Advice sought on portrait technique

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8

03/25/2004 05:53:24 AM · #1

Since my submission for the portrait challenge was well and truly sunk without trace...I thought that I should ask for some advice on where I went wrong.
Firstly I submitted this..

Then I started playing around with some of the other images from the shoot and this one in particular which was underexposed..

After a few adjustments I came up with this image which I thought had far more character to it and was a little less conventional than my original submission...

I was aware that it had properties that some people would not care for such as the deliberate overexposure but I did think it had more going for it than just scraping into the 4 bracket.
I really would appreciate some help on where I went wrong (outside of exposure)as it`s a field of photography that is new to me and that I am keen to improve on.
Thanks in advance,
Gordon

pcody

Canon PowerShot G6

03/25/2004 06:07:45 AM · #2

I like the top one best. Except for the cheek being too close to the edge, it shows a light intimate moment between mom and daughter. Maybe pull back a little and let them have a little room around them. You can always crop later if you feel like it. I like the catchlights and how the hair colors are different and their expressions and their closeness.
To me, the bottom one is too dark with an abrupt transition between light and dark which adds a menancing aspect to the photo. It's my least favorite of the series.

inspzil

Olympus E-510

Sigma 50-500mm f/4.0-6.3 EX APO RF HSM for Olympus

03/25/2004 06:14:37 AM · #3

GY - There are a couple things that I see that raise a couple of questions / concerns. I do not like this image greyscaled at all. The ladies' lips blend right into their faces. When I greyscale something, usually there is something I am trying to accomplish with it, mood being the prevalent factor. If they were not smiling, I would venture to say that they look a little ill. I think the crop is a little tighter than I would have left it, but I don't think that was a huge factor. I think the part of this image that really turns me off to it is however the superoverexposure as it really blows out a lot of the shadows and contours of the faces that give them character and emotion. Adding grain on a B&W photo is something I also like to do, but usually on a photo that's more underexposed than overexposed. There seems to be very little in the grey area... it seems its black or its white on this one.

Well that's what I think, for better or worse. As always, consider the source.

Bob

KevinRiggs

Canon EOS-1Ds

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

03/25/2004 07:06:29 AM · #4

Gordon,

They're all fairly clear captures of the two individuals' faces and I definitely like the lighting from the side the way you captured it. For my tastes, though, I feel like the 3rd is more of an artistic rendition. It is more about how the photog saw the individuals and how he chose to present them instead of a straightforward portrait. Its still a portrait but IMO you've injected your own "flavor" into the shot and from my standpoint if this challenge had been more "take an artistic view of an everyday picture" kind of challenge then I'd have voted that submission much higher. Since the instructions mentioned "traditional" I tended to weigh those a little heavier.
I feel that all 3 photos have too tight a crop to them but the first two look like they capture something about the subjects that can be shared between people who know them and people who just see them for the first time in this photo. The 1st is exposed well for the rightmost subject and I like this expression on both of them best in this photo (it seems more naturally happy and genuine). The 2nd shot is a much better exposure on the leftmost subject but the subject on the right loses some definition in areas that seem almost blown out. The 2nd also has quite a bit of noise in the shadows between the two.
I guess my main hangup with the submission (3rd photo) is that it "feels" like its more an artistic expression of you than a portrait capture of your subjects. Nothing wrong with that just not my taste for a portrait.
BTW, they both seemed good subjects with interesting facial details; hope you can use them again.

Kev

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

03/25/2004 08:56:30 AM · #5

Thanks to all for the comments,
What`s coming across to me is that the style I adopted did not figure with people the way it did with me.
The cropping was due to the limitations of the set-up..... No studio..no lighting.
They were taken in the only place I could get good natural light, which was in the bedroom, sitting on the end of the bed (If you look closely, you will see a part of the bedpost in one shot.
The style I tried to capture was popular in the late sixties and used quite extensively in magazines and on album covers..Hard days night (Beatles) is one that springs to mind.
I guess I`ll need to wrench myself into the 21st century.

Thanks again to all.
Gordon

KevinRiggs

Canon EOS-1Ds

03/25/2004 09:14:15 AM · #6

Gordon,

I don't think you need to change. I just think its important to see your challenge submission as a more artistic view rather than a more literal view. Neither has to be better. You produced the effects for your interpretation quite well (although it seems like you might want more of a duotone effect if I'm thinking of the same type of photography as you). I think you got a great representation of what you were shooting for; just may not have been how most people interpreted the portraits challenge. Hey, at least now you have this style to add to your repetoire.

Kev

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

03/25/2004 09:42:59 AM · #7

Thanks Kevin,
I appreciate the kind words. I have a feeling that maybe I didn`t recreate the style I had in mind in quite the way I should have.It`s not quite duotone but very nearly...I can`t quite remember what it was called... "high key" comes to mind, but maybe I`m way off track.
There were a few unconventional exposures in the challenge and most did very much better than mine..so I have the feeling that the problem goes deeper than just the style..but I`ll keep plugging away until I get it right.

Many thanks,
Gordon

KevinRiggs

Canon EOS-1Ds

03/25/2004 12:56:58 PM · #8

Gordon,

For a high-key shot you normally have most of the contents of the frame closer to white so that there is little to no definition in those areas. Alternately a low-key shot tends to have the majority of its area in darker tones. I opted for referring to your shot as duotone more because it seemed that you had an almost Andy Warhol type effect but that neither the light nor the dark dominated the other in the photo. I would eventually like to monkey around with the format you seemed to be working in for that shot as it seems more an artistic expression and I'd like to someday feel confident enough about my basic work to devote more time to playing with my own expression of the shots I take.

my attempt at a high-key shot

Kev

03/25/2004 01:51:55 PM · #9

Kevin, I really appreciate your input here and it`s helping me understand some of the terminology. I`ve looked at your high key shot (Excellent)but obviously not what I was trying to achieve...so I guess I was using the wrong term.
Don`t know if you`ve seen any of the sixties stuff I`m referring to like the front cover of "hard day`s night" all very contrasty but not to the extent where it looks like a drawing.I got the effect by raising the highlights until a lot of features were begining to whiten out and then darkening the shadows.
It`s all good fun but I think I`ll be keeping my experimental stuff out of the challenges from now on.
Hope you have lots of success with yours.

Gordon

dsmil

Olympus E-510

03/25/2004 02:01:40 PM · #10

A great portrait has 10% to do with the lighting and 90% to do with the subjects soul and character. You captured the outside of someone not their inside, thats why these are snapshots and not portraits.

Find out about their personalities and reflect that in your work.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4L USM

03/25/2004 02:38:18 PM · #11

Originally posted by dsmil:

A bit blunt, but helpful none the less.
Perhaps you could post an example of your portrait work to let me see where I`m going wrong?

Gordon

agwright

Canon EOS-20D

03/25/2004 02:52:22 PM · #12

Hi Gordon

I like the top one best, have to agree with the cheek being too close to the edge, I think a wee bit more contrast would have helped, but in all and all I like it. You can see it's mother and daughter.

Regards Tony