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07/29/2002 11:55:05 AM · #1
How do you vote photos that have nothing to do with the challenge, except for the title.
Just curious how others view that kind of thing.
Not any specific... just a general question(please,I don't want to get anyone in trouble).
07/29/2002 11:56:29 AM · #2
I give them a maximum score of 5.
07/29/2002 12:01:50 PM · #3
I generally give them a 1. However, I also usually spend a lot of time trying to figure out how it applies to the challenge. If I can figure it out, I'll bump that up.

For me it doesn't matter how good the image is either. I just have a low tolerance for that. (Although, in general, I find that most -- not all -- of the photos that don't seem to fit aren't actually that great...)
07/29/2002 12:02:41 PM · #4
So it could be a great photo, but if you took the title away, you would have no clue what this was about. That's what you would do. I looked at many that have something to do with it even if it is slight, but a few only use the title to squeeze in to the contest.
07/29/2002 12:07:23 PM · #5
Originally posted by TerryGee:
So it could be a great photo, but if you took the title away, you would have no clue what this was about. That's what you would do. I looked at many that have something to do with it even if it is slight, but a few only use the title to squeeze in to the contest.


If the photo is exceptionally well executed and does not meet the challenge, I could give it up to a 5. I do this because I'm quite aware that I could be incapable of interpreting the photogapher's intentions...

07/29/2002 12:08:27 PM · #6
I think all views on how harshly to vote seem fair enough, but I would suggest that if someone scores bad because of this that it might be nice to give them a general score in the comment section.
07/29/2002 12:16:29 PM · #7
Originally posted by Agamemnon:
I think all views on how harshly to vote seem fair enough, but I would suggest that if someone scores bad because of this that it might be nice to give them a general score in the comment section.

Part of the 'challenge' is to make a photo that people can interpret as meeting the challenge. The rules state that a title should not save the photo...

I think it would be very interesting to have a challenge at some point in the future where the title of ALL images are UNTITLED. This would keep a title from being able to sway a photo.

The only time I have ever gotten comments on a title are when someone thinks it may be saving my photo. I have never gotten a comment on a title being, cute, clever, or otherwise.

I think that the titles are a nice outlet for creativity, however :)
07/29/2002 12:21:48 PM · #8
I'm a firm believer in allowing the title to make the shot more pertinent to the challenge. Interpretation isn't an exact science and there will always be those that don't understand how your shot has anything to do with the challenge. I think a title allows the viewer to know that you had good intentions of meeting the challenge.

Now, this isn't to say that you can take a picture of just anything and title it something to do with the challenge. The title should be used to give the voter a better view of an idea that met the challenge in your mind.

I've said this before here, and I'll say it again. I use the challenge topic to guide my ideas for the picture that I take. I DO NOT let it effect my voting, unless a picture is rediculously and blatently off topic (showing me that the photographer had no intention of submitting the shot when they took it, but rather submitted it just for the hell of it).

When I vote on these photos, I assume that the shot meets the challenge and vote according to the merits of the photograph alone. I know this isn't the way most people do it here, but I just can't see how any other way is fair. Interpretation is in the eye of the photographer.

- Mike
07/29/2002 12:22:14 PM · #9
I like fun or pretty titles on photos.

Like "Aloha". It''s light and airy aand makes sense for the subject (pineapple).

Photos that use the title to tell me what the photo is sorta turm me off UNLESS its a cool play on words:-)

But..I only score on the photo..not the title. Titles are the fun part :-)

* This message has been edited by the author on 7/29/2002 12:22:10 PM.
07/29/2002 12:23:28 PM · #10
*staying away from the soapbox*

I've already made my view of titles very clear.

As for the harsh scores, I usually make a comment about not getting the challenge tie-in -- BUT I don't tell them the score I gave them. I know people are divided on that one.
07/29/2002 12:24:32 PM · #11
I stopped posting my scores on this challenge as well...
07/29/2002 12:32:21 PM · #12
My feeling (just my opinion) is that a score is your most definite comment.

Everything else is sorta B.S.

If you are saying nice things without any pointed criticism and scoring low I think you may be confusing people sometimes.

If I got nothing good to say or I don't have a helpful post to go with a low score I dont say anything.

But I found that a score clearly punctuates my comments and every response I have gotten via e-mail has bent over backwards thanking me for telling them the score.

Sometimes my 9 or 10 with a comment really makes them feel like they are apprecaited in a mountain of 4's and 5's :-)
07/29/2002 12:37:47 PM · #13
I will return to posting the score I give next week. I am gonna take a break from the commenting this week. I will only comment on a few photos.

In the future, I plan to stop commenting on everything and focus more on the quality of the comments I do post.

07/29/2002 12:38:27 PM · #14
On a different note...
I think people should keep in mind the full title of the challenge- not just corporate world, but effects on society. People might only get caught up in the C.P. part and say the photo doesn't fit.
I was already told that, and yet there are many others with the same and/or similar titles and effects.
So if that many thought the same way, how did it not fit?
07/29/2002 12:46:03 PM · #15
Terry, what I hoep people aren't focusing on is only the Wall Street corporate world.

There are a lot of other corporations in the world that have been screwing with people in other ways.

I am a big fan of free speech and there are some corporations that want to inhibit this.
07/29/2002 12:50:05 PM · #16
It also does not have to show any corporation, just what is happening to people generally as a result of the DOW, Scandels, corp takovers, bankrupcies, etc. is enough.
07/29/2002 12:50:07 PM · #17
I am a big fan of free speech and there are some corporations that want to inhibit this.



CNN MSNBC FOX NEWS ect. ect. :)

* This message has been edited by the author on 7/29/2002 12:49:59 PM.
07/29/2002 12:55:12 PM · #18
Originally posted by Agamemnon:
CNN MSNBC FOX NEWS ect. ect. :)

Exactly.....

Online web services...hell......even companies that want to control the jpeg format for crying out loud!

Try taking a photo with a "Pro looking" camera at a sporting event. Sharing music files with your friends.

I watched a movie called "They Shoot Movies Don't They?" this weekend. Scary freakin movie, especially since it was a documentary.
07/29/2002 12:57:54 PM · #19
uh oh... hmmm.. sharing music files with your friends is free speech? i feel another debate coming on :)
07/29/2002 01:03:17 PM · #20
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
uh oh... hmmm.. sharing music files with your friends is free speech? i feel another debate coming on :)


It''s an argument of fair use issue. I am not talking about the napster stuff. I don''t agree with having music distributed on the net via pirating. But the music industry wants to go where Bill Gates has gone with his latest release of Windows XP and control the music on a per person basis.

Look at what the music industry has done to the small web music host. Not that the general idea of paying artists for their music isn''t right. It definitely is.

My point is that many creative service corporations go using the same ham fisted tactics that other corporations like Microsoft do and squish out creativity and innovation in the process.


* This message has been edited by the author on 7/29/2002 1:05:14 PM.
07/29/2002 01:05:11 PM · #21
Originally posted by TerryGee:
How do you vote photos that have nothing to do with the challenge, except for the title.
Just curious how others view that kind of thing.
Not any specific... just a general question(please,I don't want to get anyone in trouble).


I try to see the photo first before reading the title so I am not inclined to have a preset idea of what the photo is "supposed to be". If the photo can't read without the title then the original challenge has not been met. Looking at the technical skill, composition, lights and darks, etc. of the photo itself is what I see first. Grades up to 4. Meeting the challenge works in there too. Grades 5 and up.
07/29/2002 01:08:47 PM · #22
One component of photography is creativity. The corporate world challenge was a tough one. Yet, I have seen some very creative and effective interpretations. I like to reward that one)by reflecting that in their score and two) by knocking way down the score of pictures not covering the challenge at all. There were a couple of submissions where the title was a nice finishing touch of the picture presented and I kept that in mind a little as well when giving a score. Feel that only meeting the challenge because of the title is stretching it too far. After all, this isn't a writing contest but photography.

In the Corporate World challenge I notice a couple of things: a number of submissions with very l-o-n-g titles and the overall tone of negativity of the submissions about the corporate world :)

Some people though seem to be hard to please. I read where is the texture comments on the Delectable Droplets, which showed both the texture of condensation and the cat fur, and on No Cream Cheese, which showed both the texture of the bread and the mushiness of the salmon. Those comments surprised me.

I like the idea of a challenge where titles will not be allowed!
07/29/2002 01:14:55 PM · #23
Or at least to limit the title - some people threw in everything but the kitchen sink this time. I think if you have to put a whole description into the title, then you are stretching things, or it is because you know it won't stand up well on it's own.
I would love an untitled contest as well.
07/29/2002 01:16:52 PM · #24
I generally give a lot of room to the photographer to 'meet the challenge'. Just because I don't get it, doesn't mean it can't be gotten. If I think a shot has NOTHING to do with the challenge, I will give it a very long look (and several short looks throughout the week) in an attempt to gleam SOME idea of where the photographer is trying to lead me. But I need to see it in the shot. The title can get me there, but the shot has to have it.

After that, I'll decide on the photo's 'merit vote', then subtract up to 3 points for missing the challenge. Since I've rarely seen a shot that tries to do this with a merit above 6, that lands them from 1 to 3 with great images getting a 4. This is of course subject to change if I see an image that merits a 10 and has NOTHING to do with the challenge... I'd likely take off 4 or 5 for that.

On the flip side, if a shot meets the challenge head on in an original, thought provoking way, I'll add 1 to 3 points to it.

There is no right or wrong way to vote here (at least I don't think so)... The best advice is to follow the age old words of that profound philosopher Jiminy Cricket "... and always let your conscience be your guide".
07/29/2002 01:52:38 PM · #25
The challenge was "Take a shot best REPRESENTING your views of the Corporate World and/or its effect on society." ... This naturally leads itself to go towards symbolism therefore pics "that have nothing to do with the challenge" might not necessarily be that. But I do think that the message should be recognizable and shouldn't be rescued by some title ... supported maybe but not based on it.
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