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09/07/2007 01:56:59 PM · #1 |
| It seems to work for M.O.C. who has won all his ribbons with pictures of lightning with names to meet each challenge :) |
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09/07/2007 01:46:13 PM · #2 |
Originally posted by Sam94720:
 focuspoint, I agree, if you happen to have taken a picture during the challenge period that meets the challenge, then of course submit it.
I'm more concerned about step 4 in my second lineup. |
It should called "experimenting" not "entering" in this case. But, if people "experiment" with their “not so challenge worthy” photos, they should NOT complain about the votes. If you are ok with low score, experiment, you never know maybe people also think your experiment is on the money, most likely NOT.
:)
PS: I do experiment sometimes, and I yell for my scores just for fun :D here I admit it :D |
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09/07/2007 01:39:16 PM · #3 |
focuspoint, I agree, if you happen to have taken a picture during the challenge period that meets the challenge, then of course submit it.
I'm more concerned about step 4 in my second lineup. |
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09/07/2007 01:10:31 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by Sam94720:
...If you don't have a photo that meets the challenge, don't submit... |
I disagree on one thing here. It doesn't matter you see the challenge and take the picture for that challenge or select a picture already taken, the most important thing is we all "think" the photo we entered is within the challenge (most of us I believe)... If people don't know the meaning or concept of the challenge, they will take the wrong pictures anyway. Sometimes, what we have in our hands the best.. not always the case, but if you take lots of picture daily, or weekly, there is a big chance you will hit one or more challenges with one or two of them.
But, logically thinking, the first lineup should be followed for each challenge we want to enter. |
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09/07/2007 12:53:16 PM · #5 |
I think challenges were intended to work like this:
1. Challenge topic is announced
2. User sees challenge topic
3. User thinks about what kind of picture they could take
4. User takes and edits picture
5. User submits picture with a suitable title
If a user follows these steps, their picture is unlikely to get DNMCed - even if they interpret the challenge topic in a creative way.
However, some users seem (judging by their entries) to do the following:
1. User takes a bunch of pictures unrelated with DPC
2. User sees challenge topic
3. User tries to find a picture that might meet the challenge
4. If there is no such picture, they pick the one that comes closest and make the connection in the title, if necessary using the word "not"
5. They submit the picture
And then they get low scores and DNMCs, which doesn't benefit anyone.
So what I would suggest as a guideline is this: If you don't have a photo that meets the challenge, don't submit. Take part in the next challenge. It means less troube for everyone and voting becomes more enjoyable.
Message edited by author 2007-09-07 12:53:38. |
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09/06/2007 08:01:33 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Have I ever encountered images that I earnestly believed did not meet the challenge criteria, Yes I have, but you would be hard pressed to demonstrate that I voted it a 1.
Ray |
You are reading more than what I've posted. The only thing I've said is if you vote 1 because of DNMC (i.e. a DNMC nazi) then you're not following the rules as they are worded. That's it.
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09/06/2007 06:13:50 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Yes. The use of the term "sweet tooth" indicates the sugary crap.
If it was the general "Photograph something that is "candy"", then that would be more wide open. |
What if someone enters a candy that is sour? Surely that can't 'satisfy your sweet tooth'...
Since there is no such thing as a real "sweet tooth", from an anatomical perspective, couldn't that be interpreted as a figure of speech (meaning something that you enjoy)?
What if "sweet tooth" means something totally different in another culture?
At this point, I'm just playing devil's advocate here...I don't really give a rat's ass, and I understand to score well in a challenge, one needs to enter an image that will strike the majority of voters (however narrow minded I think they can be). To do well in a challenge, you need to stifle your creativity (to a degree) to appease the masses (voters). It's a game. Strategy and crap...
I'm jus' sayin'...
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09/06/2007 05:44:31 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by mattmac:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
IF THE THEME AS STATED IS SPECIFIC, then yes, a DNMC is warranted if it does not MEET THE STATED THEME. Get it? Got it? Good. |
Is the Candy II Challenge Description specific?
"Satisfy your sweet tooth by photographing candy."
If I was going to enter this challenge (which I'm not), I'd definitely enter something that relates to that sugary crap that some people eat (for fear of not appeasing the DNMCers)...because I would want my image to score as highly as possible.
But what about those who enter images that convey eye candy?
Or nose candy?
Should those be DNMC'd? |
Yes. The use of the term "sweet tooth" indicates the sugary crap.
If it was the general "Photograph something that is "candy"", then that would be more wide open.
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09/06/2007 05:38:19 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
IF THE THEME AS STATED IS SPECIFIC, then yes, a DNMC is warranted if it does not MEET THE STATED THEME. Get it? Got it? Good. |
Is the Candy II Challenge Description specific?
"Satisfy your sweet tooth by photographing candy."
If I was going to enter this challenge (which I'm not), I'd definitely enter something that relates to that sugary crap that some people eat (for fear of not appeasing the DNMCers)...because I would want my image to score as highly as possible.
But what about those who enter images that convey eye candy?
Or nose candy?
Should those be DNMC'd?
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09/06/2007 05:35:50 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
'Twasn't big enough ;) |
Oh well back to the Bank! :-P |
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09/06/2007 05:31:40 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Whatever happened to "vote how you feel right, as long as you're consistant"?
Every day there are threads telling us that, no matter HOW we vote, we're wrong, followed by threads bitching about the lack of votes/comments. Geeee, I wonder why??
Yup, I vote down for not meeting the challenge if I just can't find a connection, no matter how hard I try. If it's very specific and there is no attempt to even shoehorn then yup, I might even give it a 1 (though I'm sure I never have). Sue me. Just because you might not agree, that's still my right as a voter. |
No you need to vote my way! Did you not get the check I sent? :-P |
'Twasn't big enough ;) |
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09/06/2007 05:27:07 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Whatever happened to "vote how you feel right, as long as you're consistant"?
Every day there are threads telling us that, no matter HOW we vote, we're wrong, followed by threads bitching about the lack of votes/comments. Geeee, I wonder why??
Yup, I vote down for not meeting the challenge if I just can't find a connection, no matter how hard I try. If it's very specific and there is no attempt to even shoehorn then yup, I might even give it a 1 (though I'm sure I never have). Sue me. Just because you might not agree, that's still my right as a voter. |
No you need to vote my way! Did you not get the check I sent? :-P |
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09/06/2007 05:23:54 PM · #13 |
Whatever happened to "vote how you feel right, as long as you're consistant"?
Every day there are threads telling us that, no matter HOW we vote, we're wrong, followed by threads bitching about the lack of votes/comments. Geeee, I wonder why??
Yup, I vote down for not meeting the challenge if I just can't find a connection, no matter how hard I try. If it's very specific and there is no attempt to even shoehorn then yup, I might even give it a 1 (though I'm sure I never have). Sue me. Just because you might not agree, that's still my right as a voter. |
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09/06/2007 05:05:27 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
... If the theme is pretty specific, then sorry, something either meets it or does not. Pretty cut and dried. |
So in other words I'm right. You wouldn't consider anything else if they didn't meet the pretty specific theme. |
Perhaps I am misinterpreting your comment Yanko, but the mere fact that HawkeyeLonewolf indicates that something either meets a challenge or does not does not necessarily equate to a low score.
There are several variables that one should take into consideration when voting on an image, and meeting the challenge description is but one of them. It does not necessarily follow that just because someone considered an image as falling into their interpretation of DNMC that they automatically vote the image a 1.
Have I ever encountered images that I earnestly believed did not meet the challenge criteria, Yes I have, but you would be hard pressed to demonstrate that I voted it a 1.
Ray |
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09/06/2007 04:56:34 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
... and you would base that argument on what standards of evaluation. I have yet to see one scintilla of evidence that would support the argument that the DNMC Nazis (as you call them) make the challenge topic the only criteria when voting. |
When someone casts a vote of 1 because of DNMC they clearly didn't consider anything else now would they? |
Bzzt! Wrong.
If the theme is general, most I'm sure give latitude and there would be few DNMC. If the theme is pretty specific, then sorry, something either meets it or does not. Pretty cut and dried. |
So in other words I'm right. You wouldn't consider anything else if they didn't meet the pretty specific theme. |
Yep... glad you agree with me then.
IF THE THEME AS STATED IS SPECIFIC, then yes, a DNMC is warranted if it does not MEET THE STATED THEME. Get it? Got it? Good.
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09/06/2007 04:53:42 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
... and you would base that argument on what standards of evaluation. I have yet to see one scintilla of evidence that would support the argument that the DNMC Nazis (as you call them) make the challenge topic the only criteria when voting. |
When someone casts a vote of 1 because of DNMC they clearly didn't consider anything else now would they? |
Bzzt! Wrong.
If the theme is general, most I'm sure give latitude and there would be few DNMC. If the theme is pretty specific, then sorry, something either meets it or does not. Pretty cut and dried. |
So in other words I'm right. You wouldn't consider anything else if they didn't meet the pretty specific theme.
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09/06/2007 04:47:04 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
... and you would base that argument on what standards of evaluation. I have yet to see one scintilla of evidence that would support the argument that the DNMC Nazis (as you call them) make the challenge topic the only criteria when voting. |
When someone casts a vote of 1 because of DNMC they clearly didn't consider anything else now would they? |
Bzzt! Wrong.
If the theme is general, most I'm sure give latitude and there would be few DNMC. If the theme is pretty specific, then sorry, something either meets it or does not. Pretty cut and dried.
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09/06/2007 04:01:11 PM · #18 |
A simple way to at least afford the photog the opportunity to explain why their entry isn't a complete shoehorn would be to allow a hundred characters Entry Description below the entry. Don't see why this would not appeal to members of either camp.
edit: im sure this has been suggested before
Message edited by author 2007-09-06 16:01:27. |
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09/06/2007 03:51:08 PM · #19 |
The bottom line here is the community as a whole overwhelmingly prefers images that obviously "meet the challenge", and images that meet the challenge in a more subtle way, no matter how intriguing and well-made they may otherwise be, rarely do very well in the voting.
Those who are "protesting" this would like to see a change in the mindset of the community as a whole, something that is not likely to happen. They would like to see the challenge topic viewed as a springboard to focused creativity in image-making, with the community showing outright approval of subtle, mysterious, surprising takes on the challenge. This, of course, is not likely to happen.
Related to this, there is a lot of annoyance directed at folks who give very, very low scores to images simply because they do not, in the voter's eye, "meet the challenge", and THIS is something that could be changed, possibly. In my experience, very few entries, percentage-wise, actually utterly fail to meet the challenge, and many that actually DO meet the challenge and are also excellent images finish in the middle of the pack, apparently because a significant number of voters don't actually see the connection tot he challenge, either because they are not taking the time to think about the images, or because they are set in their ways that any approach to the challenge that doesn't agree with their approach is automatically DNMC.
This I find sad. What I like best about DPC is enjoying the myriad different ways people approach the challenge topic, each image on its own terms.
R.
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09/06/2007 03:49:50 PM · #20 |
Where is that popcorn???
Message edited by author 2007-09-06 15:50:24. |
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09/06/2007 03:47:58 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
... and you would base that argument on what standards of evaluation. I have yet to see one scintilla of evidence that would support the argument that the DNMC Nazis (as you call them) make the challenge topic the only criteria when voting. |
When someone casts a vote of 1 because of DNMC they clearly didn't consider anything else now would they? |
I gather you failed to comprehend the gist of my argument, that being:
YOU have no wait of knowing that:
- they cast a vote of 1,
- that they did so solely because the image in their opinion DNMC,
- that they failed to consider any other aspect of the image.
Ray |
Of course I do. People admit doing just that in the forums all the time. See the post above for your evidence! LOL.
Message edited by author 2007-09-06 15:48:34.
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09/06/2007 03:46:25 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by yanko:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
... and you would base that argument on what standards of evaluation. I have yet to see one scintilla of evidence that would support the argument that the DNMC Nazis (as you call them) make the challenge topic the only criteria when voting. |
When someone casts a vote of 1 because of DNMC they clearly didn't consider anything else now would they? |
I gather you failed to comprehend the gist of my argument, that being:
YOU have no wait of knowing that:
- they cast a vote of 1,
- that they did so solely because the image in their opinion DNMC,
- that they failed to consider any other aspect of the image.
Ray |
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09/06/2007 03:44:35 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by yanko:
When someone casts a vote of 1 because of DNMC they clearly didn't consider anything else now would they? |
This is correct. Sig Heil. |
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09/06/2007 03:43:38 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
... and you would base that argument on what standards of evaluation. I have yet to see one scintilla of evidence that would support the argument that the DNMC Nazis (as you call them) make the challenge topic the only criteria when voting. |
When someone casts a vote of 1 because of DNMC they clearly didn't consider anything else now would they?
Message edited by author 2007-09-06 15:45:25.
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09/06/2007 03:39:05 PM · #25 |
Originally posted by yanko:
What the rules say:
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You should:
- keep an open mind to other interpretations of the challenge topic.
- consider the challenge topic when voting, and adjust your score accordingly.
What the DNMC Nazi do:
-----------------------------------------------
You should:
- Not keep an open mind to other interpretations of the challenge topic.
- Not only consider the challenge topic but make it the only criteria when voting.
Yup, water and oil alright that is rules and voters. |
... and you would base that argument on what standards of evaluation. I have yet to see one scintilla of evidence that would support the argument that the DNMC Nazis (as you call them) make the challenge topic the only criteria when voting.
What we have here is yet another example of people chasing windmills and seeing conspiracies where none exist.
Is it possible that individuals lower their score because they believe the submitter failed to meet the challenge, yes indeed it is, just as it is possible that some might vote and image higher because they happen to have an attachment to the subject being displayed.
This whole argument is in my humble opinion a tempest in a tea pot, as I firmly believe that in the end, the difference is scores would in all likelyhood prove to be negligeable at best.
Ray |
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