Olnos deserves an explanation! - DPChallenge Forums

Pentax DA 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 AF

04/14/2004 03:31:55 AM · #1

What is wrong with this image that got a 4.8 in the "wheels" challenge? Olnos deserves an explanation.

I'd like to hear feedback from the 113 voters who rated this image 4 or less. You know who you are.

This image is almost compositionally perfect. The crop is tight and contains little distractions from the main theme. Lighting is well distributed without hot spots. It fits the rule of thirds well and has decent application of shallow depth of field. Red, blue and yellow are prominent and that always adds eye candy in color photography. It is technically superior and does not suffer from digital haloing or the dreaded jaggies. Not only that but it tells a touching story of a little girl learning to ride a bike. That story alone meets the challenge better than most of the static "wheels" challenge entries. This image isn't just good, it is GREAT.

So what are it's faults? I challenge you 113 voters out there to justify it deserves your rating. I bet you can't.

faidoi

Pentax K10D

04/14/2004 03:42:37 AM · #2

The "4" I gave pictures was because the wheel was barely in view. Granted the look and expression of the girl learning how to ride her bike added interest to the shot.

pitsaman

Canon EOS-30D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

04/14/2004 03:44:20 AM · #3

Nothing wrong with the photo,beautiful portrait of a beautiful girl with blue eyes !
Most of the voters here put 90 % weight on the topic "Wheel" and little on the photo quality!
I bet Ansel Adams will get 20-30 scores under 4 also!
Wheel on the photo is in right corner where observer put at least attention and the girl is a main subject here!

BTW my Robin got 18 ones and twos because there is "not enough orange" color ! LOL

Message edited by author 2004-04-14 03:47:03.

boomer

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

04/14/2004 03:48:31 AM · #4

In and of itself, it's a good picture. That said, the image doesn't make me think about WHEELS, it makes me think about the little girl. The subject of this photograph is the girl, not the wheel. Her expression is wonderful and compelling. But the theme was WHEELS, and IMHO, this image could have done better to meet the challenge.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

04/14/2004 04:04:12 AM · #5

I would not have rated it four or below.

Wheels are the subject matter -- they would be even if there wasn't one in plain view. How does riding a biCYCLE not fit the theme of wheels? For a photo to be "about" a subject doesn't always require that the photo SHOW the subject, but that's not even an issue here.

The instructions didn't say "take your best side-view shot of a wheel."

soccerdad

Fujifilm FinePix S2 Pro

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8

04/14/2004 05:10:13 AM · #6

This seems like it might be a useful discussion for all, so, I'm willing to play guinea pig, and put up one of my weaker efforts for more scrutiny. Here is my Wheels submission and two outtakes that I seriously considered. In the two alternates, the wheel is more of the focal point of the photo, and in the submission, I tried to use the wheel as a prop.

In short, what I would appreciate is a quick summary of what are the scores and comments you would leave for each of these options.

Submission (Ending score: 4.795)

Alternate B

Alternate C

For reference, here are the details of the challenge:

Challenge: Wheels
Details: From the car to the roulette table, wheels of all types abound! Your challenge this week is to capture any type of wheel in your photograph.

Note: Thanks in advance
Bill

Kavey

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

Sigma 18-125mm f/3.5-5.6 DC for Canon

04/14/2004 05:27:10 AM · #7

Steve,
I didn't vote in the Wheels challenge but I can't say I would have scored Olnas' entry more than a 5. Whilst you say that it's compositionally strong, well lit etc it just doesn't appeal to me personally very much as an image and voting is all about how images appeal to voters as individuals. We don't vote purely on meeting challenge and/ or technical merit but also on how much we actually like the images. Even with the emotional connection with the little girl and the challenge theme being met (I agree it's met well) it just doesn't sing out to me.

Bill,
I much prefer Alternative B to the submission - I find it more dynamic, more unusual, more striking.

rananculus

Olympus C-4040Z

04/14/2004 05:42:03 AM · #8

I gave this foto an 8, but your comment is out of line here. Photography is subjective, and on this site, majority rules. The subject of this picture is the girl, not the wheel. It is encouraged here that we give maximum consideration to the theme. That's the dificulty of this challange oriented site. Coming up with ideas twice a week that fit. My guess is that many people didn't think that it met the challange. You are exactly right that this is a wonderful shot, but you're playing long odds going 113 to 1.

Message edited by author 2004-04-14 05:55:15.

SharQ

Canon EOS-30D

Canon EF 28-135mm F/3.5-5.6 IS USM

04/14/2004 05:47:55 AM · #9

stDavidson: Who are you to claim that everybody else on this site have bad judgement? I would have given this picture a 3 or a 4, mainly because "wheel" is not the primary message in the photo. Frustration over not being able to ride a bike, perhaps. If the title was "frustration" or "another try" or something like that, it would have scored higher.

The picture itself is v good, and I would recommend sending it to an agency, as it may well be used commercially. For this challenge, however, it does not cut it.

h

whiteroom

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

04/14/2004 06:09:57 AM · #10

this its a great photo, people are mean here.... dont take it
personally. the subject has to hit you in the face to get a reaction
usually.

GinaRothfels

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

Olympus 8mm f/1.8 M.Zuiko Digital ED Fisheye PRO Lens

04/14/2004 06:27:02 AM · #11

I thought I might be in the minority, but I gave both photos good scores. To me they fitted the challenge and were both good photos. If they were mine I would have taken consolation in the fact that there were voters here who rated them highly. Even the winning photos don't please everyone.

coolhar

Canon PowerShot Pro 90 IS

04/14/2004 06:43:21 AM · #12

I didn't give it a 4, or lower. It is a pretty nice photo of a cute little girl; there is emotion showing on her face but the colors (cheerful and bright) lead your thoughts in a different direction than the theme of frustration and pain; maybe a little too tightly cropped. I remember when I saw it while voting I wished it met the challenge theme better because it is so well executed. I'm sure that the reason it didn't score higher is because the wheel is such a very small part of what it portrays, almost like an afterthought to justify entry. It would be just about as interesting if the bike were not even in the frame.

WildflowerJoy

Nikon D90

Nikon AF Zoom-Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8 VR DG IF-ED

04/14/2004 07:25:19 AM · #13

I too met the "NOT ENOUGH WHEEL" in the photo low voting for my entry. I know that some challenges say to make the topic the MAIN SUBJECT of your photo BUT this challenge did NOT say that.... it read take a photo of something with a wheel! Had the challenge been to make the wheel the main subject I would have followed the challenge and done that but the challenge did NOT say that. I agree that this photo deserved better I gave it an 8! People should not vote photos down for an not meeting the challenge when they are reading MORE INTO the challenge than was actually stated. Had the challenge been to make the wheel the main subject then this photo could have been voted down for not meeting the challenge. Peple ought to read the challenge topic and the explanation before voting!

Delphi00

Canon EOS-450D Rebel XSi

04/14/2004 07:54:24 AM · #14

sadly, "NOT ENOUGH WHEEL" was exactly how i felt fo this picture...

orussell

Canon EOS Rebel T6s

Canon EF 55-200mm f/4.5-5.6 II USM

04/14/2004 08:59:05 AM · #15

The subject of this picture is the little girl not the bike nor by extension the wheel, no matter what the title says.

muckpond

Nikon D200

Sigma 15mm f/2.8 EX Diagonal Fisheye for Nikon

04/14/2004 08:59:15 AM · #16

Originally posted by rananculus:

your comment is out of line here. Photography is subjective, and on this site, majority rules.

i agree. i kind of think this thread is out of line. if you disagree with the placing of the shot, that's your right. it's also our right to vote it down for whatever reason. such is the "democracy" that is dpc.

but for you to call the voters out in the forums the way you have, i think, is a bit harsh.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

04/14/2004 09:16:52 AM · #17

I think the 'not enough' wheel view of the challenge was pretty funny, though in a quite tragic way. This shot of the girl learning to ride a bike is a perfect example - the whole thing is about wheels, in a way that a literal, straight on picture of a wheel has no hope of approaching.

This is about wheels, struggling with wheels, fighting to balance on a wheel, traveling on a wheeled contraption, it is the essence of wheelieness in a way unlike many of the more 'its a wheel' shots.

I suffered a bit from the 'not enough wheel' camp - given that my picture was over 50% wheel arch, on a truck I don't see that it is rocket science to see how it fits the challenge though...

Sigma 18-125mm f/3.5-5.6 DC for Canon

04/14/2004 09:26:24 AM · #18

Good morning everyone!

Looks like I got some answering to do... :)

(edited for morning wake up spelling errors)

Message edited by author 2004-04-14 09:27:12.

Kavey

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

04/14/2004 09:26:45 AM · #19

I agree Gordon, I felt the image met the challenge very well, and certainly don't think that an image had to consist mainly of a wheel/ wheels to meet it well. I think that getting the message or theme across without having a wheel taking up most of the frame is actually much cleverer and more inventive.

The image doesn't personally appeal to me hugely but I do think it's an excellent idea in terms of meeting the challenge.

orussell

Canon EOS Rebel T6s

Canon EF 55-200mm f/4.5-5.6 II USM

04/14/2004 09:27:00 AM · #20

Originally posted by Gordon:

So can we assume that you gave this more than a four?

As for your picture Gordon, I wasn't fond of the lighting, the tones and the straight on nature of the shot. I usually find your images much more interesting. Just thought you might like an explanation.

04/14/2004 09:28:29 AM · #21

Originally posted by faidoi:

The "4" I gave pictures was because the wheel was barely in view. Granted the look and expression of the girl learning how to ride her bike added interest to the shot.

I'll put this in the "doesn't meet the challenge" bucket.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

04/14/2004 09:30:41 AM · #22

Originally posted by orussell:

So can we assume that you gave this more than a four?

Nope, I'm one of those terrible people who need to be dragged through the streets and hanged until dead for not voting on all the entries.

(Though thank you for the comments on my entry - the majority of the comments I got either said they loved it or 'not enough wheel')

Message edited by author 2004-04-14 09:31:44.

04/14/2004 09:30:51 AM · #23

Originally posted by pitsaman:

Most of the voters here put 90 % weight on the topic "Wheel" and little on the photo quality!

Probably true people did... bt this image obviously meets the challenge as well or better than most of the other images.

04/14/2004 09:31:25 AM · #24

Originally posted by boomer:

Another "fails to meet the challenge" vote.