Policing the Police : Cell Phone v Body Cams

08/27/2014 08:14:49 PM · #151

Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Originally posted by RayEthier:
Right on ... I too oppose this type of behaviour. Here is hoping that they arrested him, charged him with a variety of offences and that he now has an understanding that the officer was well within his right to request that he exit the vehicle.

That's my reaction as well. The way it reads to me, the dude was driving home with a pizza when a cop flashed him to pull him over. Instead of pulling over, he chose to drive on home, and then BACK into his driveway, which of course the policeman had no way of knowing WAS his driveway. From the cop's POV, this vehicle is a loaded weapon pointed right at him/his cruiser, and he's predictably annoyed as hell. THEN the driver refuses to lower his window, refuses to exit the vehicle, all sorts of behavior "normal" citizens wouldn't even consider under the circumstances. The driver tells us he's been "beaten before" and now he's "understandably" reluctant to exit his vehicle. Then when he DOES exit the vehicle, it's to receive, according to him, the "predictable" beating...

I'm not impressed. The cop may have been heavy-handed, but sure as heck the DRIVER was provoking him all the way. Call it a draw...

A draw? I mean, really? Are we happy with that?

Sure, the guy SHOULD have just requested a supervisor/Sargent, given his concerns, and yes, he was nearly baiting them, I agree. But are we dealing with hormonal teenagers here, or professional law enforcement officers? I note the difference for a reason, namely because I can forgive this sort of shit easier from those who don't get 100 hours of training per year on how to deal with this sort of thing.

Sorry, I just expect better, and don't see any reason to change that. Professionals should not EVER resort to this sort of behavior.

Another similar incident. "I'll put a round in your ass so quick" - Super professional.

Message edited by author 2014-08-27 21:29:02.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

08/28/2014 02:20:26 AM · #152

Originally posted by Cory:

... and yes, he was nearly baiting them, I agree.

Sorry my friend, but it would seem that in this instance we are not anywhere near in agreement as to the actions of the yound man in the car. He was not "nearly" baiting, he was in full fledged mode and I have no sympathy whatsoever for what transpired. Rather hard to handle a stick that has shit on both ends... and this is a clear example of this.

You really ought to volunteer to go on one of those "ride along" programs and maybe, just maybe you would not be so quick to pass judgement.

Are there abuses...most definitely, but the cops are not "Always" in the wrong as you seemingly seem to suggest with your one sided perspective.

Originally posted by Cory:

Sorry, I just expect better, and don't see any reason to change that. Professionals should not EVER resort to this sort of behavior.

No argument from me in that regard, but sadly the professionalism you refer to is most definitely not news worthy.

Ray

Art Roflmao

Canon EOS-6D Mark II

08/28/2014 04:15:03 AM · #153

I would like to expect the patience and professionalism shown by this cop. Of course, that was back in 1992. I think the guy would have been tazed, beaten and locked up for at least a year with today's law enforcement. ...nevermind whether I think he deserves it or not - if we ran the country on what I think people deserved, I'd probably be tazed, confined and executed myself. ;-)

08/28/2014 08:44:01 AM · #154

Originally posted by Art Roflmao:

... if we ran the country on what I think people deserved, I'd probably be tazed, confined and executed myself. ;-)

Naw... but probably burnt at the stake would work eh? :O)

Ray

08/28/2014 10:02:23 AM · #155

Originally posted by RayEthier:

Originally posted by Cory:

... and yes, he was nearly baiting them, I agree.

Sorry my friend, but it would seem that in this instance we are not anywhere near in agreement as to the actions of the yound man in the car. He was not "nearly" baiting, he was in full fledged mode and I have no sympathy whatsoever for what transpired. Rather hard to handle a stick that has shit on both ends... and this is a clear example of this.

You really ought to volunteer to go on one of those "ride along" programs and maybe, just maybe you would not be so quick to pass judgement.

Are there abuses...most definitely, but the cops are not "Always" in the wrong as you seemingly seem to suggest with your one sided perspective.

Originally posted by Cory:
Sorry, I just expect better, and don't see any reason to change that. Professionals should not EVER resort to this sort of behavior.

No argument from me in that regard, but sadly the professionalism you refer to is most definitely not news worthy.

Ray

As you might well imagine, the local PD has about a 0% likelihood of allowing that to happen. (they're still made at me over a counterfeiting case from a decade ago which they weren't able to convict me on and to which I wouldn't confess)...

Aside from that, I don't like or trust them, and wouldn't even consider the idea myself. These local SOB's bribed or coerced a Walmart employee to accuse me of theft during that time as well - granted I had a strong connection to the counterfeiting, but the theft? HELL NO. Even better? She spelled my last name correctly(nearly an impossible feat) while giving them the wrong first name of Cody, while claiming she knew me personally...... Of course the video tape was totally blank (4 blank tapes of my crime... not at all suspicious huh?)... No offense Ray, but I trust cops less than a rabid pitbull, they're not allowed on my property without a warrant, and I don't speak to them unless I want something from them, or I have my attorney present. Frankly, your profession makes me distrust even you, despite the fact that you seem to be a good and reasonable man.

In short, they don't like me, and I don't trust them. Never gonna happen. Plus, I don't want to get shot.

..

Make no mistake however, I do appreciate that they're dealing with scumbags about 90% of the time, I get it. The problem is when they apply that attitude and lack of respect to the general public who are, in fact, actually decent citizens.

As a citizen I have EVERY right to refuse a request made by an officer, however I cannot refuse a lawful order. I continuously heard this officer "asking" the man to leave the car - I did not hear him once utter the word 'order'. And please tell me that you're not OK with that pig who threatens to shoot them without any reason at all.... (yes, PIG, oink oink. That SOB needs to be dismissed off the force immediately for terrorizing citizens.)

Of course you're right that professionalism isn't news worthy, and hence you'll never hear me complain about it. I'll even go so far as to say that I respect those cops, but still cannot and will not trust them. It's a bit like living around grizzly bears, it only takes one with an attitude and an agenda to ruin your entire life.

Message edited by author 2014-08-28 12:37:38.

08/28/2014 12:40:49 PM · #156

Still, thank goodness I don't live in Brazil - those cops make ours look super amazingly awesome.

Brazilian police force suspect to sandpaper off tattoo at gun-point.

08/28/2014 06:37:09 PM · #157

And now one just down the street from my house.

Family of slain Bloomfield man claims shooting was unprovoked

Tamron 70-180mm F/2.8 Di III VXD

09/19/2014 06:54:47 PM · #158

Another one from NM.

FACE SLAM!

MadMan2k

Sony Alpha a6400

09/20/2014 01:15:42 AM · #159

Originally posted by Cory:

And now one just down the street from my house.

Family of slain Bloomfield man claims shooting was unprovoked

Small world - my Dad worked with that man, and from what I heard the police report came out saying he pulled out a gun and pointed at himself, so the police fired as soon as they saw the gun.

Not quite sure what to believe there, but I think police gun tactics training could use a lot of improvement as a general rule, also I think non-lethal means should be the first line of offense until the suspect has been proven to be a danger to others, not just himself.

09/20/2014 04:25:20 PM · #160

Originally posted by MadMan2k:

Originally posted by Cory:
And now one just down the street from my house.

Family of slain Bloomfield man claims shooting was unprovoked

Small world - my Dad worked with that man, and from what I heard the police report came out saying he pulled out a gun and pointed at himself, so the police fired as soon as they saw the gun.

Not quite sure what to believe there, but I think police gun tactics training could use a lot of improvement as a general rule, also I think non-lethal means should be the first line of offense until the suspect has been proven to be a danger to others, not just himself.

Out of curiosity... just when does this occur... right after someone is shot dead or has been knifed repeatedly.

Right easy to cast aspersions on police officers, but I would bet good money that a lot of people making generalized statements have never been in a situation where someone's life could depend on the actions of another.

Is there room for massive improvement... you bet there is, but please, let us look at both sides of the issue and try to arrive at policy and procedures that will serve all elements involved.

Ray

09/20/2014 04:41:54 PM · #161

I find it interesting that cops argue that they deserve higher pay based on how dangerous their job is. Yet, they never seem to accept that they've taken a dangerous job, and always argue that they were justified in a homicide because of 'risk'.. Seems to me that this is a rather odd and contradictory thing..

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 16-35 f/4 ED VR

09/20/2014 11:20:39 PM · #162

Originally posted by Cory:

I most certainly can't speak for other people that ever spent time working as a police officer but I can tell you this. When I joined the RCMP I came out of the mines in the Sudbury area and can tell you for a fact that I made more money in a week than I did as a police officer in a month.

Was my job dangerous...yes many were the situations where I honestly did not think I would make it back home.

Would I consider being a police office today if I was 20ish and know what I know now... NOT a chance.

TO those of you who truly have such a low opinion of the police in general, perhaps you might consider volunteering for a ride along program... you might be surprised to find that the people you are so prone to condemn are actually human and do have feelings.

Ray

Message edited by author 2014-09-21 17:55:13.

LanndonKane

Nikon D800

09/25/2014 03:19:10 PM · #163

Justice.

09/25/2014 03:37:32 PM · #164

Originally posted by LanndonKane:

Justice.

Justice? Only if he actually gets 20 years... I'm betting he'll get probation and that's about it.....

09/26/2014 08:27:39 PM · #165

JUSTICE!

10/02/2014 01:31:23 AM · #166

Right here what baby? I'm on a call!

What a scumbag.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

10/02/2014 01:34:13 AM · #167

The video in the post right before this is egregious and new.

This one is less new, since we've been talking about the Boyd murder for some time now.

What we didn't know was that the officer was caught on tape stating his intent to "Shoot him in the penis", even more interestingly apparently several officers called him and tried to cover for him. Disgusting.

Art Roflmao

Canon EOS-6D Mark II

10/02/2014 02:41:14 AM · #168

Originally posted by Cory:

JUSTICE!

Samsung Galaxy S21, S21+, S21 Ultra

10/10/2014 05:42:29 PM · #169

More for anyone who still reads this thread.

Police dog attacks compliant handcuffed suspect.

This is a nightmare scenario.

Bear_Music

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

10/10/2014 08:21:48 PM · #170

That frickin' dog is DEMENTED. The whole time the cop was quietly taking the suspect down, the dog was howling to be let loose and at him :-( So not only are the cops getting more aggressive, it's bleeding over to the dogs, sheesh. Nightmare scenario indeed.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

10/29/2014 12:14:06 PM · #171

Well, holy hell...

It seems that now New Mexico police are shooting each other..

franktheyank

Canon EOS-5D Mark IV

11/21/2014 01:10:55 PM · #172

New Mexico police fire 19 shots at suspect "armed" with brake shoes... Amazingly, he lived...

Message edited by Bear_Music - more descriptive URL.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

11/21/2014 03:44:27 PM · #173

Originally posted by franktheyank:

//www.liveleak.com/view?i=107_1416328169

Could you please include a brief description of the content when you post a link so people can choose whether or not they want to follow it. Most URLs alone are less than descriptive ...