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 11/19/2009 01:45:17 AM · #76
Originally posted by marcusvdt:
Originally posted by Photologist:
Originally posted by Azrifel:
I think that showing the average score given causes some people to inflate the scores they give to be received well in the community. Like using a 5-10 score pattern only, instead of spreading it out fully.

BINGO! That is exactly what I do.

I don't want my Average Vote Cast metric to be low, so that is why I only vote 5 or higher (mostly 6 or higher). I started doing this a year or so ago. If I see an image that is "below average" (5), I simply skip it (usually) and only vote on those that are 6 or higher. That keeps my average up. My average vote that I have given out (as of today) is around 5.4. It used to be much lower!


Hey, the spirit of the site would not to rate the photos as you really thinks it's worthy?
Changing your voting pattern so you are not attacked in the forums is something really crazy, I mean you distort the meaning of voting, and more, If I need to vote only from 5 to 10, why vote at all?

I'm here to learn, of course reasons may vary for other people... I'm trying to grow in photography and judging other's work correctly is a step that I'm still going to master. I usually vote and after the results are posted I compare some of my votes with the results to see if I was able to give the right score for the right photo. In the past I had very huge discrepancies comparing my voting with DPC mass voting (results). Then I decided that I would stop voting for a while and concentrate a little more my studies on analysis. I decided to vote on rainbow challenge and I felt I've improved my analysing skills.
But if you come and say you kind of manipulate your own voting attitude so you can keep your vote average high, then I begin to concern about how I can learn from the results of a challenge if people are not necessarily voting honestly?
I think it's the job of the owners and the council to not let the essence of this site to be lost. And if there are so many people are more concerned about keeping their vote average high than giving real opinions and votes to any photo, I'd say the essence is being already lost.

Thank you, Marcus. My actions and your write-up should be proof enough that the Average Vote Cast metric should be removed.
 11/19/2009 03:07:14 AM · #77
It should not be visible to anyone but yourself (when logged in) and SC. My vote is secret right?
 11/19/2009 03:58:02 AM · #78
Originally posted by glad2badad:
Originally posted by jdannels:
I vote to get rid of the average vote cast stat. It only leads to derailments of threads and finger pointing. If you have a low vote cast your your opinion is means less as you are seen as a troll, and then there are 15 posts while someone is either attacked or discredited for their voting habits and their subsequent post to defend themselves, someone brings out a dead horse gif and the original intent is lost. Repeat 10 times a week.

Have you really seen this much recently? I ask in sincerity because I have seen this once in awhile, but don't think it's as severe an issue as it's being portrayed here.

Perhaps 10 was a little much, but here is an example in the current Rainbow Scores thread where someone is forced to defend their average vote cast. I think everyone is too busy arguing about watermarks to argue about scores given. :P

For me I just don't see how it benefits the site at all, just causes unnecessary bickering.

Message edited by author 2009-11-19 03:59:46.
 11/19/2009 05:12:42 AM · #79
Originally posted by jdannels:
Originally posted by glad2badad:
Originally posted by jdannels:
I vote to get rid of the average vote cast stat. It only leads to derailments of threads and finger pointing. If you have a low vote cast your your opinion is means less as you are seen as a troll, and then there are 15 posts while someone is either attacked or discredited for their voting habits and their subsequent post to defend themselves, someone brings out a dead horse gif and the original intent is lost. Repeat 10 times a week.

Have you really seen this much recently? I ask in sincerity because I have seen this once in awhile, but don't think it's as severe an issue as it's being portrayed here.

Perhaps 10 was a little much, but here is an example in the current Rainbow Scores thread where someone is forced to defend their average vote cast. I think everyone is too busy arguing about watermarks to argue about scores given. :P

For me I just don't see how it benefits the site at all, just causes unnecessary bickering.

Either I should not have posted my voting stats for that challenge in the forum, or the stats should not be showed on my profile... maybe both?
 11/19/2009 05:32:31 AM · #80
Originally posted by marcusvdt:
Originally posted by jdannels:
Originally posted by glad2badad:
Originally posted by jdannels:
I vote to get rid of the average vote cast stat. It only leads to derailments of threads and finger pointing. If you have a low vote cast your your opinion is means less as you are seen as a troll, and then there are 15 posts while someone is either attacked or discredited for their voting habits and their subsequent post to defend themselves, someone brings out a dead horse gif and the original intent is lost. Repeat 10 times a week.

Have you really seen this much recently? I ask in sincerity because I have seen this once in awhile, but don't think it's as severe an issue as it's being portrayed here.

Perhaps 10 was a little much, but here is an example in the current Rainbow Scores thread where someone is forced to defend their average vote cast. I think everyone is too busy arguing about watermarks to argue about scores given. :P

For me I just don't see how it benefits the site at all, just causes unnecessary bickering.

Either I should not have posted my voting stats for that challenge in the forum, or the stats should not be showed on my profile... maybe both?


i think you do not need to justify to anybody about scores you give. If scale is from 1 to 10 use it full. If dpc owner thinks vote below 5 is bad, scale would be 5 - 10 not 1 - 10.

11/19/2009 07:18:11 AM · #81
Originally posted by jdannels:
I vote to get rid of the average vote cast stat. It only leads to derailments of threads and finger pointing. If you have a low vote cast your your opinion is means less as you are seen as a troll, and then there are 15 posts while someone is either attacked or discredited for their voting habits and their subsequent post to defend themselves, someone brings out a dead horse gif and the original intent is lost. Repeat 10 times a week.

Originally posted by glad2badad:
Have you really seen this much recently? I ask in sincerity because I have seen this once in awhile, but don't think it's as severe an issue as it's being portrayed here.

Originally posted by jdannels:
Perhaps 10 was a little much, but here is an example in the current Rainbow Scores thread where someone is forced to defend their average vote cast. I think everyone is too busy arguing about watermarks to argue about scores given. :P

For me I just don't see how it benefits the site at all, just causes unnecessary bickering.

In the first place, nobody is forced to defend their average vote given. You can rise to it or not. If there's no issue in your own mind, then there's no issue. If you attach importance to it, then adjust your voting style to fit your own parameters, or stand up in your own confidence level that there's nothing wrong with how you vote. If someone hassles you about it, tell them you're comfortable in your voting style, and if that's not suitable, well......that's their perception and you can't help them with that. You don't have to conform to another member/user set of standards if you do not choose to do so.

I do like to see who gives me comments, and where they're coming from, and as I outlined, it's NOT just the average vote given that gives me a feel for who's commenting, but the whole profile.

I have asked for further feedback from people upon commenting based on profile information simply because I may feel that the person who left a particular comment has something in their work or profile that makes me want more from them. Isn't that part of the learning process as well?
 11/19/2009 07:40:52 AM · #82
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
In the first place, nobody is forced to defend their average vote given. You can rise to it or not. If there's no issue in your own mind, then there's no issue. If you attach importance to it, then adjust your voting style to fit your own parameters, or stand up in your own confidence level that there's nothing wrong with how you vote. If someone hassles you about it, tell them you're comfortable in your voting style, and if that's not suitable, well......that's their perception and you can't help them with that. You don't have to conform to another member/user set of standards if you do not choose to do so.

I do like to see who gives me comments, and where they're coming from, and as I outlined, it's NOT just the average vote given that gives me a feel for who's commenting, but the whole profile.

I have asked for further feedback from people upon commenting based on profile information simply because I may feel that the person who left a particular comment has something in their work or profile that makes me want more from them. Isn't that part of the learning process as well?


The defense that was taken in the other thread was as a result of a specific accusation to a user. Are you implying that if I posted "man that jeb guy is a surefire jerkoff" that you wouldn't engage me in the least?
People had stepped on each other's toes and tact could have helped things immensely on both sides, but these sort of attacks generally start out vague, and then a low voter explains their reasoning and stands behind it and the bandwagon tries to run them over. Yeah, we should all leave troll posts alone but it's hard for everybody in the world to just let somebody flame them and just say "tomayto tomahto" and carry on because, as odd as it sounds, we have our "virtual" selves to defend.
FWIW, I think stats are interesting, and nothing more. They are snapshots of occurrences and easily taken out of context. In fact, that seems to be the job of statistics these days- misrepresentation in the media. As long as people don't let it control all of their judgements, we're all fine. And for those who let said numbers rule their decisions; it's a sad day that it is believed you can sum a human with five decimal spots...
 11/19/2009 08:41:06 AM · #83
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
In the first place, nobody is forced to defend their average vote given. You can rise to it or not. If there's no issue in your own mind, then there's no issue. If you attach importance to it, then adjust your voting style to fit your own parameters, or stand up in your own confidence level that there's nothing wrong with how you vote. If someone hassles you about it, tell them you're comfortable in your voting style, and if that's not suitable, well......that's their perception and you can't help them with that. You don't have to conform to another member/user set of standards if you do not choose to do so. ...

I agree with Jeb here. With all due respect to those that have mentioned they'd prefer to see this stat go away, I have to wonder what would happen to scores at DPC?

I've read quite often where people are trying to maintain a certain level of avg vote given - if that goes away wouldn't it be safe to consider that without that visible barometer the avg vote cast would be considerably lower? I'm not saying that everyone here that's in favor of eliminating this stat would not still be responsible voters, but I fear many outside of this thread would run amok without restraint.
 11/19/2009 08:53:14 AM · #84
Originally posted by glad2badad:
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
In the first place, nobody is forced to defend their average vote given. You can rise to it or not. If there's no issue in your own mind, then there's no issue. If you attach importance to it, then adjust your voting style to fit your own parameters, or stand up in your own confidence level that there's nothing wrong with how you vote. If someone hassles you about it, tell them you're comfortable in your voting style, and if that's not suitable, well......that's their perception and you can't help them with that. You don't have to conform to another member/user set of standards if you do not choose to do so. ...

I agree with Jeb here. With all due respect to those that have mentioned they'd prefer to see this stat go away, I have to wonder what would happen to scores at DPC?

I've read quite often where people are trying to maintain a certain level of avg vote given - if that goes away wouldn't it be safe to consider that without that visible barometer the avg vote cast would be considerably lower? I'm not saying that everyone here that's in favor of eliminating this stat would not still be responsible voters, but I fear many outside of this thread would run amok without restraint.


What would happen is scores would be more realistic (read: LOWER) I think. I think more people would vote how they actually feel a photo should be scored instead of using some modified scale as to prevent them being labeled a "troll" when someone views thier average vote cast. Hell, the scores are so inflated that anything that is less than a 5 is considered trolling!

The inclusion of that stat has caused many people to use a modified scoring system that has inflated scores. It also, in a way, has taken some of the anonymity out of the voting, in the sense that people will associate a low score received with someone who has a low average vote cast. I see the value of this stat to the SC/Langdon, but it truly serves no purpose to the masses, other than to be a weapon in the arsenal for disparaging remarks.

11/19/2009 09:05:41 AM · #85
Originally posted by glad2badad:
I have to wonder what would happen to scores at DPC?


Even being positive to removing the vote average stuff, I'm also concerned about what will happen to the scores. Because even with this being visible, we rarely have 8's on the challenge winners average scores, so perhaps removing the stats would turn into even lower scores?
Since there are people who vote high only to keep their stats high, how they would vote if no stats are visible? Would everybody vote sincerely and criteriously without being concerned with their own average vote stats? And more, are they voting sincerely and criteriously today if they are concerned with their own average voting scores?

The right thing would be if everybody used the same criteria for voting and voted sincerely based on the criteria. But world is not perfect.

More and more I'm positive to the requirement of commenting every photo that you vote. And then, the stats that should be visible to everybody and should really matter is how helpfull the comments you made are for the author of the photo. Maybe making available an evaluation for every comment we receive, scoring the comments from 1 to 10. So, when checking an user's profile, you could see how helpful that guy is with his comments and even being just stats, they would be more trusty to form an opinion regarding someone, than just checking his average vote stat.
What do you think about this?

Message edited by author 2009-11-19 09:09:15.
 11/19/2009 09:07:29 AM · #86
Heres the thing though...if the scores do drop, who ares as long as its across the board? If a 7 becomes a 5, would it matter if its happening across the board?

Edit - scoring a comment is too subjective, and you could quickly see that going down hill.

Message edited by author 2009-11-19 09:08:19.
 11/19/2009 09:12:46 AM · #87
Originally posted by marcusvdt:
[snip] The right thing would be if everybody used the same criteria ...

More and more I'm positive to the requirement of commenting every photo that you vote... [/snip]


I couldn't disagree more; both would be dreadful.
 11/19/2009 09:13:54 AM · #88
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
Heres the thing though...if the scores do drop, who ares as long as its across the board? If a 7 becomes a 5, would it matter if its happening across the board?

Edit - scoring a comment is too subjective, and you could quickly see that going down hill.
Well, I'm talking about scoring about how helpful each comments are. I don't think this is subjective. Maybe the scale not from 1 to 10, but from 1 to 3, being:
1 = not useful, did not help in any way.
2 = useful, pointed correct but did not give insight on how to improve.
3 = very useful, learned something or helped me to improve.
NA = don't agree or get pissed off, this one will not count in stats.
 11/19/2009 09:15:44 AM · #89
Originally posted by marcusvdt:
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
Heres the thing though...if the scores do drop, who ares as long as its across the board? If a 7 becomes a 5, would it matter if its happening across the board?

Edit - scoring a comment is too subjective, and you could quickly see that going down hill.
Well, I'm talking about scoring about how helpful each comments are. I don't think this is subjective. Maybe the scale not from 1 to 10, but from 1 to 3, being:
1 = not useful, did not help in any way.
2 = useful, pointed correct but did not give insight on how to improve.
3 = very useful, learned something or helped me to improve.
NA = don't agree or get pissed off, this one will not count in stats.


I think then that commenting would have to be anonymous, or you would see grudges emmerging. Plus so many people have already said that they look at someones profile and portfolio in order to judge how much weight to put on their comment, so the risk for someone to look at my work and say eww I dont like it, 1 for his comment.
 11/19/2009 09:17:54 AM · #90
Originally posted by spiritualspatula:
The defense that was taken in the other thread was as a result of a specific accusation to a user. Are you implying that if I posted "man that jeb guy is a surefire jerkoff" that you wouldn't engage me in the least?]/quote]
Of course I would! But I'm an established knucklehead.......8>)

Let me turn that around......would you, knowing me, intentionally provoke me into something like that?

Things is as I see it, If someone decides they want to go down that path of trying to say something by merely quoting an average, let others form their own opinions based on the profile. It's not like it's a secret, and if you're ashamed of where you are, then change it, right?
[quote=spiritualspatula]People had stepped on each other's toes and tact could have helped things immensely on both sides, but these sort of attacks generally start out vague, and then a low voter explains their reasoning and stands behind it and the bandwagon tries to run them over. Yeah, we should all leave troll posts alone but it's hard for everybody in the world to just let somebody flame them and just say "tomayto tomahto" and carry on because, as odd as it sounds, we have our "virtual" selves to defend.

I'm not sure I agree......it takes two to tango, and if you feel that you're really being trashed, unjustifiably and unnecessarily, according to the ToS, you're supposed to report the post.

If you don't want to wallow in the mud to defend yourself from an unprovoked attack, don't go there, let the system work.

I've been told before to knock it off, and when SC tells you to do that 'cause you're engaged in some kind of pissing contest, it kinda makes you take notice of the fact that perhaps you've gone overboard.
Originally posted by spiritualspatula:
FWIW, I think stats are interesting, and nothing more. They are snapshots of occurrences and easily taken out of context. In fact, that seems to be the job of statistics these days- misrepresentation in the media. As long as people don't let it control all of their judgements, we're all fine. And for those who let said numbers rule their decisions; it's a sad day that it is believed you can sum a human with five decimal spots...

I agree.....that's why I like to look at the whole picture from a profile.....here's one.....

Member since Aug. 5, 2006

Challenges Entered: 179
Votes Cast: 7,015
Avg Vote Cast: 6.0761
Votes Received: 32,861
Avg Vote Received: 5.4497
Comments:
Made: 5,520
Helpful: 4,914
Received: 2,772
Helpful: 2,770

Forums:
Posts: 7,832
Threads Created: 136

Participates, obviously one of those who doesn't want to offend, or is a reverse troll, doesn't vote as much as they should, pretty mouthy in the forums, and creates threads to speak out on one thing or another.

Has roughly twice the comments made to received....

Now that doesn't show that I've had a snit twice and emptied out my portfolio twice, and the comments that went with them.....

I do have a profile pic, and an e-mail addy, and my profile pic even has my daughter in it.

Here's the thing.....I have no issues with looking at the challenge images and deciding what it is that I like about the image and voting and commenting accordingly.

Here's a freakin' challenge.....you want to REALLY push yourself and your skills as a voter/viewer?

Vote a challenge.....all the entries. Then, go backm start with the lowest scores you gave, and leave a positive & thoughtful comment on the ones you rated worst. That will make you really study the images seriously if you force yourself to examine the image for its merits. You have to assume that even in an image that you think is crap that it may be a first ever challenge entry, it may be a n00b taking a high school photography course and trying to learn, it may just be someone who wants desperately to do better that needs just a word or two of encouragement NOT to put that Rebel up on eBay.

All of a sudden, you can have a purpose, a chance to do a good and nice thing, and the opportunity to look for the techniques you want in yourself for your photography as well. Finding the laudable merits in what you voted as a poor image WILL make you more adept at seeing things in your own images. I really try hard to make myself comment 100% on the challenges I vote simply because I believe that I will get much out of the examination of the ones I think need a lot of work.

So then what does a stupid number matter? It really becomes trivial if you're embroiled in thsi project that you've set for yourself, and isn't this about improving your skills. Vote what you want, let your averaage be what it is, do what YOU need to do to know that you're holding up your commitment, and screw what anyone thinks of your numbers.


11/19/2009 09:19:03 AM · #91
What I want to know is what happens later when Average Vote Cast stat is reinstated? Oops!

Some say that statistic is artificially inflating scores, but others might call it keeping voters honest. Since its presence is not a big problem that needs fixing, I say leave it as it is.


11/19/2009 09:20:37 AM · #92
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
Originally posted by marcusvdt:
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
Heres the thing though...if the scores do drop, who ares as long as its across the board? If a 7 becomes a 5, would it matter if its happening across the board?

Edit - scoring a comment is too subjective, and you could quickly see that going down hill.
Well, I'm talking about scoring about how helpful each comments are. I don't think this is subjective. Maybe the scale not from 1 to 10, but from 1 to 3, being:
1 = not useful, did not help in any way.
2 = useful, pointed correct but did not give insight on how to improve.
3 = very useful, learned something or helped me to improve.
NA = don't agree or get pissed off, this one will not count in stats.


I think then that commenting would have to be anonymous, or you would see grudges emmerging. Plus so many people have already said that they look at someones profile and portfolio in order to judge how much weight to put on their comment, so the risk for someone to look at my work and say eww I dont like it, 1 for his comment.

That's a good point. Could be implemented this way. This would make the author of the photo to think about the comment and then decide if that was helful or not without being influenced about who made that comment.
We should see the positive results of this. We could have less number of votes on our photos, because people would need to put more efforts on the comments. Commenting helps both the commenter and the author to improve. This would help everybody certainly.

11/19/2009 09:22:17 AM · #93
Originally posted by citymars:
What I want to know is what happens later when Average Vote Cast stat is reinstated? Oops!

Some say that statistic is artificially inflating scores, but others might call it keeping voters honest. Since its presence is not a big problem that needs fixing, I say leave it as it is.


How is it keeping honest when people admittedly are voting to keep thier avg vote cast inflated? That menas the scores they are issuing aren't so much about the image, but thier own stat.
 11/19/2009 09:26:31 AM · #94
I pretty much agree with you on the whole voting/numbers and their importance or lack thereof.
I also agree it takes two to tango, but most people that come to their own defense feel that they can do things sufficiently well on their own. Perhaps this is just bad judgement or perhaps it is having faith in discussion where no faith should be afforded. I know I like to think I'm mature enough to explain why I do something, but this doesn't mean it always works out that well in practice on an internet forum. Many of these "defenses" start out as somebody simply explaining their thoughts, which is pretty innocent IMO.
Would I engage you in that manner? No, but that also isn't really my style. I try to conduct myself in a pretty controlled and reasonable manner- I'm pretty coolheaded in person and online. Can I be snarky though... Most definitely ;)
 11/19/2009 09:31:18 AM · #95
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
What would happen is scores would be more realistic (read: LOWER) I think. I think more people would vote how they actually feel a photo should be scored instead of using some modified scale as to prevent them being labeled a "troll" when someone views thier average vote cast. Hell, the scores are so inflated that anything that is less than a 5 is considered trolling!

Why are lower scores more realistic?

Where is the definitive scale?

*You* set your own bar......if it bugs you to get the responses you do with your voting/comments, either don't vote and comment, or alter your style that you may live with it.

If you're comfortable with your bar, screw the whiner!

If the comments you get bug you, or the whining makes you uncomfortable, then maybe you SHOULD look at how you play with others.

It's simple.....you alone govern the responses you'll get by your actions......don't want people to b*tch at you? Don't piss 'em off.

I'm not sure why someone else has to modify their behavior to suit what you stand for.......shouldn't you either stick to your guns, or change what you're doing to adapt to the environment?

You alone control the responses you get by your votes/comments.
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
The inclusion of that stat has caused many people to use a modified scoring system that has inflated scores. It also, in a way, has taken some of the anonymity out of the voting, in the sense that people will associate a low score received with someone who has a low average vote cast. I see the value of this stat to the SC/Langdon, but it truly serves no purpose to the masses, other than to be a weapon in the arsenal for disparaging remarks.

Define inflated scores. I think you'll find that your definition is just that ......YOUR definition. If the masses don't agree and they tell you about it, either live with it, or change them. It's a sliding scale. You may decide that it's less aggravation to adjust you scale upwards, and if you do the same for the good scores, then it will all average out anyway.

I have an average vote of 6.0761, and I still find myself having cast lower votes on some entries in challenges than they scored when it was over.....and I put my vote in the comment block so that people know what I voted them. If anyone has a question about my vote.......there it is. I'll stand behind it and explain it in the most positive manner I can.

The thing about statistics as you know is that they can be manipulated to the gatherer's POV. So manipulate your stats for your own curve, the way you want it, and that you don't get a bag of sh*t for it.

Why would that be artificial if you do it your way for how you feel you need to have the maximum effect with the minimum grief?
 11/19/2009 09:32:49 AM · #96
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
Heres the thing though...if the scores do drop, who ares as long as its across the board? If a 7 becomes a 5, would it matter if its happening across the board?

And if you have to go the other way to not get a heapin' helpin' of garbage, what does it matter if it's across the board?.....8>)
 11/19/2009 09:35:24 AM · #97
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
I think then that commenting would have to be anonymous, or you would see grudges emmerging. Plus so many people have already said that they look at someones profile and portfolio in order to judge how much weight to put on their comment, so the risk for someone to look at my work and say eww I dont like it, 1 for his comment.

What's wrong with being accountable for your votes and comments?

If I give you a 1 and tell you your image sucks, why shouldn't you be able to ask me to explain that?
 11/19/2009 09:40:32 AM · #98
Define inflated scores? I think you are getting to the point where you argue with me just to read your own wisdom haha.

Inflated scores...if you really feel an image is a 5, but you vote it a 7, because you don't want your avg vote cast to drop (and I realize one vote doesn't do it), then you are inflating the challenge score to cover your own ass. Same with the folks that use the modified 5 point scale of only voting 5-10.

You owned a business for 5000 years, you don't know what inflation is? C'mon.
 11/19/2009 09:41:36 AM · #99
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
I think then that commenting would have to be anonymous, or you would see grudges emmerging. Plus so many people have already said that they look at someones profile and portfolio in order to judge how much weight to put on their comment, so the risk for someone to look at my work and say eww I dont like it, 1 for his comment.

What's wrong with being accountable for your votes and comments?

If I give you a 1 and tell you your image sucks, why shouldn't you be able to ask me to explain that?


At this point, you aren't even reading other things in the thread, just going straight for my posts.

The comments would have to be anonymous for voting purposes, much like voting in challenges is done. You don't know who you are voting for until afterwards.
 11/19/2009 09:49:37 AM · #100
Originally posted by AJSullivan:
Define inflated scores? I think you are getting to the point where you argue with me just to read your own wisdom haha.

Inflated scores...if you really feel an image is a 5, but you vote it a 7, because you don't want your avg vote cast to drop (and I realize one vote doesn't do it), then you are inflating the challenge score to cover your own ass. Same with the folks that use the modified 5 point scale of only voting 5-10.

You owned a business for 5000 years, you don't know what inflation is? C'mon.

You really don't seem to see that YOU are the one who governs the responses you get by your actions.

Doesn't it occur to you that if you're getting negative responses, then it's your actions that precipitate them?

If there's nothing wrong with your actions in your view, then the responses are irrelevant, right?

I keep trying to get you to see this......it's YOUR vote.....do it the way YOU want.

If you're honest and genuine with where your view of the scale is, then screw the person that doesn't like it.

Until you define what the scale is, though.....you cannt state that the votes are inflated.

That's what I mean about defining the inflated scores. If the rest of the voters ALL feel that an image is a 6+ score, then it is. That's how it works.

Your image gets what it gets in the voting.....there's no inflated score, or unfairness in it. You eneter, the votes are cast, and it gets a score.

If you don't happen to agree, well.....whose issue is it then? Yours, or the 172 people who voted your image?
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