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11/15/2009 08:34:47 PM · #1
I have family and friends that watch Fox and I have friendly little debates on validity, but my husband, in my opinion is having his intelligence insulted because his major source of news is from talk radio. He works on the road sometimes 10 and 12 hours a day so talk radio, especially Sean, Glenn, and Rush, are his 'excitement' of the day.

He is more and more cynical every time I see him. He sounds sometimes as racial as they seem to be. Cynicism and racism are the two most ugly traits that I find in a man and now I am suddenly married to a cynic.

On top of that, he seems to think I am naive...

Message edited by author 2009-11-16 13:57:49.
11/15/2009 08:41:59 PM · #2
he needs to be shown that the people his is listening to as a source of "news" is purely "entertainment".

unfortunately if he considers this "news" and "valid" already, he may be past helping to see this.
11/15/2009 08:46:59 PM · #3
It's hard to be the sane one in a crowd of marching morons. Start listening to Air America, especially Tom Hartmann, If you can't get it in your redneck part of the world go online. Watch Rachel Maddow on MSNBC. Read "The Nation". Read Howard Zinn.
The right wing has driven this world to the point of disaster.
I'm sure to hear an earful from the opposite side.
Hang in there.
11/15/2009 08:47:33 PM · #4
i don't think you'll convince him that what he's listening to is not news or valid information. you might want to (cautiously) point out some of the changes you've noticed in him that you find troubling. Most of what he hears deals with realms beyond his control and that by letting himself get worked up over it is having a direct negative effect on his life/wife. I'm having a hard time with some friends who are like that. I'm glad i'm not married to any of them. :(
11/15/2009 08:50:54 PM · #5
Originally posted by franktheyank:

It's hard to be the sane one in a crowd of marching morons. Start listening to Air America, especially Tom Hartmann, If you can't get it in your redneck part of the world go online. Watch Rachel Maddow on MSNBC. Read "The Nation". Read Howard Zinn.
The right wing has driven this world to the point of disaster.
I'm sure to hear an earful from the opposite side.
Hang in there.


Thanks Frank. I love Rachel Maddow! I will definitely look up the other sources.
11/15/2009 08:56:32 PM · #6
Originally posted by briantammy:

i don't think you'll convince him that what he's listening to is not news or valid information. you might want to (cautiously) point out some of the changes you've noticed in him that you find troubling. Most of what he hears deals with realms beyond his control and that by letting himself get worked up over it is having a direct negative effect on his life/wife. I'm having a hard time with some friends who are like that. I'm glad i'm not married to any of them. :(


It's been hard... thanks.

90% is the time he's the man I fell in love with but there is a whole topic (an important one) that we suddenly have a major dispute with. The fact that we are both so damn stubborn isn't helping.

I just feel like this is changing him and I don't like that.
11/15/2009 08:59:38 PM · #7
My husband was the same way when he was on the road (street cop for the first 10 years together). One night, after listening to him yet again, I explained that every time he repeated to me what he heard on those shows, I lost a little respect for him. Eventually, the well would run dry and that would be the end. He stopped for the most part, but the other thing that helped was, when he made an outlandish statement, I would pull up opposite view on the net and make him read it. I also sent him articles and links to websites that explained how erroneous a lot of the statements were.

11/15/2009 09:10:48 PM · #8
Not to champion one side over the other or anything, but do any of you actually consider any of the arguments put forth? Do you go to ANY alternate view "websites" and seriously consider? Or is the "right" completely wrong and "racist" and "cynical" on all issues, all of the time? Or do you bother to argue individual issues? Or do you just lump everything Rush or Hannity or Beck says as heresy? It's easy to classify an entire political philosophy as wrong, but much more difficult to argue a particular issue.

And I expect I will be blasted as ignorant and racist and immoral and stupid...as I have in the past.
11/15/2009 09:17:15 PM · #9
Originally posted by farfel53:

Not to champion one side over the other or anything, but do any of you actually consider any of the arguments put forth? Do you go to ANY alternate view "websites" and seriously consider? Or is the "right" completely wrong and "racist" and "cynical" on all issues, all of the time? Or do you bother to argue individual issues? Or do you just lump everything Rush or Hannity or Beck says as heresy? It's easy to classify an entire political philosophy as wrong, but much more difficult to argue a particular issue.

And I expect I will be blasted as ignorant and racist and immoral and stupid...as I have in the past.


As a matter of fact I do listen to both sides. I make sure I take the time to listen to the right on talk radio as well as the left. I watch a bit of Fox and CNN while at the gym. With that knowledge set I can tell you that yes I do think that almost everything that comes out of the mouth of Hannity, Rush and Beck is garbage. They thrive on controversy, separation and fear. Not the traits I look for when trying to evaluate a very complex world.

Message edited by author 2009-11-15 21:17:45.
11/15/2009 09:25:17 PM · #10
The problem with all of this (that I see) is that people usually only listen to the right wing or the liberal left stations all of the time. Don't get me wrong, I think Rush is a complete idiot, but no one is 100% correct all of the time. As bad as the idea may sound to some, listening to both sides can not only be enlightening to a point, but humorous and frustrating at times.

I'm sorry that you have to deal with this, but I'm starting to hear more often of couples that have one leaning way right and the other going left. I like 21_F.gif Dahkota's advice.
11/15/2009 09:30:23 PM · #11
Originally posted by jbsmithana:

Originally posted by farfel53:

Not to champion one side over the other or anything, but do any of you actually consider any of the arguments put forth? Do you go to ANY alternate view "websites" and seriously consider? Or is the "right" completely wrong and "racist" and "cynical" on all issues, all of the time? Or do you bother to argue individual issues? Or do you just lump everything Rush or Hannity or Beck says as heresy? It's easy to classify an entire political philosophy as wrong, but much more difficult to argue a particular issue.

And I expect I will be blasted as ignorant and racist and immoral and stupid...as I have in the past.


As a matter of fact I do listen to both sides. I make sure I take the time to listen to the right on talk radio as well as the left. I watch a bit of Fox and CNN while at the gym. With that knowledge set I can tell you that yes I do think that almost everything that comes out of the mouth of Hannity, Rush and Beck is garbage. They thrive on controversy, separation and fear. Not the traits I look for when trying to evaluate a very complex world.


How many myths do you have to disprove before its ok to declare them "completely wrong and "racist" and "cynical" on all issues, all of the time?"

You are right in that it is easier to argue a philosophy than a particular issue. Its much easier to prove a right than to disprove a myth.

I hope you find some help somewhere, I couldn't imagine where to go from there.
11/15/2009 09:33:14 PM · #12
Great advice and thanks!... OP was more of a rant because of my frustrations.

It's not our disagreeing that gets to me, I don't think. Just that he thinks I'M misinformed.

Message edited by author 2009-11-16 21:17:49.
11/15/2009 09:37:05 PM · #13
There is nothing to be feared in considering all points of view, and challenging the conventional wisdom. Limbaugh is very much a blow-hard and an entertainer, but he DOES stimulate thought. Is there propaganda on the right? Of course. What is incredible to me is that so many on the left don't recognize any on their own side. Wake up, people, and think for yourself. The best antiseptic is sunlight...on both sides.
11/15/2009 09:45:04 PM · #14
Tell him to give NPR a shot for a week or two, they seem to be about as middle of the road as you will get. They have great programs on there that are not all political as well.
11/15/2009 09:46:14 PM · #15
Originally posted by trevytrev:

Tell him to give NPR a shot for a week or two, they seem to be about as middle of the road as you will get. They have great programs on there that are not all political as well.

I would disagree with this. I enjoy NPR and listen to it often, but it clearly has a liberal slant.
11/15/2009 10:29:37 PM · #16
Douse me in kerosene and set me on fire. Make no mistake. I think Rush, Glenn, Sean, and others are generally right. Even worse (for evidently most of the posters on this thread), they represent the beliefs of a significant portion of the American population. Why else would so many people tune into their programs day after day? They validate the beliefs of their listeners at a time when those beliefs are under deliberate, relentless, and fierce attack by the very ones who claim to be so open minded and tolerant of others.
When you have the entire chorus of TV, cable, internet, newspaper, magazine, and other media blindly pushing the big government, infinite funding available, government control over personal health care, eating habits, energy use - even at the expense of the US constitution, why is it considered demented, stupid, intellectually challenged, hateful, bigoted, racist, and every other negative label that can be conceived; to say, hey, wait a minute. Let's think through the consequences of doing some of these things.
I think the Universal Health Care is an excellent example. My personal belief is that the health care issue was the primary (potentially the sole) reason for the Democrats' losses in 1994. Every time this issue has been brought up, the American people rise up and say they do NOT want it - in pretty emphatic terms. Yet, the Democrats keep insisting on pushing it on the American people they are supposed to represent. Doesn't it make sense to ask why?
cynthiann - if you're willing to take advice from a complete idiot, try listening to Rush for the full three hours, every day for three weeks. Rather than think of him as an evil man, or a hate monger, or whatever prejudicial labels he's been given in your circle of friends, try to think of him as a mirror of public sentiment, and a person who believes passionately in what he says.
If the only thing you gain is an understanding of why he would appeal to your husband, you'll be much further ahead in your domestic situation.
BTW - in an attempt to shorten the flaming - I have no intent to insult, challenge, or call out any individual or group. This post is certainly not meant to question or attack anyone personally.
11/15/2009 11:19:42 PM · #17
I listened to some of Rush's stuff from the UK when I was living there, now I'm in Canada.

I agree, unfortunately he does represent the views of a rather large group of Americans. I find his views to be completely at odds with a modern world and civilisation, and the fact that so many people agree with him is in my opinion a real shame.

Cynthia I think you just have to be as honest as possible with him, and how you can tolerate different opinions but you can't love someone who starts to be at odds with your views on humanity.
11/15/2009 11:31:09 PM · #18
Hey if all you every listen to are the wing-nuts they do sound good. But the first time you do some fact checking you will learn that they take a sliver of truth and spin away.
11/15/2009 11:55:11 PM · #19
Originally posted by dtremain:

...they represent the beliefs of a significant portion of the American population. Why else would so many people tune into their programs day after day? They validate the beliefs...


Plato's "Cave", the tragic analogy.

Message edited by author 2009-11-15 23:56:32.
11/16/2009 07:53:41 AM · #20
Originally posted by dtremain:

I think Rush, Glenn, Sean, and others are generally right. Even worse (for evidently most of the posters on this thread), they represent the beliefs of a significant portion of the American population.


Yes indeed... and a while back a lot of people believed that the earth was flat.

The mere fact that a lot of people might believe something does not necessarily make it true.

Ray
11/16/2009 08:15:29 AM · #21
Cynthia,

Listening to right wing talk back radio speakers cannot change someone on its own. Obviously your husband sees something attractive in these hacks. I am not at all saying that he is a racist or cynicist. What I am getting at is, there must be stresses for him (perhaps financial, or social) that are causing him to look for an answer somewhere. Unfortunately he has found this right wing stuff.
I honestly think that the best thing you can do is talk honestly to him about how you feel. Let him know you don't blame him for turning to these men - but you want to understand why he has. Don't make it about the radio programs, make it about your husband.
People change, too. They find something that interests them, and then they advance and realise that that was not the right thing for them.
By the sounds, it seems your husband is in a bit of a crisis and this is what he has found, which answers his frustraions on a superficial level. But deep down I am sure he is not satisfied, deep down he probably knows that Sean, Glenn and Rush's take on the world is limited and narrow-minded.
11/16/2009 08:56:36 AM · #22
Originally posted by dtremain:

why is it considered demented, stupid, intellectually challenged, hateful, bigoted, racist, and every other negative label that can be conceived; to say, hey, wait a minute. Let's think through the consequences of doing some of these things.


It comes down to something very basic.

Do you believe that society will be most improved:

(i) if people act in their own self interests; or

(ii) if people act for the perceived benefit of society as a whole (even if against their own self interests)?

If everyone were to act in their own self interests, society as a whole should develop in an competitively efficient manner. However, the efficiency carries with it some social ugliness: there is no incentive to repress racism, bigotry etc - indeed there is an incentive to use it to your advantage.

Acting for the perceived benefit of everyone has its own problems - perception is often inaccurate and idealised, and so it can promote inefficiency and impragmatism.

In reality we are a blend of these things - but republican/conservative attitudes are characterised by self interest and liberal/social attitudes are characterised by acting in the perceived interests of society.

Fundamentally, republican/conservative attitudes will care less about bigotry and racism, and the appeal is simplistic in its focus on personal experience.

Fundamentally, liberal/social attitudes will care less about efficiency/pragmatism and focus on remedying generic social ills - the appeal is more intellectual in that generic social ills are not so clearly reflected in personal experience.

Hence "bleeding heart liberals" and "small minded conservatives".

As people get older, they naturally become more conservative - the experience of life is that ideals are rarely fully achieved and the importance of looking after yourself and your family grows. That's not to excuse the OP's husband - but it might help understand "why" if not "what to do".

Message edited by author 2009-11-16 08:57:02.
11/16/2009 09:24:02 AM · #23
I get all my information from Stern, and I'm ok with that.
11/16/2009 09:37:34 AM · #24
Cynthiann, my brother in law is the same way. He listens to those guys all day and now he is pissed off all the time. He wakes up angry! It's like an obsession. It got to the point he has begun to cut off family members who had voted democrat.
11/16/2009 09:38:33 AM · #25
Originally posted by dtremain:

Douse me in kerosene and set me on fire. Make no mistake. I think Rush, Glenn, Sean, and others are generally right. Even worse (for evidently most of the posters on this thread), they represent the beliefs of a significant portion of the American population. Why else would so many people tune into their programs day after day? They validate the beliefs of their listeners at a time when those beliefs are under deliberate, relentless, and fierce attack by the very ones who claim to be so open minded and tolerant of others.
When you have the entire chorus of TV, cable, internet, newspaper, magazine, and other media blindly pushing the big government, infinite funding available, government control over personal health care, eating habits, energy use - even at the expense of the US constitution, why is it considered demented, stupid, intellectually challenged, hateful, bigoted, racist, and every other negative label that can be conceived; to say, hey, wait a minute. Let's think through the consequences of doing some of these things.
I think the Universal Health Care is an excellent example. My personal belief is that the health care issue was the primary (potentially the sole) reason for the Democrats' losses in 1994. Every time this issue has been brought up, the American people rise up and say they do NOT want it - in pretty emphatic terms. Yet, the Democrats keep insisting on pushing it on the American people they are supposed to represent. Doesn't it make sense to ask why?
cynthiann - if you're willing to take advice from a complete idiot, try listening to Rush for the full three hours, every day for three weeks. Rather than think of him as an evil man, or a hate monger, or whatever prejudicial labels he's been given in your circle of friends, try to think of him as a mirror of public sentiment, and a person who believes passionately in what he says.
If the only thing you gain is an understanding of why he would appeal to your husband, you'll be much further ahead in your domestic situation.
BTW - in an attempt to shorten the flaming - I have no intent to insult, challenge, or call out any individual or group. This post is certainly not meant to question or attack anyone personally.


Get out two matches, I agree with you 100%!
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