Sub-club / mentor - DPChallenge Forums

02/25/2013 11:39:40 AM · #1

Originally posted by CaptUnderpants:

[Any other assignments you want me to do Bear or Derek ?

From my original post:

Originally posted by bear_music:

And so forth, and so on. Your assignment; get out that brick and lamp and make some shots illustrating these principles. Then get out in the field and disregard subjects altogether; wherever you SEE nice light fully expressing some particular space or object, snap a shot of it. Post your results here :-)

So get out and PRACTICE with light for a bit, make this your single goal. Don't worry about "subject" or even "composition" overmuch, just get in the habit of SEEING the light, not the subject/composition. And when you see a nice bit of light you want to record, walk around it, crouch down, stand up, study it from different angles, document it.

Let me make this clear: we're less interested, right now, in going out to "find an interesting rock to photograph" or "find a nice view to photograph". No, what we're looking for is nice light, and when we find it we want to record it, no matter how banal the erstwhile "subject" may be. Peeling paint? Nice light! Oil on your driveway? Check out that LIGHT, dude! Get in the habit of seeing how the light interacts with the world, instead of seeing the world "as objects", and you are becoming a different class of photographer.

So that's your assignment for a bit, and anyone else's who cares to join in: get out in the world and chase down the light!

Message edited by author 2013-02-25 11:40:40.

Panasonic LUMIX DMC-LX100

02/25/2013 09:48:41 AM · #2

Originally posted by PennyClick:

The photographer's ephemeris is a great program to find out, for any location, what the direction of the sun and also it's elevation will be at any point in time. I'll see if I can find the link for you. It does the same for the moon too.

ETA: Here is the link: The photographer's ephemeris. I don't know where you are in Florida but I just looked at the details in the vicinity of Miami and found the following. The highest elevation the sun reached today was 54.9 degrees above the horizon, at 12:40pm, and at 8:30am, about 2 hours after sunrise, the sun's elevation was still only 20.9 degrees above the horizon.

Thanks Penny, Illcheck it out, never even knew this existed. I also found the Iphone app. Ill start studying it. Thanks everyone. Any other assignments you want me to do Bear or Derek ?

spiritualspatula

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

02/25/2013 12:38:34 AM · #3

Yeah, Ephemeris is rad. I use it for determining locations for some shots in the middle of nowhere. If you can do raking light in one direction, you can do raking backlight just by switching your direction into the light source. But yeah, you are definitely limited as to when you can shoot them, particularly there.

Leo

Apple iPhone Xr

02/25/2013 12:32:20 AM · #4

Originally posted by PennyClick:

Nice. Thanks for posting.
They have iPhone app and Android app links too.

02/25/2013 12:27:59 AM · #5

You got the kid in backlight and flat light just dandy, yup. As for photographing architecture, it's actually often the case that very high light is useful for vertically raking a particular surface, which will highlight stucco texture, window detail, stuff like that. As long as there's not an overhanging roof that shades the whole wall anyway. Penny put you on the right track with the ephemeris. Study it and you'll see just how powerful a tool it can be.

PenelopeK

Sony Alpha a7 II

02/24/2013 11:05:33 PM · #6

02/24/2013 10:54:53 PM · #7

I cant figure out how to take a photo of my house with raking light or back light because the sun is always over head here in Florida. Im thinking im going to have to wake up early to catch sunrise to get raking light and also be available at sunset for raking back light in order to get these shots. I also have to figure out which side of the house id be photographing to get these correctly. Am I on the right track?

02/23/2013 11:08:36 AM · #8

this mornings test didn't last long as the patience of my five year old wore thin rather quickly.

After he decided to sprint to the playground behind him I should have taken the raking light pictures of the field but it was still early in the morning and I wasn't thinking clearly.

Ill try and go outside of my house and get a shot of the raking light/backlight on my house if I can. Strong light too.

Panasonic LUMIX DMC-LX100

02/23/2013 12:57:48 AM · #9

Damn Derek, that looked like it took you some time, I know you have a lot going on right now and I really appreciate that you did all that for me. I see the subtle change in every photo. This is what I plan on doing with my 5 year old tomorrow out in a field with natural light if he has the patience for it.

spiritualspatula

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

02/22/2013 10:14:30 PM · #10

Originally posted by CaptUnderpants:

I see it, such subtle changes makes a lot different looks. Great lesson. Ill do the field shooting tomorrow morning I forgot today was Friday and my son had school, I was gonna use him as the subject so as i rotated around I can see the difference on him as well as the field. Ill post those results here as well.

Well, before I had checked back into the thread, I had already shot some things to illustrate the same effect on the human face. I'd still encourage you to do the same, but here are some for everybody else to see, as well.

All shots were using an SB900 with a Lumiquest Softbox LTp. You'll notice there is no 90 degree decline right, which is because I didn't feel like moving my couch. You'll also see some variation in the light, because I didn't have much room to shot and currently am using an improvised boom, so the on axis shots are all shot with the light source further away. And because the distance was changing some, I was using ttl for speed. Anyway, it still shows the premise. I'll arrange them in this post according to where the light source was. My nomenclature lists the angle relative to the angle of view for the camera, so 90 left is perpendicular to the camera view, meaning it is like a side strip light or similar.

I've provided a key to show what the lights look like for the subject. I did not show overhead or the side lights as they aren't actually visible to the subject unless they turn their head and look.

___________________________

Message edited by author 2013-02-24 16:35:14.

02/22/2013 05:07:13 PM · #11

02/22/2013 04:38:14 PM · #12

That's more like it! Notice how you're picking up the detail of the bevel on the end now? That's one of the more subtle aspects of lighting, especially natural lighting; if the light were moved a little clockwise, that bevel would be lit nearly as much as its matching face and that detail would be minimized. Move the light counter-clockwise, to make it more of a raking light, and you'd also lose that detail.

In natural lighting situations, landscapes and architecture, it's easy to accept the light the way you happen to find it because it looks pretty good, not realizing that if you waited a few minutes, or for that matter came back in a few hours (or earlier in the day the next day), the light could be MUCH more descriptive.

Message edited by author 2013-02-22 16:38:56.

02/22/2013 04:28:55 PM · #13

Strong light

02/22/2013 12:04:45 PM · #14

From an angular perspective, which is what we're talking about here, you stand at 6 o'clock on a clockface, and the subject's in the center. Bringing the light "closer" to you means moving it from, say, 3 o'clock to 5 o'clock. On-camera flash or a light shining from behind you is a light "at the same place" as you are. A light at 12 o'clock is as far from you as it's possible to get, in an angular sense. This was kinda fuzzy terminology, I admit :-)

Panasonic LUMIX DMC-LX100

02/22/2013 11:46:17 AM · #15

definitely your 2nd picture, I see what you mean, I was confused bc Bear said to bring that light closer to me, I would be behind the camera so I moved it closer to the camera instead of off at the proper angle, I will re take the strong light photo again tonight, I find the lower the light in the house the easier it is for the camera to catch the light I'm using which was mentioned by Bear formerly in this thread. I had too much outside lighting. I greatly appreciate everyone's help with this. Don't get me wrong I feel a bit "SLOW" but its clearly helping me learn properly. I apologize if I'm frustrating anyone, I just wanna learn so I can improve.

Leo

Apple iPhone Xr

02/22/2013 07:11:21 AM · #16

Great learning thread. Thanks capt undies for starting the thread, thanks bear for the explanations/lessons, thanks spirit for elaborating.
I gotta keep my eye on this.

FourPointX

Canon EOS-60D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

02/22/2013 07:02:21 AM · #17

Originally posted by mrchhas:

This may become the most viewed thread for 90% of DPC'ers... thanks to everyone participating!

mad props to the captain for starting this, and for r/derek/anyone who's so willing to help. this is awesome.

spiritualspatula

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

02/22/2013 05:28:10 AM · #18

Originally posted by CaptUnderpants:

better?

It looks like your light is still perpendicular to the brickface, whereas you want it angled.

Why the angle? You want the light angled because it will show the texture. Think of a perpendicular light source as a sledehammer that destroys and flattens details. This is why everybody dislikes on camera flash- it literally rids your subject of structure that is actually there.

Check these out-

Which one is lit how Bear is saying? You can figure it out based on where the reflection is on the table as well as the shadow that's being cast.
Now, look at the tape dispenser and see what each treatment has done to the result.

mrchhas

Apple iPhone 15 Pro Max

02/22/2013 03:41:08 AM · #19

This may become the most viewed thread for 90% of DPC'ers... thanks to everyone participating!

02/22/2013 12:23:36 AM · #20

Like this:

02/21/2013 11:33:38 PM · #21

better?

02/21/2013 11:17:20 PM · #22

Yeah, there ya go! Now do the Strong Light over with it throwing a shadow on the tabletop at 45 degrees (light at 45 degrees to the long face). See how the shadow will help make the whole form more solid-looking.

02/21/2013 11:12:51 PM · #23

I see a big difference, hopefully this is correct!

02/21/2013 11:08:42 PM · #24

Originally posted by CaptUnderpants:

Are you saying the strong light should have had the light facing the solid part of the brick head on, which in your illustration would have been in the bottom right corner?

No, that's what YOUR shot did; move the light just a tad more towards you and it would have been RAKING the long side of your brick. Typical "strong" light would be at around 45 degrees to the surface being shot, whilst your setup has it essentially perpendicular. On my diagram, "strong" light would be parallel to the top and bottom edges of the frame, from the right side.

Message edited by author 2013-02-21 23:09:41.