the democrat voters above for being "uninformed" but am rather saying I bet the vast majority of people vote party lines on those little positions because they know nothing about the candidate. |
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11/13/2008 01:21:51 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by kenskid:
In the U.S. system does it really matter if the winner was qualified? If the person who won is not qualified but fairly elected...even by brainwashed students then that's the end of it. Let the chips fall where they may.
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You would hope the majority would pick the most qualified... that is the bases os a democracy that the judgement (will) of the many is usually right... |
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11/13/2008 11:31:23 AM · #16 |
Originally posted by kenskid:
In the U.S. system does it really matter if the winner was qualified? If the person who won is not qualified but fairly elected...even by brainwashed students then that's the end of it. Let the chips fall where they may. |
:-) Hopefully the new County Treasurer won't be using "chips".
Well, I guess it doesn't matter that much how the money is handled or how the County investments are distributed - does it? |
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11/13/2008 10:59:34 AM · #17 |
In the U.S. system does it really matter if the winner was qualified? If the person who won is not qualified but fairly elected...even by brainwashed students then that's the end of it. Let the chips fall where they may.
There are of course ways to get an office holder taken out of office but the process usually dooms it to failure.
Originally posted by Jac:
Can't really judge what happened without more facts. Is the winner qualified to do the job? If yes then sour grapes. If not and she got elected just because she used facebook and its popularity with the college crowd to get voted in, well then the loser may have a point. But we'll never know because of shoddy reporting by most probably an amateur reporter. |
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11/13/2008 10:45:21 AM · #18 |
Originally posted by OdysseyF22:
This seems very typical to me. Many college towns seem to have the same issue; the people living in them, running businesses in them, want the students there because the students represent a huge customer base, and spend a huge amount of money while at school. BUT, at the same time, the "local residents" don't want to treat college kids as "real" citizens. In short, they're willing to take our money, but don't want to give us any respect at all.
From the articles (which, granted, don't offer a lot of information), Sievers sounds qualified enough - let's face it, the job of county treasurer doesn't take a rocket scientist. Look at the other people who run for local office: house mothers, local businessmen - my hometown just elected the guy who owns the local tuxedo rental shop as a representative. What qualifications do any of these people have that a college student doesn't? I tend to think that students are probably more in-touch with current events and developments than most adults are.
The real issue here is the continuing misinformed notion that just because someone is 20, they cannot possibly know what's going on, or be responsible in such a position. On the other hand, take a look at the 40, 50, and 60 year olds who are in various offices, then look at how many of them are misrepresenting the public, are corrupt, or are just plain stupid.
Furthermore, claiming that students don't have a stake in a community is a great way to widen the gap between students and the community. Towns that welcome college students have better relationships with them - make the students feel they are part of the community, and more of them will give back to it. When you alienate them, they all graduate and leave because they hate the place.
There's no shortage of students who see an opportunity in their college town and build on it while students, or who remain afterwards to start a business, etc. Not to mention the power of alumni when it comes to recruiting more students for that school (again, recall the economic impact of the students). Students are very much a part of a community, like it or not, and many of them do have real concern for the wellbeing and future of those communities. It's pathetic how the locals respond to a student's olive branch.
One day college students are being attacked for not taking part in the system, for being transient and "without roots," and the next day they're attacked for taking part in the system and expressing a sense of roots.
To the residents of Grafton County, NH, I can only say this, in my best Dr. House voice - "You're a moron!" |
Excellent!!! I suggest you email this to Mr. Flower. |
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11/13/2008 10:42:13 AM · #19 |
This seems very typical to me. Many college towns seem to have the same issue; the people living in them, running businesses in them, want the students there because the students represent a huge customer base, and spend a huge amount of money while at school. BUT, at the same time, the "local residents" don't want to treat college kids as "real" citizens. In short, they're willing to take our money, but don't want to give us any respect at all.
From the articles (which, granted, don't offer a lot of information), Sievers sounds qualified enough - let's face it, the job of county treasurer doesn't take a rocket scientist. Look at the other people who run for local office: house mothers, local businessmen - my hometown just elected the guy who owns the local tuxedo rental shop as a representative. What qualifications do any of these people have that a college student doesn't? I tend to think that students are probably more in-touch with current events and developments than most adults are.
The real issue here is the continuing misinformed notion that just because someone is 20, they cannot possibly know what's going on, or be responsible in such a position. On the other hand, take a look at the 40, 50, and 60 year olds who are in various offices, then look at how many of them are misrepresenting the public, are corrupt, or are just plain stupid.
Furthermore, claiming that students don't have a stake in a community is a great way to widen the gap between students and the community. Towns that welcome college students have better relationships with them - make the students feel they are part of the community, and more of them will give back to it. When you alienate them, they all graduate and leave because they hate the place.
There's no shortage of students who see an opportunity in their college town and build on it while students, or who remain afterwards to start a business, etc. Not to mention the power of alumni when it comes to recruiting more students for that school (again, recall the economic impact of the students). Students are very much a part of a community, like it or not, and many of them do have real concern for the wellbeing and future of those communities. It's pathetic how the locals respond to a student's olive branch.
One day college students are being attacked for not taking part in the system, for being transient and "without roots," and the next day they're attacked for taking part in the system and expressing a sense of roots.
To the residents of Grafton County, NH, I can only say this, in my best Dr. House voice - "You're a moron!"
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11/13/2008 10:18:35 AM · #20 |
Originally posted by vxpra:
Originally posted by Mr. Flower :
"they don’t pay taxes here, so they’re not concerned with how the treasury is handled.” |
Is there no sales tax??? Is there no "use" tax on hotels and restaurants?? Mr. Flower is a poor spin doctor. |
Seems that now that they're in the loosers seat they need to find someone to blame... and "brainwashed" transient college students who have no real 'stake' in the community is going to be their scapegoat... Sad actually |
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11/13/2008 10:05:35 AM · #21 |
Originally posted by Mr. Flower :
"they don’t pay taxes here, so they’re not concerned with how the treasury is handled.” |
Is there no sales tax??? Is there no "use" tax on hotels and restaurants?? Mr. Flower is a poor spin doctor. |
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11/13/2008 09:54:38 AM · #22 |
And just for fun, here's another one
HAVERHILL, N.H. - A county treasurer who lost re-election last week to a Dartmouth College student says most "real" people backed her, and that she lost because of "brainwashed" college students.
Grafton County Treasurer Carol Elliott, a Republican, said students just voted for the Democratic ticket, which included Vanessa Sievers, 20, a Dartmouth College junior. Sievers won by nearly 600 votes out of 42,000 cast after targeting voters at Dartmouth and Plymouth State University through a $42 ad on the Web site Facebook.
"It was the brainwashed college kids that made the difference," Elliott, 66, told the Valley News of Lebanon. She said she had little faith that either Sievers or Register of Deeds Bill Sharp will fulfill their duties adequately. Sharp, a Democrat, narrowly won a second term.
"You’ve got a buffoon for a register of deeds, and you’ve got a teenybopper for a treasurer," Elliott said. "I’m concerned for the citizens of Grafton County."
The part-time job pays $6,408. It involves keeping tabs on all county money, making investments and making payments ordered by county commissioners.
Sievers said Wednesday she was surprised by what she called Elliott’s "brutal attack."
"She’s never met me before," she said in a phone interview with The Associated Press. "She has no idea what I’m like."
Sievers, a geography and history major from Big Sky, Mont., said she has been active in politics for many years and has worked on numerous New Hampshire campaigns, ranging from the mayoral race in Lebanon to Bill Richardson’s presidential campaign. She ran for county treasurer at the urging of Sharp and other Democrats.
"I’ve always believed that being involved in local government is part of your responsibility as a citizen and is a way to get involved in your community," she said.
Sievers said her age has nothing to do with her qualifications, noting that she has worked as a bookkeeper, managed her family’s finances and has been thoroughly researching investment options to prepare for her new job. She also took issue with Elliott’s claim that college students were brainwashed.
"I don’t know why people think college students are less informed than other members of the community. A lot of students get very, very involved in their communities, are extraordinarily involved in politics in the area, in doing community service, everything," she said. "I think college students are connected, and sometimes know more than the ’real’ citizens. ... I think we’re just as real citizens as anyone else in the county."
While not embracing Elliott’s comments, Grafton County Republican Chairman Ludlow Flower said he was concerned that college students living in the county for a limited time were deciding elections for county offices.
"I have no problem with them voting for national political tickets, because they do have a stake in this whole country, but they don’t have a stake in our local community here," Flower said, noting that Elliott has more than 20 years of experience as a public servant.
"It just seems a shame that we have yet to figure out a way to make this democratic process for county offices more reflective of our local circumstances," he said.
from here
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11/13/2008 09:49:48 AM · #23 |
Dartmouth Junior Wins County Election and Starts Town vs. Gown Dispute
By KATIE ZEZIMA
Published: November 12, 2008
Vanessa Sievers, a Dartmouth College junior, was not content to wait tables or make coffee as a side job. Instead she ran for treasurer of Grafton County, N.H., and won, unseating the incumbent and unleashing a war of words.
Jennifer Argote/The Dartmouth
Vanessa Sievers invested $51 in a Facebook advertisement.
The current county treasurer, Carol Elliott, 68, called Ms. Sievers, 20, a “teenybopper” in an interview with a local newspaper, The Valley News, and said she had won only because “brainwashed college kids” had voted for the Democratic ticket.
Ms. Sievers beat Ms. Elliott by 586 votes out of about 42,000 cast, and won big in Hanover, home to Dartmouth, and Plymouth, home to both Ms. Elliott and Plymouth State University.
The part-time treasurer’s job pays $6,408 annually and oversees the investments and payroll of the county, which is home to about 85,000 people.
“Carol Elliott and I have never met, and I personally don’t have anything against her,” Ms. Sievers said in a telephone interview. Ms. Elliott did not return calls seeking comment.
Ms. Sievers, a geography and history major from Montana, decided to run after the county registrar of deeds, Bill Sharp, approached the Dartmouth College Democrats.
“I said this will be a nice part-time position for one of your people, and we’re going to need the college kids to turn out for the election,” Mr. Sharp said.
There has been no love lost between Ms. Elliott and Mr. Sharp, who contends Ms. Elliott would not tell him how much money was in a county account linked to his office. In the Valley News interview, Ms. Elliott called Mr. Sharp a “buffoon.”
Ms. Sievers, now a New Hampshire resident, said she has worked as a bookkeeper and served on the school board in Livingston, Mont., while a student there.
“I have always been interested in finance and involved in politics, which are the reasons why I decided to run,” she said.
Ms. Sievers’s big investment in the campaign was a $51 advertisement on Facebook, which she paid for with her own money.
“I took advantage of new media, and she did not,” Ms. Sievers said. The county Republican chairman, Ludlow Flower, however, does not think that new media or college students belong in a county race.
“College students are not involved in local things at all,” Mr. Flower said. “They’re only involved in Dartmouth College. They don’t buy property here, they don’t pay taxes here, so they’re not concerned with how the treasury is handled.”
found from Here
Message edited by author 2008-11-13 09:50:19. |
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11/13/2008 09:34:30 AM · #24 |
Originally posted by glad2badad:
Sounds like this college student just found the perfect part-time job! :-D |
No kidding; first thing that occurred to me LOL!
R. |
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11/13/2008 09:32:22 AM · #25 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Originally posted by glad2badad:
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
students are a constantly-shifting segment of the population, they only hang around for 4 years, and they don't have to live with the consequences of their actions at the community level.
R. |
The County Treasurer position is held for how long? Re-elected every 2, 4, ??? years? |
Just checked it out at the County website; the Sheriff, the County Attorney, the Registrar of Deeds, and the County Treasurer serve 2-year terms.
R. |
Sounds like this college student just found the perfect part-time job! :-D |
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